renting a place? be careful!!!!

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sugercan
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renting a place? be careful!!!!

Post by sugercan » Wed, 29 Aug 2007 11:28 pm

I can’t help but to share my horror experience with u all, if u r looking for a place to rent, be warned!
We have been renting a 2 bed room condo unit in Le Hill, pasir panjiang, for 7 years, moved out a month ago, and the landlady has been trying her best to make it a miserable experience.
What to say, basically, she demanded a new flat to be returned…after 7 years!! We had to redo the timber flooring which is in perfect condition considering 7 years of usage, fix the cabinet under the sink which we never used, give her new set of curtains cos hers were already in threads (becos they were there years ago!), new toilet seats blah blah…
After all these were done, guess what, not only she still retained our deposit, she demanded a few more thousand dollars! The costs of repainting the apartment, servicing the air-con and other nonsense were forced upon us!
We checked the contract, there is a few hundred dollars included in the rent to cover the repair and service charges, and talk about service, there has been none! we don’t even have cable tv, and when water heater was broken, we had to install one ourselves!
This final episode we had felt almost insulting, we will see it through even if legal actions are needed.
So people, be careful when renting!!

Singapore Property Search

 

huggybear
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Post by huggybear » Thu, 30 Aug 2007 7:15 am

So i guess the moral of the story (and from the many other people who seem to have the same experience) is to withhold the last rent payment?

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Re: renting a place? be careful!!!!

Post by hagar » Thu, 30 Aug 2007 9:32 am

sugercan wrote:So people, be careful when renting!!
Agree this is good advice. Have your contracts checked first by someone other than your agent. We have rented 4 places in Singapore 2 condo's and 2 SD's with two children and each time have had our full deposit refunded. But we have also heard of many cases such as the above where the landlord takes advantage of the current tennant and forces them to prepare the property for re rental so he can simply put it back on the market without any work or expense of his own.

The rental contract should always allow for normal wear and tear and this needs to be stressed from the start.

Cheers

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Post by audiojunky » Thu, 30 Aug 2007 11:08 am

This is simply a case of exploitation. The contract should clearly state that normal wear and tear is acceptable. Even if it doesn't explicitly say it, you cannot possibly go to a court room and say... he needs to buy me a new air-con because it is not new ... after 7 years!!!

This is simply a case of harassment and bullying. If you haven't already done so, don't pay for anything additional and don't repair anything else. Demand that you get your security deposit is returned and give a notice period of like 30 days to pay or you'll take legal action. Hopefully this will scare the greedy stupid landlady.

After moving to Singapore and reading all these horror stories, I realized how lucky we are to have got a gem of a land lady, who insists on paying for even the smallest of issues we have with our condo - says, it's her duty.

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Post by Jelly Bean » Thu, 30 Aug 2007 11:50 am

Hi, it seems that there are alot of holes in the contract which do not protect the tenant other than the diplomatic clause as what I see.

Does the LL usually agree to let the tenant adds in statement like repairing, maintenance, minor wear and tear, etc? Any guideline or checklist we, the new arrival could refer to in order to protect ourselves before we sign the tenancy agreement?

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Post by Superglide » Thu, 30 Aug 2007 12:20 pm

huggybear wrote:So i guess the moral of the story (and from the many other people who seem to have the same experience) is to withhold the last rent payment?
Agree huggy,

Always withhold the last month rent or more if you had to pay a higher deposit.

They can scream and shout whatever they like, my ass.

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Post by eurobill » Wed, 12 Sep 2007 4:39 pm

Let's say that the security deposit is 2 month rental.
Is it actually allowed NOT to pay the rental for the last two month?

Isn't it in the agreement that tenant should pay the rental every month and then get the deposit back?

What I mean is that if you don't pay the last two month of rental, doesn't the landlord has the right to evict you?

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Post by Superglide » Wed, 12 Sep 2007 5:09 pm

Sure.

So the alternative is that you stick to the rules, but the LL doesn't and you can forget about your deposit, since the LL has some insane reason for not returning it.

And that happens more often than not.

We have a 2 year lease and I told the LL already I will keep the last 2 months' rent, so he doesnot need to give me back my deposit.

He ignored me saying so, but will see.

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Post by margt » Wed, 12 Sep 2007 5:23 pm

I am singing my tenancy agreement today and it states the following re wear and tear:

To keep the interior of the said premises including the sanitary and water apparatus and the furniture and the doors and windows thereof in good and tenantable repair and condition throughout this tenancy (fair wear and tear and damage by any act beyond the control of the tenant excepted).


To yield up the said premises at the expiration or sooner determination of this tenancy in such good and tenantable repair and condition (fair wear and tear excepted) as shall be in accordance with the conditions, covenants and stipulations herein contained and with all locks keys and the furniture.

Does this suffice?

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Post by eurobill » Wed, 12 Sep 2007 5:30 pm

Superglide, I guess once the lease run out, the "relationship" often gets sour. Especially the wear and tear thingy.

I am moving to Singapore now, so I got a big problem ahead. The property agents and the landlords. It's like swimming with sharks and piranahs and alligators.

Keep us posted.

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Post by Em Eye » Thu, 13 Sep 2007 12:52 am

I just moved into a new apartment and took a lot of digital photos when the LL agent was there. I sent a copy to my agent and the LL agent so in 2 years if there is any problems we can review the photos.

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Post by Laemon » Thu, 04 Oct 2007 3:58 am

Wow, so this problem is just common in Singapore :o . Think maybe its just their trick to earn more money.

I just moved into new apartment also and this time both LL agent and me took photos and exchange via our email addresses.

Have a very bad experience with previous apartments's LL agent, who brought so call her boyfriend who act like ah beng :o to help her did final checking for the whole house and create problem for us, just because they want to cut and hold our deposit. What I mean is, if you want the money just say it -don't be so petty-, if the money is yours, you will get it but don't create unnecesarry problem to make sour ending.

Normal wear and tear is not acceptable, and we ended up to pay for the marble polishing/restoration, engage so call proffesional cleaner to re-clean the whole house as according to them the house condition is not the same as 4 years ago when they handed over to us (still remember all the cabinet full of cat's fur :shock: eventhough beforehand we already asked, was the previous tenant has any pet with them and the answer was: NO, but wonder where was those cat fur came from, even in the washing machine & kitchen cabinet also have!), plus some dry-cleaning service which must be borned by me. P.S. confirmed by LL agent beforehand that not all of above services will have receipt (HAAA!)

This agent is terribly calculative, she even count how many battery & bulbs provided for you (cost less than 1 dollar and make a big hoo haa) and you must return the same, or you pay for it. Mentioned also that its not their job to buy for us new battery/bulbs to replace the old one even though we pay for it. Wonder what I pay the agency fee for, if nothing can be done by them.

Suggestion, always take photos when you take over the house.

People says, it doesn't pay to be kind, but reality says I have to pay to be kind, until now the LL agent still hold my deposit even though the owner of the house already transfer the money to them.

Honestly, I think the owner also not aware of this.

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Post by juliana_fr » Sun, 21 Oct 2007 10:55 pm

hi,

wear and tear in singapore term is turns old.....marble flooring yes u hv too cos u fail to maintain......dirty wall....not need to paint, holes on the walls...u hv to seal it.. new furnitures does not wear n tear in two years....but miss used it but it boil down to yr connection with the LL

Laemon wrote:Wow, so this problem is just common in Singapore :o . Think maybe its just their trick to earn more money.

I just moved into new apartment also and this time both LL agent and me took photos and exchange via our email addresses.

Have a very bad experience with previous apartments's LL agent, who brought so call her boyfriend who act like ah beng :o to help her did final checking for the whole house and create problem for us, just because they want to cut and hold our deposit. What I mean is, if you want the money just say it -don't be so petty-, if the money is yours, you will get it but don't create unnecesarry problem to make sour ending.

Normal wear and tear is not acceptable, and we ended up to pay for the marble polishing/restoration, engage so call proffesional cleaner to re-clean the whole house as according to them the house condition is not the same as 4 years ago when they handed over to us (still remember all the cabinet full of cat's fur :shock: eventhough beforehand we already asked, was the previous tenant has any pet with them and the answer was: NO, but wonder where was those cat fur came from, even in the washing machine & kitchen cabinet also have!), plus some dry-cleaning service which must be borned by me. P.S. confirmed by LL agent beforehand that not all of above services will have receipt (HAAA!)

This agent is terribly calculative, she even count how many battery & bulbs provided for you (cost less than 1 dollar and make a big hoo haa) and you must return the same, or you pay for it. Mentioned also that its not their job to buy for us new battery/bulbs to replace the old one even though we pay for it. Wonder what I pay the agency fee for, if nothing can be done by them.

Suggestion, always take photos when you take over the house.

People says, it doesn't pay to be kind, but reality says I have to pay to be kind, until now the LL agent still hold my deposit even though the owner of the house already transfer the money to them.

Honestly, I think the owner also not aware of this.

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Re: renting a place? be careful!!!!

Post by ksl » Mon, 22 Oct 2007 12:20 am

hagar wrote:
sugercan wrote:So people, be careful when renting!!
Agree this is good advice. Have your contracts checked first by someone other than your agent. We have rented 4 places in Singapore 2 condo's and 2 SD's with two children and each time have had our full deposit refunded. But we have also heard of many cases such as the above where the landlord takes advantage of the current tennant and forces them to prepare the property for re rental so he can simply put it back on the market without any work or expense of his own.

The rental contract should always allow for normal wear and tear and this needs to be stressed from the start.

Cheers
The rental contract should always allow for normal wear and tear and this needs to be stressed from the start.
I wouldn't normally be on the landlords side, but in all fairness, to do it right, It needs to be fair all around, that is why deposits are paid.

But one expects a new redecorated apartment, handed over in the same condition, doesn't matter if you have lived in it 10 or 20 years, the deposit, is to cover the cost of decorating, now normally if you want your deposit back, you have to pay out of your pocket, to get the apartment up to scratch again!

Although one can never trust landlords in Singapore, becuase the tenant laws are none exsistant!

Many housing associations in Scandinavia have decorators, move in when tenants move out, and the cost is deducted from the deposit, although you are allowed to paint it yourself, to how it was when you moved in, and they will return the full deposit...it's all about fairness.

And the problem that landlords do have, are quite large problems, when people show no respect for cleaning, they do a moonlight flit, and leave the place in a stinking and disgusting way, which can cost alot more than the deposit was left.

But we have to see reality in the eyes in Singapore, many Landlords are greedy, cheating, disgusting little creeps, that are out to rob, everyone they can, because they can!

There are no tenant protection laws, so it is clear its a free for all, you should never ever trust a landlord or agent here in Singapore, the odds are you will get your fingers burnt!

Those that target expats, do it for a reason, they can squeeze top $ out of them, because they know the company pay in most circumstance. One must have your wits, about you, before moving in!

But I do not think it would stand up in court, if a landlord, tried to get more out of you, in repairs, than the deposit, that is paid, that is why a deposit is paid after all!

If it cost me 6000$ to decorate before renting out, it would state in the contract that the apartment must be handed over in the same condition, to get the money back, and that also means the quality of workmenship too...Wear & tear isn't the landlords problem, tenants are expected to show respect for the properties and look after them, to minimise the damage....otherwise the damage must be paid for! But only in regards to the deposit paid! If there is wilful damage, that is a different case again!

It is a very simple tenants and landlord agreement, what can be reached, if they wanted too, but the laws are inadequate, and that's were it fails the tenants and favours the landlord.

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