Which British School and When?

[zoro]

We are a family with two young boys (6mo + 4.5y) who may be relocating to Singapore Q1/2008. Our eldest is currently in kindergarten (pre-school) and we would like him to carry on in a similar system - he is in a private school in London at the moment.

Which is the most reputable British school in Singapore - I know there is an other posting on this and I appreciate that it depends hugely on the children's style, I guess ours would thrive in an environment where there is a good ballance between discipline and fun. Also,as both of us will be working, a school where the parents are involved but not in charge would be most suitable for our family.

In terms of timming, is there a chance to have the child join mid year or should we delay our relocation till June 08?

there are SO many questions but if anyone can share some of their experience, we would gratefully receive any thoughts! perhaps our children would even end up as play mates, you never know.

Thanks again.

[rajeshwari rajamani]

Hi! I am relocatng too in Q1/ 2008, with 2 girls- 1.7 and 4.7 yrs. Been for a visit to Singapore in August to check out schools, going to finalise house in December. The United World College is the foremost British system school in Singapore, which I think is following the IB programme. The facilities are good, though not so geared for yournger kids in my opinion. I found the Singapore American School with its separate Early Chilhood Centre has more facilities, and is better geared to little ones. For eg. UWC did not have a separate pool for little ones, nor a separate play area for outdoor play. These however are just my thoughts. I do know UWC is ranked as the best (or No2 at least) school in Singapore. They also (like SAS) have a huge waiting list though. Admission waiting lists for Pre-K or K1 typically run from 6 months to a year. A good idea would be to put in your application (call and work out the details- online or courier), and transfer the application money and they will put you on their waiting list. There are chances that in December when expats leave, there may be places that open up, allowing ur kid to get in. However when u talk to them they will assure you that they possibly cannot accomodate you till mid year 2008, and dont want u to get ur hopes up high! Application fees are 2000+ SGD, so if money is not an object, spread ur risk by applying in at least two schools, but be prepared to kiss the money from one goodbye if ur kid gets accepted in both at around the same time, i.e. before you can withdraw ur application from the second one. Since I need to have my kid in school when I land, I plan to put her in the Overseas Family School to start with. Its close to the CBD, has reasonably good facilities and is one of the few schools promising her a berth in January. As a bonus they dont charge any application (2000 SGD in SAS/ UWC as mentioned above) or deposit fees (7000 SGD for SAS) for Kindergarten. And yes, they have a separate pool area for little kids, plus 2 outdoor play areas. Joining mid year is no problem (provided seats are available in the required grade), as Singapore is used to expats arriving, and leaving typically in December. Best nof luck with the planned move.

[road.not.taken]

SAS does not follow British curriculum though. If this is a priority, then SAS should be taken off the list. Some families choose to send the working spouse ahead, while the family remians at home until school a place at school opens up, this might be an option for the original poster. It's better to start at the beginning of the school year, but not necessary.

Of course you want your children at the best school you can afford, but I think you'd be fine at any of the British-based schools as long as you like the facilities and teaching styles.

[jockney]

from our short experience...OFS is a good school.
I hate to repeat myself, but if it helps..
Our son goes to OFS and loves it and they follow the IB programme.
Whether he is lucky or not I dont know, but the teachers he has are pro-active and not reactive.
The education is far higher and more testing than if he were in the same year in Scotland.
OFS has great facilities.
I have been to SAS to watch him play soccer for OFS and the guards on the gate with guns is not too impressive!!
I have been to Tanglin and was not impressed at all and if you want British school...there's one for you!
We were told to get our son to UWC as he is a talented soccer player and they were the school for talented people...he made his own decision and from what we have seen UWC does not have facilities to aid his talents any more than any other school.
OFS has given our son;
1) a chance to open his mind and mix with international friends
2) a very good education
3) an environment where HE FEELS COMFORTABLE
4) competition for school teams ( dont have in Scotland at his age)

Down side of OFS...
Lots of after school activities so it can be expensive
I did read on this board someone complaining of a lot of stairs , but no more than all the condos where they live!
The main issues have to be the children being comfortable and their education??

[road.not.taken]

I have been to SAS to watch him play soccer for OFS and the guards on the gate with guns is not too impressive!!

Jockney, care to clarify this? How were the guards not impressive?

[jockney]

No problem..
At OFS they have a system where all parents have identity passes and you can not get in the gate with out one...as I have experienced
Having Guards on a school gate or patrolling the grounds with weapons of any description is just so unhealthy for childrens minds??
Tanglin has the same!
We come from a 'rough' part of Scotland and we have no need for armed guards and to be in a fairly safe place like Singapore and feel the need to have armed guards.....smells of big insecurity to me....something(insecurity) we should be steering our children away from?
If our kids need to feel secure with weapons..I believe we are going in the wrong direction and my opinion is Tanglin and SAS are reacting in a way a government far away from them wants them to react?
These are my opinions and you and others may like your kids going to a school with armed guards on the gate and patrolling the grounds....we all have our own ideas of security eh?

[road.not.taken]

No problem..
At OFS they have a system where all parents have identity passes and you can not get in the gate with out one...as I have experienced
Having Guards on a school gate or patrolling the grounds with weapons of any description is just so unhealthy for childrens minds??
Tanglin has the same!
We come from a 'rough' part of Scotland and we have no need for armed guards and to be in a fairly safe place like Singapore and feel the need to have armed guards.....smells of big insecurity to me....something(insecurity) we should be steering our children away from?
If our kids need to feel secure with weapons..I believe we are going in the wrong direction and my opinion is Tanglin and SAS are reacting in a way a government far away from them wants them to react?
These are my opinions and you and others may like your kids going to a school with armed guards on the gate and patrolling the grounds....we all have our own ideas of security eh?

Let me start by saying the guards certainly are not there to impress you.

The mandate for the Gurkha contingent came from the Singaporean government after the terrorist cell and plot was discovered in December 2001, not the other way around. This big insecurity you speak of (and I believe a misnomer) is therefore the Singapore government's -- not British or American. Since the Singapore government realizes how desperately they need to encourage expatriates to settle in Singapore from both these places, they took the appropriate steps, in my opinion to at least perpetuate a semblance of security.


I would like my kids to attend the school the suits them the best, where the facilities support the curriculum and where they will be best prepared for a university education. If the security at school teaches them that America's and Britain's politics have made them unpopular, well then, that's a good lesson learned. Hopefully the presence of the guards will steer the children away from aggression as a political strategy and towards a peaceful resolution.

[jockney]

I think you have taken the 'impress me ' statement out of context. I dont need impressing and if I did, a gun would not do it for me sorry
My son asked ' why have they got armed guards?'...perfectly normal question from a secure wee boy one would think? I could not give him a logical answer..as not all schools have armed guards.
Something that happened in 2001 and we are still scared about wont fit the bill. We can all have security, but do we need to go overboard and use weapons?
Why would the Singapore government only feel it right to protect the British and American schools then??
The insecurity I speak of is a fact and people are far more insecure today than they have been for years.
I have an opinion that GUNS BREED AND STEM FROM INSECURITY and really serve no purpose in society. This is my opinion and I am allowed to have it.
I also respect your opinion and have learnt I dont need to agree with everyone.
I dont like to see them anywhere, let alone in a school.
Maybe in America it is 'normal' , but we are not used to it in Scotland and I would hate to think of it as 'NORM' for us.
Children manage to get to university from most schools in Scotland and the experience here at OFS is the education is higher, so if our son chooses of his own free will he wants to go to university, then hopefully he will be ok.
I am glad you chose a school that will help your children and hope all works out for them.
We were lucky that our son chose his own school from his own feelings with only small input from us and upto now he is ok and very happy and learning a lot more than he was used to and has a host of international friends which has really opened his mind a lot more.
We really could not ask for much more...although having played myself on the SAS soccer field..I would like OFS to have the same, but it is not a major concern only a personal thing!

[road.not.taken]

Jockney your view of world politics doesn't seem to allow for institutional memory or perhaps is too Scot-cenetric. I think we are too far apart on this point, so I'll move off it. Of course you are allowed your opinion, absolutely. It is a bit frustrating though, when it seems to be based on some misconceptions -- but as I said, you seem entrenched and it is not my inclination to try to explain further. I'm glad your son is in a school tha suits him, that's all that counts, right?

The original poster wants a British based system and SAS follows an American curriculum, so gurkhas or not, it's the wrong choice.

[cbavasi]

I went to visit UWC and it is not a British based curriculum - it is the International Baccalaureate - but this really should not be an issue until the children are teens and are preparing for university. A true British curriculum would be more along the lines of Tanglin Trust and Chatsworth. My son is 3.5 and I was told he was 211th on the waiting list at UWC with a proposed start date of 2014. This is subject to change of course but based on the addition of 1 new class per year and 24 students per class. You can put your children on as many waiting lists as you like (and pay the deposit) and recieve the money back (minus a couple hundred for admin fees) as long as they are not offered a place and you don't accept. With Tanglin we were told he'd have a place for 2009. In light of everything we'd heard and all the urban legends - neither UWC nor Tanglin wanted to interview my child, or my husband, or see financials. The waiting lists were not 'closed' as many people had told us - and both readily accepted our checks. If you are concerned with schooling - get on a list now as you can't just rock up and expect a place (as I was foolish enough to believe). (ps - as mentioned earlier - SAS is an American school.)

[zoro]

Thanks everyone - gosh, I didn't mean to start such a heated debate but it's been very useful. Also, thanks for the private messages received - apparently I can't answer directly as I am too new to the site....

It's a tough decision as we are in the VERY early stages of the move - I haven't even got an official offer but it's apparently "all in the making"... This makes me reluctant to fork out the registration fees for any of the schools.

The idea of guns in Singapore of all places dissapoints me a little but SAS indeed is not on our list because of the curriculum as we intend to go back to Europe / UK at some point.

I have done some homework and, with the help from the posters here, I think we're between Tanglin and Chatsworth. I like the idea of being in one school from 3 to 18 (even if as an expat there is little chance of that happening) the current school our son is in opperates on the same system so perhaps he will find the transition easier.

Does anyone know how are the facilities at Chatsworth in Orchard?

Also - do the school buses pick up/ drop off within an area or how does it work? Some of our friends - who have smaller children than us so they are no "use" - live in the East and was wondering where do we draw the line in terms of "living too far from the school"

Thanks
O

[jockney]

zorro,
Chatsworth facilities are ok and just that I seem to remember. Small I think , but ok.
We initially looked at chatsworth and filled in an application form, but our son did not feel comfortable and chose another school much to the annoyance of Chatsworth who then became only interested in charging my company the deposit!! their attitude totally changed(not the teaching staff) and they were not impressed that a child should be able to opt for the school he liked!
Saying that the teaching staff seemed ok and they had loads of after school activities, but not even the after school 'Darts Class' could tempt our wee boy.
I believe they use companies that run buses door to door also.
Hope they enjoy whatever school they choose

[cbavasi]

You'll have no problem with the bus system - though the further you live out the earlier your little one will be picked up. I looked at the Chatworth on Orchard Campus and I really found the campus to be a bit small since it's bang in the center of town. I also didn't like the idea of the little ones (6 and under) being so exposed to the 'big' school. I went on a day where all the classes were out in the 'yard' and it seemed very manic (but again, i think it may have been the day/time i went). It wasn't until I visited other schools that I realized the facilities were a bit dated and small. With that said, we have friends who send their kids there (4 & 6) and are very pleased.

[road.not.taken]

Zoro,

Here's my unvarnished opinion -- I'm sure there are those who won't like it, but here it is: between Chatsworth and Tanglin, Tanglin is the better school. Better facilities, and though it's had its shake ups -- it still has better faculty and administration compared to Chatsworth. It seem unlikely Chatsworth will stay where it is, Emerald Hill is just too pricey a location for a school, so a move in the near future is likely. The facilites reflect this. Why improve them if they are not there for the 'long haul'? Chatsworth also has an unofficial reputation as the last ditch dumping ground for kids that have washed out of other schools. Because it is downtown, getting to it in a car can be almost impossible if it's raining, or near rush hour, etc.. Getting a cab will be tough too.

My best guess is that Tanglin will stay put -- for a while anyway. I think most of the construction on Portsdown Rd is done too. A big plus.

School bus systems work like clock work generally, are charged directly to the parents in most cases and provide door-to-door service. To disagree with cbavasi -- it is not a straight forward formula for distance from school to length of bus ride. If you are interested in a place to live, call the bus company from school and find out what the current bus ride is like. Sometimes a single bus from a condo will fill-up and go straight to school, and a student living in a house much closer will have a longer ride because the bus makes many stops, or they are on surface roads, not highway. Call the bus company and find out, the situation can change but at least you'll have a general idea.

Hope this helps, its a lot of decision making but you'll get through it, we all did!

[mum is maid]

For your information, Chatsworth has recently signed a 10 year lease on the Emerald Hill Site and will, therefore, be in this location for the foreseeable future.

The site is a "heritage" colonial building and cannot be extended or modernised externally. However, over the summer the school has undergone some major internal renovation. The school equipment is of high standard. It is missing large open grounds for sports activity, but rents sports facilities when required.

Chatsworth currently follows a mix of British and American curriculum. Children take IGCSEs at 16. In high school they can opt for the IB Diploma or High School Diploma. In the primary years they are moving towards the IB PYP.

The school is not deemed a terrorist target by the Singapore government, so you will not find armed security guards at the security gate.

We enrolled our child at Chatsworth mid term in K2 and we are extremely happy with the school, its teaching standards, its moral code and its policies. Our child is very happy attending this school.