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End of EE on SQ

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End of EE on SQ

Postby EADG » Wed, 09 Apr 2008 12:25 am

I've been busy and not in the forums awile, is there a thread on the end of the EE class on SIA?
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Postby EADG » Thu, 10 Apr 2008 1:28 am

I'm bumping this because I really want to know.

Flying from SIN to EWR 18+ hours is a killer, why would SIA want to shoot themselves in the foot by taking away something that makes them useful to many people like myself?

SIA, you will definitely loose business and give it away to someone else.

The alternative will be that rather than paying now business class to fly the same flight for twice the cost, which was already high, people like me will simply seek other carriers offering the same service, even if we have to fly to BKK or elsewhere to get it.

Surely I'm not the only one here using SIA's EE service?
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Postby Shimure » Thu, 10 Apr 2008 4:19 pm

I think SIA will reconsider this point and rethink their strategy.
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Postby jpatokal » Thu, 10 Apr 2008 7:56 pm

EADG wrote:Flying from SIN to EWR 18+ hours is a killer, why would SIA want to shoot themselves in the foot by taking away something that makes them useful to many people like myself?

Because they can earn more money by using that space for business class seats. The rumor mill says that the A345 was never supposed to have exec eco in the first place, it was installed because the plane didn't perform to spec and could not have done the flight with a full normal eco load.

SIA, you will definitely loose business and give it away to someone else.

If you cannot afford business class, SQ isn't interested in your business.
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Postby EADG » Fri, 11 Apr 2008 1:08 am

Well, I think the b-class passengers always had that and other carriers as an option, and that there's not as many of them as there are EE flyers.

There's a growing market for EE level vs. cattle class, I gladly pay up but naturally b-class is not always practical

I could be wrong but I think it will prove to be a case were greediness will not pay off and other carries are going to benefit.

Guess we'll just have to see how this plays out.

I'm be interested in more info if anyone has it.

[quote="jpatokal]If you cannot afford business class, SQ isn't interested in your business.[/quote]
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Postby jpatokal » Fri, 11 Apr 2008 9:17 pm

EADG wrote:Well, I think the b-class passengers always had that and other carriers as an option, and that there's not as many of them as there are EE flyers.

But SQ is targeting quality over quantity. There are a lot fewer people willing to pony up $20,000 to go from London to Sydney in a first class suite, but the margin on every one who does outdoes 100 plebs on cut-rate GV4 tickets...

There's a growing market for EE level vs. cattle class, I gladly pay up but naturally b-class is not always practical

I, personally, am in the same boat as you. But the A345 has proven to be fairly uneconomic aircraft in an EE configuration, especially in these days of ridiculous fuel prices, and the loads on the ultra-long-haul routes like SIN-EWR or BKK-EWR don't seem to justify using larger aircraft like the 777ER.
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Postby Superglide » Fri, 11 Apr 2008 9:20 pm

www.singaporeair.com

Then click on contact.
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Postby durain » Fri, 11 Apr 2008 10:22 pm

Superglide wrote:www.singaporeair.com

Then click on contact.


no, you have to select your location before the contact. :P

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Postby EADG » Sat, 12 Apr 2008 6:14 pm

yeah, understand the rationale for it, but there's gotta be a market they're going to miss on this

so does anyone know the alternatives to flying Econo or Business for this route, i.e. EE non-stop or one stop?

I am shamelessy posting this in another forum, BTW, but think this would be useful info for a lot of people.
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Postby Superglide » Sun, 13 Apr 2008 1:32 am

So EADG, have you called Singapore air or went down to Paragon and asked?

The share the info here.

Someone has got to be the one doing it, right?
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Postby Strong Eagle » Sun, 13 Apr 2008 6:10 am

EADG wrote:yeah, understand the rationale for it, but there's gotta be a market they're going to miss on this

so does anyone know the alternatives to flying Econo or Business for this route, i.e. EE non-stop or one stop?

I am shamelessy posting this in another forum, BTW, but think this would be useful info for a lot of people.


Here is a list of all premium economy airlines.

http://www.seatguru.com/charts/premium_economy.php

I think EVA Air is one of the best for premium economy. One stop flight in Taipei, then onto EWR.

http://www.evaair.com/html/b2c/english

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Postby EADG » Mon, 14 Apr 2008 7:30 pm

yeah, but not sure what you mean - I know the service ends in June but they don't have the exact date yet

I did say on the '...this call will be recorded for traning and quality assurance...." Reservration Line to pass on our dissapointment that the service would be discontinued, for whatever that's worth

I doubt it will do much good though, a letter would be better, I usually submit feedback online, that should at least get a response

SE - thanks very much, that is just what I was looking for

now I seem to remember you praising EVA a while ago

Superglide wrote:So EADG, have you called Singapore air or went down to Paragon and asked?

The share the info here.

Someone has got to be the one doing it, right?
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Postby Mi Amigo » Tue, 22 Apr 2008 4:38 pm

I wrote to SIA to complain about this.

I wrote:
---------

I am writing to let you know that I was very disappointed to read in the Straits Times on Sunday that you will be converting the non-stop flights to LAX (SQ 38/37) to an all-business class configuration. I use these flights 2-3 times a year and the main reason for flying SQ is that I much prefer the non-stop executive economy service to the standard economy service on your old 747 aircraft. My company's travel rules preclude me from flying in business class, so the executive economy service is ideal for me.
I was also appalled at the way you treated some of your customers who had booked non-stop flights in July and were informed by email that their flights had been changed to 1 stop services with no refund of the fare difference.

Sending an email and not having the courtesy to at least call and apologise in person shows a degree of contempt for those of your paying customers who choose to fly economy class.

Since moving to Singapore nearly four years ago I have used SQ almost exclusively for my air travel. However, this latest example of your high-handedness and disregard for the non-business class, business / frequent flier customer has made me decide to consider alternative carriers in future.

They replied:
---------------

A good day to you from Singapore Airlines and we hope our email finds you well.

We have received your email and are sorry to learn of your disappointment with the conversion of our A340-500 ultra-long range aircraft into an all-Business Class configuration, for daily flights between Los Angeles and Singapore.

The decision to convert our current 2-class seat arrangement with 100 of our Airline’s new award-winning Business Class seats is in response to market demand. There is a demand for our non-stop flights from our Business Class customers and this change will help us cater to this market need.

Informatively, our reservations staff members have been calling passengers booked on the direct flights to and from Los Angeles to assist them with changes. In the event that our staff is unable to reach the passenger concerned, an email will be sent to them to inform them of the schedule change.

Thank you for allowing us this opportunity to correspond with you and to explain the matter.

So I replied:
--------------

Thank you for your email. Whilst I can understand Singapore Airlines' desire to maximise profit in any way possible, this does nothing to help me or what must be a sizeable number of other frequent business travelers who fly economy class with your airline. Now I know where I stand, I will look at using other airlines in future to travel to the USA; indeed to other locations as well.

I would just like to give you my perspective on the wider subject, although frankly I have no expectation that it will make any difference.

Since moving to Singapore nearly four years ago I have flown many hundreds of thousands of miles on SQ, choosing your airline whenever possible in order to build up a profile as a frequent flier and loyal customer. The company I work for operates in a fiercely competitive market and therefore has a policy that its employees must travel in economy class. Therefore, whilst I very quickly obtained KF gold status, the ability to participate in your PPS programme was not open to me. Nevertheless I carried on flying SQ in preference to other carriers in the hope that it would entitle me so some benefits other than access to lounges, some of which, it has to be said, are very mediocre when I’m prohibited from using KrisFlyer lounges. I have had experiences when travelling with my wife and daughter on holiday when I was flatly refused entry into a lounge on the basis that I was only allowed one guest. My polite request for the person to make an exception on just one occasion was flatly turned down, despite my comments about the large number of SQ flights I take, etc. The lack of flexibility that your staff demonstrate causes a lot frustration.

One area where I find a particularly ‘mean’ attitude from SQ compared to other airlines I have used in the past is upgrades. At the outset, I will say that of course no-one should ever feel they have a ‘right’ to an upgrade – this is something that should be left to the staff on the spot to use their judgement appropriately. Before moving to Singapore I lived in the UK and as you can imagine I was a frequent flier with BA. It has to be said that they are not the most generous of airlines when it comes to upgrades, but to give credit where it’s due, I did receive upgrades from them reasonably often. The same was true of Virgin Atlantic. Years ago I lived in the USA and frequently traveled on American Airlines; they were quite generous in this area, as have various other airlines been over the years. With one exception – Singapore Airlines. On SQ I think I’ve only been upgraded on two flights in four years, and in both cases it was only done to avoid having to turn other passengers away.

There have been so many occasions where the sensible thing to do would be to provide an upgrade, but let me give you one example to illustrate. I had boarded a flight to the UK at Changi airport and was squeezed into my economy class seat and surrounded by a family with young children, some of whom were misbehaving and making quite a lot of noise. Now, I would never get upset with the children or their parents – I remember what it was like when my children were young and we flew with them. But it has to be said that the prospect of spending the whole flight with this going on around me was not particularly enthralling. The economy class section was completely full, so I couldn’t move anywhere else. The stewardesses did their very best to help get the children settled down; one of them asked me if there was anything she could do to try to make things more comfortable for me. I looked through to the business class section and saw that it was probably only about 25% full, and suggested that if they moved me into that section I would be more comfortable, and so would the family with the young children, as they would be able to spread out a little. The stewardess laughed at what she obviously thought was meant to be a joke on my part - clearly she had no authority to do this, and presumably didn’t think it worthwhile suggesting it to the purser either. Clearly no-one in the check-in area had thought to do that either when looking at the overall seat assignments. On other airlines I’ve flown, I know that someone would have probably done something. The reason I say this is because a similar thing happened to me on Virgin Atlantic a few years ago – and they did upgrade me. I’ve heard recently that only the captain of the flight can authorise the upgrading a passenger once they are on the plane, something that I find frankly ridiculous – it must be totally demoralising for the cabin crew to know that they have no flexibility or authority in this area.

I could go on and write about the large number of problems I’ve had with your frequent flier department, but I don’t really have the time. In all honesty, the impression I get is one of a slight arrogance on the part of your company, a feeling that you really have no regard whatsoever for the frequent (business) economy class traveler. Please don’t misunderstand me – I am not expecting miracles, but I do think that if you loosened up your policies in this area and gave your most valuable customer-facing people (your cabin crews) the authority to use their judgement and ‘do the right thing’ for their customers (regardless of the type of ticket they held) it would do a lot to overcome a reputation that SQ seems to have for only really caring about business and first class passengers.

I have been meaning to put these thoughts in writing for some time, but haven’t got round to it until now – this email exchange prompted me to widen the discussion, so I’m sorry that you ended up having to read all this! I sincerely hope that you and your colleagues will take these comments in the spirit that they were intended, namely to provide some honest feedback of the perceptions of an ordinary (but up to now, frequent) customer. I remain totally impressed with the hard work, service, patience, dedication and friendliness that your cabin crew consistently demonstrate. But I have to say that after four years of flying SQ, I am sadly very disappointed in the other areas I have mentioned above.

Needless to say, SIA didn't bother to send me a reply to all that lot. I didn't expect to receive one really, but I did feel better after getting all that off my chest :lol:

Well you did ask...

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Postby Mi Amigo » Tue, 22 Apr 2008 4:57 pm

BTW, I think jpatokal hit the nail on the head above when he/she stated "If you cannot afford business class, SQ isn't interested in your business."

Thanks Strong Eagle for the link to airlines with premium economy services - very useful. I was especially intrigued to see that ANA have a service they call 'Premium Economy BJ' - that's what I call extra service :shock: . Sorry, please excuse my vulgarity; couldn't resist it.

I'm sure if SIA were to introduce a premium economy service on their popular routes it would sell well. But I doubt they ever would do that - too much danger of cannibalising the business class revenue.


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