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United Airlines
United Airlines
Any news regarding their most recent recruitment?
Hi Toygirltoygirl wrote:One line - Don't go unless you're whiney, old and desperate.
That's really not a very nice thing to say. I hope that you are not a crew with any prestigious airline, for that would greatly discredit them.
I do apologise if I sound rude here, however I can't help but sense some sort of bitterness oozing from your post.
I know many UA crew who happen to be in their 20s and 30s (unless you consider those in their 30s old) who are really great people, who left airlines like Emirates, SIA, Qatar, BA, etc. for UA.
The fact that some of them are also beautiful should be pointed out as well. Although, the mere mention of beauty is so superficial that it should not be the main criteria for judging a person, albeit a crew.
Older crew... yes, there are many with the European and American carriers. But their Asian crew, i.e. those based in Singapore, Thailand, Hong Kong, etc. are generally younger.
Yes, there are some whiney ones around, but then again, whiney people can be found everywhere. Just read some of the posts in this forum and you'll find some great examples.
Desperate? Hmmm... I do wonder about that. Desperation will certainly not get anyone into ANY airline, not even the LCC. A little bit of luck maybe, if you believe in them. But desperation? I think desperation may lead them to apply to any airline that is recruiting. But it's not likely to land someone a position.
Have a great day Toygirl.
Be mild with the mild, shrewd with the crafty, confiding to the honest, rough to the ruffian, and a thunderbolt to the liar. But in all this, never be unmindful of your own dignity. - John Brown
Maybe you ought to have a few deeper thoughts before rushing in with such a statement, the fact that somebody has an opinion of an airline be it their employer or a competitor is personal and often for good reason.pandora wrote:Hi Toygirltoygirl wrote:One line - Don't go unless you're whiney, old and desperate.
That's really not a very nice thing to say. I hope that you are not a crew with any prestigious airline, for that would greatly discredit them.
A personal opinion of your own, perhaps you shold read some of Toygirl's other posts.I do apologise if I sound rude here, however I can't help but sense some sort of bitterness oozing from your post.
I know many UA crew who happen to be in their 20s and 30s (unless you consider those in their 30s old) who are really great people, who left airlines like Emirates, SIA, Qatar, BA, etc. for UA.
No doubt you do but what is the staff figure for United?
--Plavt wrote:Maybe you ought to have a few deeper thoughts before rushing in with such a statement, the fact that somebody has an opinion of an airline be it their employer or a competitor is personal and often for good reason.pandora wrote:Hi Toygirltoygirl wrote:One line - Don't go unless you're whiney, old and desperate.
That's really not a very nice thing to say. I hope that you are not a crew with any prestigious airline, for that would greatly discredit them.
A personal opinion of your own, perhaps you shold read some of Toygirl's other posts.I do apologise if I sound rude here, however I can't help but sense some sort of bitterness oozing from your post.
No doubt you do but what is the staff figure for United?I know many UA crew who happen to be in their 20s and 30s (unless you consider those in their 30s old) who are really great people, who left airlines like Emirates, SIA, Qatar, BA, etc. for UA.
Dear Plavt
You are right, I should have thought about it deeper than I did before posting a reply. The post was not meant to hurt anybody's feelings (my apologies, Toygirl).
However, having known some wonderful people from UA and having travelled with them makes it difficult to accept the one-liner, which could not be further from the truth (in my opinion). I do agree that opinions are personal. Sometimes it should also be taken with a pinch of salt, eh? And yes, I have also given my own personal opinion in a rush. For that I apologise.
I feel that one should not discourage another from applying for a job without stating their reasons clearly, whether personal or hear-say.
The crew count in United (Singapore) right now is around 130, as their base just reopened in July. It used to be a little over 300.
Be mild with the mild, shrewd with the crafty, confiding to the honest, rough to the ruffian, and a thunderbolt to the liar. But in all this, never be unmindful of your own dignity. - John Brown
Pandora
I think you're one of those new ex-SQ girls who went to Chicago for the first batch of training and you're probably in the Leadership base and a purser or RFA as from your post, I can decipher you're probably not a UA-returnee? So I think your experience in UA is less than a half a year at the most?
UA's service compared to other major carriers isn't up to bar and steadily declining. They are trying to boost up sales by offering a Washington flight connecting from Hong Kong/Narita?.
Whiney, old and desperate - I still concur with my statement. I think I have posted that line and explained it certain post on this airline. Try Emirates, try SIA to learn service culture, but United isn't known for service. The training if I recall is 5 weeks there.
The first few batches of SIN crew that flew were mostly experienced crew and ex-UA returnees. Mostly in their 30s and 40s.
Not bitterness. I feel sad for some of those flying that carrier. My good friend was in management for Onboard Service so I know more than you think I do.
www.untied.com speaks wonders. BTW, you're not under union as a RFA at SINSW. So you don't really have much rights. Yes, looks don't really matter in this airline. Fly with United. Fly with SQ - You know the difference It's to fly.
The base was opened in Singapore on Bangkok to test run the market again. It's also cost effective operationally so the AFA union - Association of Flight Attendants could not fight back as they had already signed the agreement.
Desperation drives a lot to return. From earning a nice salary to biting the dust and earning peanuts when the base was closed. Some were from QR, EK, SQ - Yeah, mostly the ones over 30.
For those of who don't know - Basically overseas bases are pegged by a certain percentage of the current American flight attendants AFA - This practice is also done by NWA who also have a similar scheme.
My opinion is based on fact. Try flying domestically with United. The intra-Asia service is there for language qualified skills and being an American carrier, they cannot recruit like SQ.
130? Didn't some get fired? Some resigned? One ex-JAL girl chickened out during the briefing before the flight for training. The last I heard was 120. The AFA people must be fuming mad that this base was open and I understand their frustration - It's the same as outsourcing.
If you're young then I suggest you go for EK or SQ. I vehemently do not recommend United unless your age has caught up with you and your options are limited. The environment there isn't the best. Go for the best.
The current routes are usually Singapore Hong Kong Singapore Narita or you may be forced to help the Bangkok crew out for their Seoul flights. Regional Flight Attendants will NEVER fly US routes. So if you want to see the world - Wrong choice! Passenger demographic does not vary on these routes. (Hint)
I reserve my rights to comment.
I think you're one of those new ex-SQ girls who went to Chicago for the first batch of training and you're probably in the Leadership base and a purser or RFA as from your post, I can decipher you're probably not a UA-returnee? So I think your experience in UA is less than a half a year at the most?
UA's service compared to other major carriers isn't up to bar and steadily declining. They are trying to boost up sales by offering a Washington flight connecting from Hong Kong/Narita?.
Whiney, old and desperate - I still concur with my statement. I think I have posted that line and explained it certain post on this airline. Try Emirates, try SIA to learn service culture, but United isn't known for service. The training if I recall is 5 weeks there.
The first few batches of SIN crew that flew were mostly experienced crew and ex-UA returnees. Mostly in their 30s and 40s.
Not bitterness. I feel sad for some of those flying that carrier. My good friend was in management for Onboard Service so I know more than you think I do.
www.untied.com speaks wonders. BTW, you're not under union as a RFA at SINSW. So you don't really have much rights. Yes, looks don't really matter in this airline. Fly with United. Fly with SQ - You know the difference It's to fly.
The base was opened in Singapore on Bangkok to test run the market again. It's also cost effective operationally so the AFA union - Association of Flight Attendants could not fight back as they had already signed the agreement.
Desperation drives a lot to return. From earning a nice salary to biting the dust and earning peanuts when the base was closed. Some were from QR, EK, SQ - Yeah, mostly the ones over 30.
For those of who don't know - Basically overseas bases are pegged by a certain percentage of the current American flight attendants AFA - This practice is also done by NWA who also have a similar scheme.
My opinion is based on fact. Try flying domestically with United. The intra-Asia service is there for language qualified skills and being an American carrier, they cannot recruit like SQ.
130? Didn't some get fired? Some resigned? One ex-JAL girl chickened out during the briefing before the flight for training. The last I heard was 120. The AFA people must be fuming mad that this base was open and I understand their frustration - It's the same as outsourcing.
If you're young then I suggest you go for EK or SQ. I vehemently do not recommend United unless your age has caught up with you and your options are limited. The environment there isn't the best. Go for the best.
The current routes are usually Singapore Hong Kong Singapore Narita or you may be forced to help the Bangkok crew out for their Seoul flights. Regional Flight Attendants will NEVER fly US routes. So if you want to see the world - Wrong choice! Passenger demographic does not vary on these routes. (Hint)
I reserve my rights to comment.
Actually no, I'm not, although I am ex-SQ.
You are right that UA is not up to par with other major carriers, however, that's in the area of resources, i.e. inflight entertainment, newer aircrafts, seating, etc. Most certainly not the cabin crew services (SINSW) which I've been told have won the 5-star Diamond award for hospitality before the base was closed. United is certainly unable to compete with major carriers like SQ, CX or EK. They simply do not have the resources to do so.
The intra-Asia routes are not reserved for language qualified, as their language crew (Japanese/ Korean) consist less then 20% of their head count, although they are recruiting more language crew now.
I have flown the intra-Asia routes as well as the connecting routes to the US. And there is a great difference in the level of service offered by the RFAs and the AFAs. That's also one of the reasons why the RFAs are brought back.
Yes, you do seem to know a lot about them, so do I. My friends are still in the management of United so my opinions are based on fact as well.
Having said that, I'm neither here to defend United, nor to spur an argument. You reserve your right to comment, just like everyone else.
I believe at the end of the day, those who fly the carrier (or any carrier) made their own choice, and should not be belittled for that, 'desperate' of not. Who are we to do that?
You are right that UA is not up to par with other major carriers, however, that's in the area of resources, i.e. inflight entertainment, newer aircrafts, seating, etc. Most certainly not the cabin crew services (SINSW) which I've been told have won the 5-star Diamond award for hospitality before the base was closed. United is certainly unable to compete with major carriers like SQ, CX or EK. They simply do not have the resources to do so.
The intra-Asia routes are not reserved for language qualified, as their language crew (Japanese/ Korean) consist less then 20% of their head count, although they are recruiting more language crew now.
I have flown the intra-Asia routes as well as the connecting routes to the US. And there is a great difference in the level of service offered by the RFAs and the AFAs. That's also one of the reasons why the RFAs are brought back.
Yes, you do seem to know a lot about them, so do I. My friends are still in the management of United so my opinions are based on fact as well.
Having said that, I'm neither here to defend United, nor to spur an argument. You reserve your right to comment, just like everyone else.
I believe at the end of the day, those who fly the carrier (or any carrier) made their own choice, and should not be belittled for that, 'desperate' of not. Who are we to do that?
Be mild with the mild, shrewd with the crafty, confiding to the honest, rough to the ruffian, and a thunderbolt to the liar. But in all this, never be unmindful of your own dignity. - John Brown
The diamond award was eons ago I notice this is also played like an old tune. Anything new? The current IFE and product is poor and the crew quality in general is poor - Yes there are gems but it's a few - The local RFAs play a part for their Asian hospitality/Asian language qualified component. Plus - not to forget, it's much cheaper to hire the local Singaporeans in contrast to the American Flight Attendants who usually fly previously to SIN have much seniority - i.e. higher pay and layover per diem which in contrast to local RFAs is little.
You do not have any contract nor union to back you up.
I have always encouraged those who aspire to work towards being a crew do so - provided they know what they are in for - But for United, that's another story all together. You're better served learning and developing from the best over at the industry leaders rather than a laggard. Period. I understand this must be hard for you to swallow but I reserve my rights to comment as I noticed you triggered the defensive streak from the beginning.
I believe you have flown only as a passenger on United from the training centre and back, is it still at Elk Grove on space available travel?
Nothing wrong with joining United. Depends whether you want First Class or Cattle Coach.
Nothing wrong with being desperate either. If you're happy with the working environment and I believe United in Singapore is a bond free environment, you are free to leave at anytime - Then go. I understand some left before the training even began, during training and a few weeks after they landed. Prima facie? Ditto.
On your rebuttal on the comment on language qualified - Yes, that was a factor as well - It is much easier to get Cantonese/Mandarin speakers at a cheaper rate than AFA.
Yes, people make their own choices for obvious reasons - It is best for them to weight the cons and the pros before jumping in. Not for us to decide, but better to help people make informed decisions then singing a melodramatic innane happy tune. I understand being a purser at United SINSW may cloud your ability to provide a balanced viewpoint and objectivity.
Res Ipsa Loquitur.
You do not have any contract nor union to back you up.
I have always encouraged those who aspire to work towards being a crew do so - provided they know what they are in for - But for United, that's another story all together. You're better served learning and developing from the best over at the industry leaders rather than a laggard. Period. I understand this must be hard for you to swallow but I reserve my rights to comment as I noticed you triggered the defensive streak from the beginning.
I believe you have flown only as a passenger on United from the training centre and back, is it still at Elk Grove on space available travel?
Nothing wrong with joining United. Depends whether you want First Class or Cattle Coach.
Nothing wrong with being desperate either. If you're happy with the working environment and I believe United in Singapore is a bond free environment, you are free to leave at anytime - Then go. I understand some left before the training even began, during training and a few weeks after they landed. Prima facie? Ditto.
On your rebuttal on the comment on language qualified - Yes, that was a factor as well - It is much easier to get Cantonese/Mandarin speakers at a cheaper rate than AFA.
Yes, people make their own choices for obvious reasons - It is best for them to weight the cons and the pros before jumping in. Not for us to decide, but better to help people make informed decisions then singing a melodramatic innane happy tune. I understand being a purser at United SINSW may cloud your ability to provide a balanced viewpoint and objectivity.
Res Ipsa Loquitur.
Sigh... you don't get it, do you? Perhaps, I don't get you.
I do admit that I was defensive from the beginning, cause I really do not understand people who attack without providing reasons. If you had given evidence to support your one-liner, thereby helping the enquirer and other readers understand what you meant, it would have been useful.
It's definitely cheaper to hire RFAs. Just like it's cheaper for the local construction companies to hire migrant workers. Part of business, isn't it, to reduce cost and maximise productivity?
Maybe you should only comment based on what you have experienced yourself and not hearsay. Unless you have in your possession miles of empirical studies to support your claim.
Either way, I'm not a crew. I have been a passenger with UA for many years as I have flown on a regular basis to SFO, where I lived and studied for a while. Had I been a purser, I think I would have much more to say. You may continue believing otherwise. Just like you reserve your rights to comment, you also reserve your rights to opinions and what to believe.
While I do not dispute your reasonings, it still failed to address the "old, desperate and whiney" component of your comment. Yes, give them the pros and cons to help them decide, but not one-liners which do not get them anywhere. How does that help them with making informed decisions?
Of course there are the ugly side of things, which organisation is truly 'clean'?
Maybe I'm pro-United because I have friends who work there, both locally and in WHQ, who takes pride in their jobs and happy to be there. Don't compare apple with pear. United is nowhere near the major air carriers and I seriously doubt they want to compete with them. But with other American carriers? Who knows. Is there anything new coming up? We'll just have to wait and see, don't we?
Verbum sapienti satis est.
I do admit that I was defensive from the beginning, cause I really do not understand people who attack without providing reasons. If you had given evidence to support your one-liner, thereby helping the enquirer and other readers understand what you meant, it would have been useful.
It's definitely cheaper to hire RFAs. Just like it's cheaper for the local construction companies to hire migrant workers. Part of business, isn't it, to reduce cost and maximise productivity?
Maybe you should only comment based on what you have experienced yourself and not hearsay. Unless you have in your possession miles of empirical studies to support your claim.
Either way, I'm not a crew. I have been a passenger with UA for many years as I have flown on a regular basis to SFO, where I lived and studied for a while. Had I been a purser, I think I would have much more to say. You may continue believing otherwise. Just like you reserve your rights to comment, you also reserve your rights to opinions and what to believe.
While I do not dispute your reasonings, it still failed to address the "old, desperate and whiney" component of your comment. Yes, give them the pros and cons to help them decide, but not one-liners which do not get them anywhere. How does that help them with making informed decisions?
Of course there are the ugly side of things, which organisation is truly 'clean'?
Maybe I'm pro-United because I have friends who work there, both locally and in WHQ, who takes pride in their jobs and happy to be there. Don't compare apple with pear. United is nowhere near the major air carriers and I seriously doubt they want to compete with them. But with other American carriers? Who knows. Is there anything new coming up? We'll just have to wait and see, don't we?
Verbum sapienti satis est.
Be mild with the mild, shrewd with the crafty, confiding to the honest, rough to the ruffian, and a thunderbolt to the liar. But in all this, never be unmindful of your own dignity. - John Brown
Pandora,
You really should read toygirls post previous to your last more thoroughly as she has quite clearly stated her reasons for the 'Whiney Old and Desperate' line. This line in particular;
You really should read toygirls post previous to your last more thoroughly as she has quite clearly stated her reasons for the 'Whiney Old and Desperate' line. This line in particular;
Neither you nor I can deny their is nowadays what maybe called an obsession with globalization and the availability of cheap labour or labour involving lesser costs. This has been a practice of American companies for years and has even in my country resulted in a factory being closed down although it was in actual fact profitable. The proprietors at the time just found more profits in relocating to South Korea! Reducing costs and ultimately wages means a drop in standards, poorer service being one of the most noticeable effects.not to forget, it's much cheaper to hire the local Singaporeans in contrast to the American Flight Attendants who usually fly previously to SIN have much seniority - i.e. higher pay and layover per diem which in contrast to local RFAs is little.
Thank you for confirming my points exactly. United is no way near anywhere. I believe our budget carrier crew are properly trained in contrast to the truckloads that pass by Elk Grove.
Sorry, I would have to say this organisation isn't one I would recommend to anyone, except my foes of course to join and let them go "It's time to fly the friendly (LOL) skies of United".
Perhaps it's due to the fact you work there that you may have lost objectivity. (Hint) The Singapore base is here for only 6 odd months so far - From what I've heard, we haven't lost much in contrast to the previous AFAs. The quality is the same.
As a passenger, I would stick to SQ or EK for travel. The product is abysmal but trying to catch up and truckloads does not mean quality.
Honestly, I wouldn't recommend this airline for people trying to break into the industry. You really might as well stick to the leading carriers who have more crew welfare. Frieds in WHQ? - You were in Elk Grove training for 5 weeks. Yes, probably your trainers who were not AFA flying crew. AFA crew did not train them. The lot were trained by management staff as the flying crew under union wouldn't want to have anything to do.
If you don't really know, before 911, there was an option for RFAs to move over to BKK/NRT and be AFA. Some did. Their rights are protected. RFAs generally aren't.
Read my previous posts, I believe Plavt and I have discussed the comment I made in a previous thread. Those who follow this site regularly rather than pop by and start spitting venom the moment they find something not to their liking shouldn't be playing a blame game. I do not owe you an explanation nor am I obligated to do so. Much of the information shared right now is things candidates do not know till they join and realise. This base is more for "mature" candidates from other airlines. I think the current recruitment is trying to increase the image of it.
The only thing I can really say is excellent is there is no bond - You can leave anytime. That is a relief for some. Do you know the statistics of turnover for United Flight Attendants in general. Ask your WHQ friends (I think the only friends you have there were the trainers who incidentally aren't AFA crew)
It is a old desperate and whiney place. Period. I am not budging from this statement. If you have an issue despite my many lines of feedback then I have nothing more to say.
You are not a UA crew? You sure Esther? Thanks for comparing RFAs to construction labourers. It's the same concept. Yes, it's a business. And yes, you'll be a number. However, my reasoning is based on welfare, you are not an Onboard Service Manager nor do I think you know them- Are any of your friends one of these? vox et praeterea nihil!
Sorry, I will not be wasting my time on this thread. As pro-UA you are, I am ex-RFA myself. This is the "new" United. The one that laid off RFAs immediately during bad times. Sorry, not a secure place for your career.
There is no organisation that is truly clean. However, there isn't many organisations that is smeared by dirt as well. Instead of being a laudator temporis acti - Please wake up and smell the gutter. Since you claim you're not a UA crew (Wink) - Then your case is based on hearsay.
Stick to SQ if you're looking to staying at home and EK for a global career. P.S. - Don't be a copy cat of my Latin endings - Originality Esther!
www.untied.com
Sorry, I would have to say this organisation isn't one I would recommend to anyone, except my foes of course to join and let them go "It's time to fly the friendly (LOL) skies of United".
Perhaps it's due to the fact you work there that you may have lost objectivity. (Hint) The Singapore base is here for only 6 odd months so far - From what I've heard, we haven't lost much in contrast to the previous AFAs. The quality is the same.
As a passenger, I would stick to SQ or EK for travel. The product is abysmal but trying to catch up and truckloads does not mean quality.
Honestly, I wouldn't recommend this airline for people trying to break into the industry. You really might as well stick to the leading carriers who have more crew welfare. Frieds in WHQ? - You were in Elk Grove training for 5 weeks. Yes, probably your trainers who were not AFA flying crew. AFA crew did not train them. The lot were trained by management staff as the flying crew under union wouldn't want to have anything to do.
If you don't really know, before 911, there was an option for RFAs to move over to BKK/NRT and be AFA. Some did. Their rights are protected. RFAs generally aren't.
Read my previous posts, I believe Plavt and I have discussed the comment I made in a previous thread. Those who follow this site regularly rather than pop by and start spitting venom the moment they find something not to their liking shouldn't be playing a blame game. I do not owe you an explanation nor am I obligated to do so. Much of the information shared right now is things candidates do not know till they join and realise. This base is more for "mature" candidates from other airlines. I think the current recruitment is trying to increase the image of it.
The only thing I can really say is excellent is there is no bond - You can leave anytime. That is a relief for some. Do you know the statistics of turnover for United Flight Attendants in general. Ask your WHQ friends (I think the only friends you have there were the trainers who incidentally aren't AFA crew)
It is a old desperate and whiney place. Period. I am not budging from this statement. If you have an issue despite my many lines of feedback then I have nothing more to say.
You are not a UA crew? You sure Esther? Thanks for comparing RFAs to construction labourers. It's the same concept. Yes, it's a business. And yes, you'll be a number. However, my reasoning is based on welfare, you are not an Onboard Service Manager nor do I think you know them- Are any of your friends one of these? vox et praeterea nihil!
Sorry, I will not be wasting my time on this thread. As pro-UA you are, I am ex-RFA myself. This is the "new" United. The one that laid off RFAs immediately during bad times. Sorry, not a secure place for your career.
There is no organisation that is truly clean. However, there isn't many organisations that is smeared by dirt as well. Instead of being a laudator temporis acti - Please wake up and smell the gutter. Since you claim you're not a UA crew (Wink) - Then your case is based on hearsay.
Stick to SQ if you're looking to staying at home and EK for a global career. P.S. - Don't be a copy cat of my Latin endings - Originality Esther!
www.untied.com
There is really no need to be original with jaded people who cannot see beyond their own nose. Latin endings are not original. If you want originality, then create something of your own.
Who really wants to try smelling the gutters anyway? The smell is there whether you realise it or not. So why try?
The point is, do not discriminate. I've read some of your posts. While some may be accurate, the rest are as far-fetched as people with imaginations can dream. Seems that there is always somebody disputing what you have to say. That speaks a lot, doesn't it?
You sounded like a really nice person in your pms, but then again, nothing is as it seems, right?
Anyway, free show's over guys & gals. If you are willing to pay for the show, I might be persuaded, although toygirl may not, since she needs to have a 'discussion' before posting.
A recommendation to those aspiring cabin crew - the best way to get tips and advices is from existing crew. Although forums may help, it is not necessarily the best place. It is a great place for entertainment though.
Taurus excreta cerebrum vincit.
Be mild with the mild, shrewd with the crafty, confiding to the honest, rough to the ruffian, and a thunderbolt to the liar. But in all this, never be unmindful of your own dignity. - John Brown
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