Question on education

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Vaucluse
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Re: ISD

Post by Vaucluse » Mon, 24 Oct 2005 9:25 am

Another Mat Salleh wrote:Thanks Mat Salleh

With all the nonsense going around here, someone should contact the ISD regarding individuals starting racial hostility towards Asians. Also, have the posters already forgotten the cases where 2 Singaporeans were jailed recently for inciting racial hatred? Think about how it would turn out for foreigners who try to stir up racial hatred towards the Asian population.

I suggest the individuals concerned (registered frequent posters) revist their old posts and rethink what they post in future, lest this site be monitored by the Singapore authorities.


Oh my goodness, you are warped. Racial hatred? Not only are you warped, but severely deranged. Racial hostility towards Asians? Not only are yu warped and severely deranged, but also terribly ill-informed, especially if you suggest looking at older posts.

Eric and I are both married to Asians, you fool (as you could tell if YOU looked at older posts). Both very well educated women with excellent jobs - NOT SPG's or the nonsense you would label us with.
someone should contact the ISD regarding individuals starting racial hostility towards Asians

If you are so keen - please go ahead - I would welcome an ass like you being made a fool of. You are, however, one of those people that incites hostility and then hides when it comes to a point - a real point!
Do you realise that expatriates in Singapore earn much more than locals ? Do we begrudge you all for taking away our job opportunities? NO! In fact we welcome you all to our country so that we may learn to improve our lot.
I'm sure the rest of the Mat Sallehs here are not as condescending as both of you towards us asians....


Yes, I do realise that Expats earn more than locals, that's because we are usually at a senior level within our company - which is why we are sent overseas - have you noticed that there are not many, if any low-level to lower mid-level expats here? Guess why that is! Because we are senior members of our respective companies. Geez, I thought this issue had been talked to death, but I guess too many people don't want to face reality, instead re-awakening old prejudices.

May I turn this around and say that we spend much more money than locals for the Singaporean economy, that our presence here furthers the cause of international relations . . . Yes, I could use the same arguments as you for students - but we bring employment as the companies we work for have far more local employees than expats - which is logical.

I refuse to accept this turning into a local versus expat discussion. It started off being a good exchange of opinion but is being dragged down by the usual ill-informed and, frankly, stupid, anonymous posters.

My last contribution to this topic.
......................................................

'nuff said Image

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Post by dot dot dot » Mon, 24 Oct 2005 11:48 am

[quote="mysticalx"]I don’t think there’s really a need to repeat myself or what many of the other posters have already mentioned. There are definitely benefits of taking in foreign students. Call this a sort of “investment”

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Post by locallass » Mon, 24 Oct 2005 11:57 am

I'm disgusted at how people have been threatened by ISA in this thread. I'm local and sorry, I don't see any racial hatred here. Just disapproval for insistence on the right to get a free ride.

When another country (or anybody else for that matter) offers you something for free, we should be grateful, not see it as something we are entitled to. And when they withdraw this freebie, we have no right to berate them. To attack someone for not giving you something for free is almost like robbing them. I'm just as disappointed as some of the other posters at the lack of maturity shown here.

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Post by tiki » Mon, 24 Oct 2005 12:17 pm

Darn butta bing.....what's with the racist bullquack?

Is the blood running through your veins of a different colour? Your poo don't stink?

Guess sometimes you becomes an oppressed because you're your own oppressor...

To the individuals who equate one Asian-hating SOB to the rest of us harmonious,tolerant non-Asian folks..seems like even free education 'with further discounts' might not help you.

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Post by mysticalx » Tue, 25 Oct 2005 1:40 am

In Europe, tax levels are very high. And every individual is interested to know where their money goes, as they would like to see some benefit for them. So, like it or not, the opinion expressed by these gentlemen is representative of what you would have for answer if you discussed the subject with people back there.
Carpe Diem,
Yes I do know that taxes are very high especially in Scandinavia. Still I have not seen that much hostility towards foreign students as I have seen in this particular thread. In fact I had a great time in Finland and most of the Finns I've met were very welcoming. Of course there are some bad apples but never expected to see it coming from people like Eric and Vaucluse.
May I turn this around and say that we spend much more money than locals for the Singaporean economy, that our presence here furthers the cause of international relations . . . Yes, I could use the same arguments as you for students - but we bring employment as the companies we work for have far more local employees than expats - which is logical.
Vaucluse,
If you could use that argument, I don’t see how others can’t.
I refuse to accept this turning into a local versus expat discussion. It started off being a good exchange of opinion but is being dragged down by the usual ill-informed and, frankly, stupid, anonymous posters.
It started getting nasty the minute you find comments like this:
one of my Universities in Sydney was cram-packed full of foreign students, though I fail to see how they contributed to any intelectual discourse above and beyond what was there anyway.
Man….get down off your high horse.
As you can read, I just said what was being said by another 'guest' here. I didnot genralize anywhere, I just summarized. I didnot refer to you being Singaporean, like you said: It doesnot even matter.
Seriously Eric, you’ve got a gift for summarizing other people’s comments.
One would expect at least you would show a bit more gratitude and awareness, respect and gratefulness, instead of gloryfying a person like mysticalx.
*nasty comment alert* And exactly what kind of person am I?
About the 'investment', you like to think of it that way probably, but this is not the investment I was referring to: you as a young person investing in a future by getting the best education possible. And paying for that investment, as all locals in those respective countries pay for their investments in a good future.

Again, this is all because of the fact that you emphasized on the importance and availability of 'free' education. And there's followers who cheer you for bringing this under their attention. So be it, but vaucluse and myself are just holding mirrors here, as there is no such thing as free education. The locals in the respective countries pay for it.

Up to you to ignore this or trying to bend it your way.
I’m merely stating facts here. It is true that it is free (and why shouldn’t people know about it?) and I definitely encourage people to study in Scandinavia/Europe, simply for the experience. You know, there are many parents out there who work very hard to give their kids the best education possible. There’s often this mindset that you’d find the best education for your child in the US, the UK or the few other English-speaking countries. Many are not aware of better opportunities available.

In fact they don’t even need me to tell them that it’s free. Just look at the DAAD (German Academic Exchange Service) website.
http://ic.daad.de/singapore/study.html
There are also a number of other compelling reasons why Germany should become the country of your choice for both studying and research:

The moderate cost of living and studying in Germany. Tuition fees at public universities have been waived by the German government, save for selected postgraduate courses. This applies to German and international students alike, since higher education in Germany is subject to the principle of equal opportunity, which means that everyone regardless of their socioeconomic background, nationality, sex or religion should be able to afford a university education. Only a small administrative fee (between S $ 50 and S $ 300 per semester) is payable. In essence, that means the German taxpayer is footing the bill for everyone’s university studies. However, this tuition fee waiver does not apply to the few private higher education institutions. Living expenses amount to around EUR 650 to 750 (~ S $ 1300 to 1500) per month.
So please tell me, why would the German government actually highlight this point?
What irritates me in this discussion is the fact that deny this truth and you are taking all for granted.
I wonder who’s the one denying the truth?!!?!?! I have already explained to you as to why these governments choose to waive the tuition fees. Besides, NOT ALL who applied will be accepted. I mean, if you’re good and you know there’s an opportunity out there whereby you can get the best education possible without being a burden to your family, wouldn’t you go for it? It’s not like these governments are taking in loads of foreign students. There is after all a QUOTA!
When another country (or anybody else for that matter) offers you something for free, we should be grateful, not see it as something we are entitled to. And when they withdraw this freebie, we have no right to berate them. To attack someone for not giving you something for free is almost like robbing them. I'm just as disappointed as some of the other posters at the lack of maturity shown here.
Locallass,
Perhaps you need some reading glasses. NO ONE ever demanded for free education. It is these governments that are kind enough to offer places in their universities to non-EU citizens. And we are simply passing along this piece of information so that those who are deserving will benefit from it. If you must know, there are many students coming from less developed countries who are brilliant in their studies but lack the opportunity to take it one step further.

Anyway I’m outta here as it’s hard having a discussion with someone who can only harp on the same point over and over again and I also don’t wish to be labeled as some spoilt brat with a big mouth and no brains by some smart ass poster. (You know who you are)

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Post by locallass » Tue, 25 Oct 2005 9:40 am

mysticalx> for you, it is not an issue whether it's a fair and equitable system where taxpayers are paying for the university fees of foreign students. It's an issue about how you can get an affordable education, how you are shopping around for the best deal, how others are denying this to "deserving" students like you. In other words, it's always about you, you and -who else?- you.

Since you haven't managed to get it even after so long, I have a newsflash for you- (1) Nobody owes you a living (2) Many people go into debt to finance their graduate studies (3) It's not always about you and you have this coming (4) grow up.

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Post by locallass » Tue, 25 Oct 2005 9:43 am

[quote="mysticalx] And we are simply passing along this piece of information so that those who are deserving will benefit from it.[/quote]

Sorry I can't help but add- where did this sense of entitlement come from? People have to provide you with free education just because you have good grades? And when they are against this system, they're deserving of your contempt? Just which planet do you live on?

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Post by Quasimodo » Tue, 25 Oct 2005 9:48 am

Time to end this one, Locallass - the topic has run its course and self-righteousness will prevail in the end anyway. The 'Me' generation is everpresent.
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Post by neutral » Wed, 26 Oct 2005 12:45 am

I've been following this thread with great interest which unfortunately ended badly with the interference from people who do not know what they are talking about.
What Carpe Diem said was fair to all concerned.
Mysticalx has her points and she was trying to pass on info to those in search of a good education. I see nothing wrong in her arguments. She appears sensible.
Eric and Vaucluse were fair in the beginning but later became biased towards Mysticalx by remarks made by some anonymous posters.
As an expat in this region for many years, I've grown to love it here and the people are fantastic.
Local ass, my advice to you is read carefully before you write.
Hope I have not offended anyone. Cheers!

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Post by locallass » Wed, 26 Oct 2005 11:52 am

Okay, so Mysticalx is helpful and sensible and there is nothing wrong with her arguments for free education funded by foreign taxpayers. Just curious, how do you know she is female?

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Post by neutral » Wed, 26 Oct 2005 1:40 pm

locallass wrote:Okay, so Mysticalx is helpful and sensible and there is nothing wrong with her arguments for free education funded by foreign taxpayers. Just curious, how do you know she is female?
One final word on this discussion. If we are not happy with our government offering free education to foreigners, then we should protest in our own country, vote them out . Not show our unhappiness to our host country. We are after all guests here. Like I mentoned earlier, people here are fantastic .

Mysticalx sounds like a female nick to me. Sorry for being presumtious then. If you are a guy, my apologies

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Post by locallass » Wed, 26 Oct 2005 2:13 pm

Sure you can have the final word if you want it. I think I should also change my nick, to Always Right.

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Post by Carpe Diem » Wed, 26 Oct 2005 2:23 pm

locallass, I think YOU had the final word!

Well in fact, it's me now...
La vie est trop courte, profitons de chaque instant

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Post by locallass » Wed, 26 Oct 2005 2:26 pm

CD, I'm now Always Right. Sorry I have to disagree. It's me with the final word here ;)

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Post by Carpe Diem » Wed, 26 Oct 2005 2:39 pm

Hummm... OK, I won't say anything, but...

(thinking you are wrong).
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