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Local Schools

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SouthKiwi
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Local Schools

Post by SouthKiwi » Sun, 18 Feb 2007 9:39 am

Hi All.

I am looking to put my two Children (4yrs and 7yrs) into a decent local school. We are not looking at private just yet as many people have said that a good local school is as good as private. Also, we want our children to be immersed in Chinese language environment so they can learn to read and write Chinese (they speak Mandarin OK)

Is there a guide to local Schools, either dependant or Government measured ?

As for location – we are not sure yet. Job offer and housing costs will dictate this, albeit, we have preference for East Coast.

Many Thanks

David91
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Post by David91 » Sun, 18 Feb 2007 11:17 am

Your problem, as with any system, is that the better the school, the greater the competition to get in. There are some very good local schools but the average heartland school is less impressive in some ways. You and your children are going to experience culture shock whichever schools you approach. Although there is a new wave of reform going through the primary education system at this moment, it is still heavily dependent on rote-based systems which build knowledge over time. Your 4 year old will potentially go into the kindergarten system. At 7, the first Primary year beckons. The East Coast area is a mature set of estates with well-established schools. You are going to find it difficult to get your older into the best schools as a new arrival. At 7, education is compulsory so you will need to make some provision sooner rather than later. Although the MOE is a bit mechanical, it can offer good advice in these situations.

The other issue is that all teaching in the mainstream primary institutions is done in si/english not mandarin. To be honest, I'm not sure how the mother tongue rules for language training will apply to your 7 year old. Hopefully, others on the forum will be able to offer advice.
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SouthKiwi
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Post by SouthKiwi » Mon, 19 Feb 2007 3:14 pm

Many thanks David91.

I appreciate the feedback – a bit of catch 22. You need to look at entry asap, but don’t know where I will be living yet. This is dependant on job offer – the role I am after has two locations in Singapore – east and west. This is a long shot (as is any application from outside Singapore) so dates will be variable. I may even look at keeping family at home until timing is right to move.

Yep - there will be a culture shock, no doubt about it. My experience is the school move is mitigated by the whole country move. My daughter is fairly well traveled and has been in three classes this past year alone – she’s a battler. We are planning on staying 10 years, so hassle will be worth it in the end.

I would be interested in any other forum readers on Mandarin/English focused schools.

Cheers all

jskogsta
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Post by jskogsta » Sat, 24 Feb 2007 5:51 pm

SouthKiwi wrote:...Yep - there will be a culture shock, no doubt about it. My experience is the school move is mitigated by the whole country move. My daughter is fairly well traveled and has been in three classes this past year alone – she’s a battler. We are planning on staying 10 years, so hassle will be worth it in the end.
I would be interested in any other forum readers on Mandarin/English focused schools.
SouthKiwi; I would much appreciate keeping us updated. Reason is that we're sort of thinking of doing the same. Every indication is that local schools are good. However we're sort of wondering how expats kids would fit in. We have a 4.5 and a 2.5 year old, so it would probably work out ok since they're starting from scratch virtually.

We're thinking of moving down Oct-Jan timeframe this year.. simply beacuse we're going on a 2.5 months hols in Europe... but need to start thinking of our options here..

Would be very interested in your story!

/Jorgen

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Post by jumping_gene » Thu, 01 Mar 2007 6:48 pm

hi jorgen and south kiwi,

would also be interested in exchanging notes with you, if you don't mind. we'll most likely be in Singapore in june/july, and if we could secure places, we'd like to enrol our 4 year old (5 in sept) at a local pre-school, possibly already in august (as i understand the 3rd quarter starts then).

since we're planning to enrol him in a local primary school later on, we figured a local pre-school would better prepare him. right now, he's in kindergarten, but it's not structured-- no formal lessons-- so he's totally unprepared for first grade in a Singapore school.

i found this link useful in locating childcare centers (especially useful if you already have a fair idea where you''ll get an apartment:

http://www.childcarelink.gov.sg/ccls/ho ... ccSrch.jsp

right now, we're considering learning vision (learningvision.com). we figured if they were chosen to provide childcare for the children of the staff of MOE and the top universities, it can't be so bad. the fees are also reasonable.

David91
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Post by David91 » Thu, 01 Mar 2007 8:17 pm

Just to give you the official version, children under the age of seven go into the education system on a voluntary basis. Here is an overview of the kindergarten system http://www.moe.gov.sg/preschooleducation/. Six years of compulsory education starts at seven through the Primary system. This is an outline of the curriculum http://www.moe.gov.sg/corporate/eduover ... iculum.htm

Over the years I have met quite a lot of ex-pat children in the public education system from Primary 1 upwards. The majority have needed remedial help over the first years. Recognise that, for example, your children are probably going to have to learn a local language from scratch (Malay is the easiest of the three—Mandarin is the most difficult but the most useful). The maths and science may also represent a challenge. You are almost certainly going to have to use the local private tuition system (which is a major industry here) to get them up to speed quickly. This will add to the expense of the move and the cost should be factored into your budget. However, the major adjustment is going to be to Singlish. You will need to immerse your children in the local culture so that they will attune their ears to the way in which people speak. The most damaging thing you can do is to keep your children insulated from routine contact with local people. Unless and until your children learn how to fit in and understand the way things work here, their education will suffer. This means that you should not be protective and live behind the walls of a condo. At every possible turn, you should encourage your children to mix with as wide a range of local people as possible in all social settings. As parents, you will need to be very supportive and follow a similar learning curve so that you can help and advise your children as they adjust. But I offer one word of warning. Considerable deference is shown to teachers here by both children and their parents. At all times, you should be patient and calm when dealing with the schools. No matter what degree of frustration you may feel, loss of temper is to be avoided.
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SouthKiwi
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Post by SouthKiwi » Fri, 02 Mar 2007 12:00 pm

Just to expand upon your point above, ref patience towards schools and teachers.

In the 12 yrs I’ve lived in HK and Taiwan – I have never heard of an instance of rudeness shown towards teachers. Their status is that of absolute respect eg. even if you meet them out of school, the student and parenets are very respectful . . . I susepct Singapore is same ?.

This is poles apart from Weston culture where, unfortunately, teachers are treated with little or no respect at all.

This applies to parents as much as students.

David91
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Post by David91 » Fri, 02 Mar 2007 2:09 pm

"Their status is that of absolute respect eg. even if you meet them out of school, the student and parenets are very respectful . . . I suspect Singapore is same?"

I am aware of one or two instances where Heads of Department and, in one case, a Principal called in the police when parents became confrontational. In the latter case, the parent in question was sent to jail and lost custody of the child. Although these cases are the exception rather than the rule, Singapore is definitely not a place in which you should lose your temper (and, believe me, there is quite a lot that you may find extremely provocative, but it really does not pay to get angry here).
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jumping_gene
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Post by jumping_gene » Fri, 02 Mar 2007 4:20 pm

thanks for those insights david. really helpful, makes me a bit apprehensive, but reinforces our notion to enrol our son into a local pre-school. i don't expect us having problems on the social aspect, as we fully intend to adapt as much as we can into the local lifestyle. our preference to look for an HDB flat also fits into this. i should also perhaps mention at this point that we are a eurasian family, hence the standards and style of education in Singapore is not entirely foreign to us. to our son, however, it will be a major adjustment.

re: respect to teachers. yes, we thought about that. teachers here in germany are also respected and highly regarded, but are not revered or put on a pedestal like is common in many asian countries. i reckon my son will likely run into problems in Singapore, especially in the beginning, not because he is disrespectful of authority, but he grew up in an environment where children are encouraged to voice their opinions, think critically, and argue their points. at age four, my son has a knack of getting into debates, questioning the logic of rules instead of following by rote, which sometimes frustrates even us.

i am confident that given time, he will learn to curb this (although i hope he doesn't lose it entirely), but i also hope that we find a local school where teachers are patient and flexible enough to give him the time and chance he needs to adjust.

do you think there's hope finding such a school?

David91
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Post by David91 » Fri, 02 Mar 2007 5:22 pm

"apprehensive"? That might be a little too strong. There is a certain authoritarianism here and it pays to be cautious until you learn your way around. I'm glad that you are looking at the HDB market. It is seriously good value in both monetary and cultural terms.

The public schools are beginning to adopt a more open approach to education, but the overall process is still primarily teacher-driven with a very strong emphasis on testing. This is the time when you have to trust the system. If you do finally decide on the East Coast, this has a reasonable number of more mature estates with better established public facilities (and better known reputations). Ask around for the best preschools/kindergartens (if you are using agents to find somewhere to live, pump them for all the information you can get). When you finalise a shortlist of potential places, discuss your hopes and fears with the preschools in the area. Be completely open about your son's desire to engage teachers in debate and ask for patience. Adjustments can be made on both sides until he learns how to fit in. Go with whichever Principal makes the most accommodating noises.

It is too easy to worry about these things. Children are adaptive and, with gentle help, usually copy the behaviour around them. But, preschool facilities in the heartlands are more parochial than the formal school system and you should be prepared for insensitivity from some of the teachers. Sadly, Singaporeans are not really familiar with the idea of empathy.
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