Rents increased 30% in the last week??

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thelostfish
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Post by thelostfish » Mon, 26 Mar 2007 10:53 am

ScoobyDoes wrote:My colleague is moving out of his apartment in Maplewoods because his landlord is attempting to raise his rent from S$2,800+Management to a whopping S$5,800+

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i guess there will always be such cases when a market is in a frenzy. as i dont know how big your friend's place is, i cant really say, but S$5800 can get you a really nice 3 bedroom with fanstastic view of about 1400sqfr on sentosa i believe.

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BDIAS
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Post by BDIAS » Mon, 26 Mar 2007 12:04 pm

I just signed my lease over at Gardenvista and had looked at Maplewoods as well. That number seems kind of high for Maplewoods, since it is an older complex. I think he could move across the street or next door and save at least 1K per month.

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Post by Grim Reaper » Mon, 26 Mar 2007 2:50 pm

thelostfish wrote:
ScoobyDoes wrote:My colleague is moving out of his apartment in Maplewoods because his landlord is attempting to raise his rent from S$2,800+Management to a whopping S$5,800+

.
i guess there will always be such cases when a market is in a frenzy. as i dont know how big your friend's place is, i cant really say, but S$5800 can get you a really nice 3 bedroom with fanstastic view of about 1400sqfr on sentosa i believe.
lost fish,

just wondering: How much would you rate the rental for a one story freestanding bungalow, renovated, 3 bedrooms, 2200sqft living area, on a 4400 sqft property, location Siglap / Frankel estate?
Time will come....

humpbackwhale
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Post by humpbackwhale » Mon, 26 Mar 2007 7:45 pm

Hi lostfish,

i did some research on my own after talking to one of my analyst (fin/real estate) friend who is very high paid, he told me that many (those mega ultra rich - 9 zeros above) people believe Singapore will soon (a few years) become the Monaco of the East, and then surpass it (because of strong political, financial, business and trading position).

These people are very sophisticated (smart and well informed) and they invest all over the world.

So i google the prices of Monaco and top investment cities of the world (favoured by these people), i found out that Monaco's AVERAGE prime real estate is about S$4980 per sq ft, while Singapores current average prime is only about $1500-2000. Thus Singapore property is considered cheap for these people.

It is so conincidental that on Sunday's paper, it featured a property agent meeting 2 billionaires in the past week for the very first time, so it shows these people are coming. It seems they are only the first wave and more will follow, so they will push the rent up for the next 3 years

thelostfish
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Post by thelostfish » Tue, 27 Mar 2007 2:28 pm

Grim Reaper wrote:
thelostfish wrote:
ScoobyDoes wrote:My colleague is moving out of his apartment in Maplewoods because his landlord is attempting to raise his rent from S$2,800+Management to a whopping S$5,800+

.
i guess there will always be such cases when a market is in a frenzy. as i dont know how big your friend's place is, i cant really say, but S$5800 can get you a really nice 3 bedroom with fanstastic view of about 1400sqfr on sentosa i believe.
lost fish,

just wondering: How much would you rate the rental for a one story freestanding bungalow, renovated, 3 bedrooms, 2200sqft living area, on a 4400 sqft property, location Siglap / Frankel estate?
hmm, assuming its not near the main roads and resonable condition as you say, i will think you be looking at around $3500. if the place is done up nicely and in a nice location within frankel estate, it might be more.

rentals for such bungalows seems to lack the pace of increases in the market now since many expats prefer convenient locations and condominiums with facilities. but i think given a few months or a year, you see them rising too.

thelostfish
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Post by thelostfish » Tue, 27 Mar 2007 2:35 pm

humpbackwhale wrote:
So i google the prices of Monaco and top investment cities of the world (favoured by these people), i found out that Monaco's AVERAGE prime real estate is about S$4980 per sq ft, while Singapores current average prime is only about $1500-2000. Thus Singapore property is considered cheap for these people.

It is so conincidental that on Sunday's paper, it featured a property agent meeting 2 billionaires in the past week for the very first time, so it shows these people are coming. It seems they are only the first wave and more will follow, so they will push the rent up for the next 3 years
ya there is a lot of market talk about us becoming something like monaco, mainly due to the IRs and F1 races (though yet official, but i feel its a done deal :lol: )

as to whether our prices will reach that level, sometimes with property its like that, a self-fulfilling thing if you wish, if everyone thinks it will happen, it would, which might also explain what is happening now. of course its given the economy doesnt turn drastically south. a little unlike shares and other financial instruments which tend to be more number orientated (though market sentiments plays a factor as well).

one thing i noticed, was during the market selloff in the financial markets recently, none of the interest in property market abated. perhaps it was too short a period to register :lol:

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Post by Grim Reaper » Tue, 27 Mar 2007 4:32 pm

thelostfish wrote:
Grim Reaper wrote:
thelostfish wrote: i guess there will always be such cases when a market is in a frenzy. as i dont know how big your friend's place is, i cant really say, but S$5800 can get you a really nice 3 bedroom with fanstastic view of about 1400sqfr on sentosa i believe.
lost fish,

just wondering: How much would you rate the rental for a one story freestanding bungalow, renovated, 3 bedrooms, 2200sqft living area, on a 4400 sqft property, location Siglap / Frankel estate?
hmm, assuming its not near the main roads and resonable condition as you say, i will think you be looking at around $3500. if the place is done up nicely and in a nice location within frankel estate, it might be more.

rentals for such bungalows seems to lack the pace of increases in the market now since many expats prefer convenient locations and condominiums with facilities. but i think given a few months or a year, you see them rising too.
2.3K in november last year, 2 year lease. And the LL indeed keeps saying she regrets renting out for such "a low" rental.

Similar to our place is one now for rent, but not renovated, 2 streets down. 4.8K...
Time will come....

humpbackwhale
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Post by humpbackwhale » Tue, 27 Mar 2007 5:03 pm

Hi lostfish, this time round i don't think it is self-fuling as i think its the foreigner (outside forces) that is pushing the price up; versus the pre 1997 boom where its Singaporean who push it up. Many local is still bleeding that is why the property "boom" is actually not a "boom" but a growing "puff" at central and 9,10,11 district.

The rest of the island is just experiencing organic growth, which means there is still "cheap" rental if you look outside city. But as there are more millionaires (in China, India, Britain and other countries) than the locals in the island, once these herd comes it will clean out the private property scene.

It seems that Singapore is fast becoming the place to be "seen" in the million, billionaire circle; if you have a property in London and New York, you must have one in Singapore.

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Post by thelostfish » Tue, 27 Mar 2007 6:50 pm

humpbackwhale wrote:Hi lostfish, this time round i don't think it is self-fuling as i think its the foreigner (outside forces) that is pushing the price up; versus the pre 1997 boom where its Singaporean who push it up. Many local is still bleeding that is why the property "boom" is actually not a "boom" but a growing "puff" at central and 9,10,11 district.

The rest of the island is just experiencing organic growth, which means there is still "cheap" rental if you look outside city. But as there are more millionaires (in China, India, Britain and other countries) than the locals in the island, once these herd comes it will clean out the private property scene.

It seems that Singapore is fast becoming the place to be "seen" in the million, billionaire circle; if you have a property in London and New York, you must have one in Singapore.
perhaps u mistaken my self-fulfilling explanation. self not as in singaporeans, but the property buyers, be they overseas or locals :D

yes indeed, the buyers are getting more international and less local for the immediate central/luxury areas. but i think that is to be expected. you dont really think we singaporeans, all got insanely rich overnight do you? especially since we just got over our recession about 1year ago.

As for the future, as a singaporean I feel a little skeptical, since our property market largely hinges on our govt policies. and they probably will not hesistate to step in if things get out of control. but at the moment they seem happy that richies all over the world are buying into the core areas. if things get crazy in the suburban....that might be a different story.

i think singapore is about 5-8 years behind places like monaco (personal guess). new york and london might be harder though due to the financial importance they represent
Last edited by thelostfish on Tue, 27 Mar 2007 6:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

thelostfish
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Post by thelostfish » Tue, 27 Mar 2007 6:52 pm

Grim Reaper wrote:
thelostfish wrote:
Grim Reaper wrote: lost fish,

just wondering: How much would you rate the rental for a one story freestanding bungalow, renovated, 3 bedrooms, 2200sqft living area, on a 4400 sqft property, location Siglap / Frankel estate?
hmm, assuming its not near the main roads and resonable condition as you say, i will think you be looking at around $3500. if the place is done up nicely and in a nice location within frankel estate, it might be more.

rentals for such bungalows seems to lack the pace of increases in the market now since many expats prefer convenient locations and condominiums with facilities. but i think given a few months or a year, you see them rising too.
2.3K in november last year, 2 year lease. And the LL indeed keeps saying she regrets renting out for such "a low" rental.

Similar to our place is one now for rent, but not renovated, 2 streets down. 4.8K...
2.3k is cheaper than HDB. :shock: :shock:

you got a great deal :lol:

4.8 doesnt sound too right. i think they might have to settle for less. unless they are willing to wait..but still...

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Post by HunBunny80 » Tue, 27 Mar 2007 8:39 pm

Purchasing in London is difficult initially but once you are on the property ladder, it is very easy to accumulate 2nd, 3rd or fourth property and so on.....There isn't as many stringent rules as Singapore and banks are more than willing to loan you the money. The problem is properties are rather pricey but then again depends on where you go.

I often think if it is worth buying a F/H condo in Singapore. Economy has always been stable and although the rental prices are crazy at the moment, it doesnt seem to have a major impact on the sales.

I think there is surplus in sales especially the 7/8 figures ones. Anyone really think that the prices will rocket up >10% in the next 5 years or so?

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Post by humpbackwhale » Wed, 28 Mar 2007 12:58 am

many people do not understand what is happening in the property market now because

1) it is not the local people buying these mega expensive condos
2) it is not like and it is unlike the previous boom (pre 1996), driven by locals (in herds to create an internal bubble that imploded)
3) there is no info (local people do not know) why is these people (foreigners) buying
4) majority of local, except for few, is still suffering from 1997 property crash, so alot of resentment and caution on property

This is my opinion;

The prices of the current hot properties are above $2.5 million (for 120sq m!!!!), most of these buyers (40% or more, thru corp or individual names, are all foreigners) are buying for investment. This is definitely not their first home.

Local rich people will buy 1 or 2 houses (at their own country) at "normal" price, super local rich will buy a few large houses (at their own country). There is only one group of people that will buy a "foreign" property at super high price; their net worth is 9 digits and above. Many local people do not understand them (because how many of us know one friend in this catergory?)are just saying the super rich (and foreigners) are throwing money in singapore, and a few million is nothing to them.

While it is true that a few million is nothing to them, these individuals are the super smart and super rich. They are super rich because they are very smart and are well inform on what is happening around the world; they invest globally. They know immediately when they see an opportunity to generate money.

What we are experiencing in singapore is the smartest group of the ultra mega rich people buying "first" into the Sing property market, they only zero in on the best prop and locale. Like stocks, they are building up their inventory before the other rich "herd" is coming in. Meaning this is the tip of the iceberg.

While many of us (and local people) who are struggling to put a roof over our head will not understand what is happening; imagine paying $4.8 million for an apartment the size of a HDB 5 room flat is just crazy for many of us.

These people have teams of (FULL TIME) professional who look into every property market in the world, and it is not one of them investing in 1 or 2 condos, they are buying up the central city area. Would you dare to put your money down, bet against these people and say that they are wrong? paying too much?

For me one thing is for sure, rent is going to go up up up......

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Post by ScoobyDoes » Wed, 28 Mar 2007 3:41 pm

humpbackwhale wrote:many people do not understand what is happening in the property market now because

1) it is not the local people buying these mega expensive condos
2) it is not like and it is unlike the previous boom (pre 1996), driven by locals (in herds to create an internal bubble that imploded)
3) there is no info (local people do not know) why is these people (foreigners) buying
4) majority of local, except for few, is still suffering from 1997 property crash, so alot of resentment and caution on property

This is my opinion;
A friend of mine is moving to Bangkok so the landlord is avertising his house. Currently my friend pays S$2800 but the landlord is advertising over $5.5k and has 30-ppl come to view.

Of those 30, only 1 was coming directly from overseas and the rest were simply moving within SG. People that should know better!

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Post by humpbackwhale » Wed, 28 Mar 2007 5:13 pm

ScoobyDoes - i think you are quick to jump to conclusion that 29 (local or expat in Singapore?) people are just moving within Singapore to pay for higher rent than before?

If your friends is paying $2800 (previously), then he is staying on the 2nd tier and below condo, why in the first place will 30 odd show up if they think the price increase is too high.

When 30 people showed up on a $5.5k (and when it was previously $2.8) it tells you to quickly do something before you get a big surprise from your landlord.

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Post by ScoobyDoes » Thu, 29 Mar 2007 12:21 pm

humpbackwhale wrote:ScoobyDoes - i think you are quick to jump to conclusion that 29 (local or expat in Singapore?) people are just moving within Singapore to pay for higher rent than before?

If your friends is paying $2800 (previously), then he is staying on the 2nd tier and below condo, why in the first place will 30 odd show up if they think the price increase is too high.

When 30 people showed up on a $5.5k (and when it was previously $2.8) it tells you to quickly do something before you get a big surprise from your landlord.
Jumping to a conclusion? You think i am guessing? This is what we know not an assumption.

With regards the house, it is nice with a tended garden (supplied bi-weekly by the landlord inclusive) in a nice area off Bukit Timah.

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