Online-Only Banks

[malcontent]

I used trust for a week. After multiple lock outs and being accused of being a money launderer by Trust I cancelled it. The back end is dismal.

Any free fees will disappear eventually anyways.

They use your IRAS info, and with someone paying only a couple hundred in tax and yet moving your kind of money around… I can see it getting flagged. With my hefty 5-figure tax bill, they probably won’t be as worried. In my mind, Trust is effectively StanChart with a techie, hipster front-end.

I’ve been watching credit card trends here carefully and I would say Singapore is following the same path as the credit card industry in the US. Back 20 years ago, hardly any credit cards in the US offered no foreign transaction fees, go back 30 years ago and annual fee for life was still a novelty (I actually got one of the first cards to offer it, the AT&T Universal card). Nowadays, 80-90% of all cards have no annual fee and 40-50% have no foreign transaction fees… and it’s only gone one direction — more competitive. Credit card companies are too greedy not to give the goodies in hopes of growing what is a rather lucrative business for them.

[x9200]

In the past I’ve looked into cards like Revolut, YouTrip, etc… but lost interest after learning about the hoops you need to jump through. I just don’t have the inclination or talent to be a hoop jumping circus monkey. This Trust card appears to be a straightforward credit card, no fuss, no fees.

What hoops, both seem to be fairly straightforward

The very first hoop is loading money on the card, effectively it’s a prepaid debit card that is multi-currency. In case it is not immediately apparent, once you load money onto the card, unless you spend every last cent, yes, another hoop to jump through to sweep out any remaining balance (though I am sure they would prefer you just leave it in there).

Just found they have <18 accounts and no problem with getting a card for even younger kids. I believe no standard bank in Singapore has anything like this available. Pre-paid is in this case perfectly fine.

[malcontent]

Just found they have <18 accounts and no problem with getting a card for even younger kids. I believe no standard bank in Singapore has anything like this available. Pre-paid is in this case perfectly fine.

I’ve always been more than a little leery of prepaid cards… they always have some “gotcha” fees somewhere, even if it’s not immediately obvious.

If you are eligible for the best credit cards, that is almost always a better deal as long as you aren’t the type to pay less than the full balance (in which case… don’t walk, run away from all credit cards, no matter how good the candy is).

Debit cards are usually the next best option, whereas prepaid are at the bottom rung - they cater to those with bad credit, or the young and the senseless. Not saying it doesn’t have any value, but it’s definitely not for me.

[x9200]

Agree, but I am not going to use the Revolut card as my main card (I stick to citi cash back for that). More for occasional overseas physical or online shopping, and some, controllable, safe card for my son. Very easy to register and get one. Will see how it works in real life situations.

[nelyanne]

Revolut was a real life saver for me during the period after I moved to Singapore and before I got the local card. Back then, it was possible to withdraw cash from UOB ATMs without any fee (up to 700SGD per month, or something). I also used it to get cash in Bali. (Another advantage of prepaid cards: you don't need to worry much even if your card is compromised, because potentjal damage will be limited.) So the money was not really 'locked'. No idea whether it's still possible?

[smoulder]

It will take quite a bit for these fintechs to be able to compete with the big boys who have been around for more than a while, have established systems, processes and scale. I think the newbies longevity is going to be tested.

For me, it has very little to do with the traditional banks having brick and mortar branches, but more to do with the systems and processes.

On a side note, I tried looking up where these online only banks are storing the "actual" money. I couldn't find any reference - it's not clear if they have their own core banking systems or whether they are just wrappers over a bank account stored in a traditional bank.

[PNGMK]

I used trust for a week. After multiple lock outs and being accused of being a money launderer by Trust I cancelled it. The back end is dismal.

Any free fees will disappear eventually anyways.

They use your IRAS info, and with someone paying only a couple hundred in tax and yet moving your kind of money around… I can see it getting flagged. With my hefty 5-figure tax bill, they probably won’t be as worried. In my mind, Trust is effectively StanChart with a techie, hipster front-end.

I’ve been watching credit card trends here carefully and I would say Singapore is following the same path as the credit card industry in the US. Back 20 years ago, hardly any credit cards in the US offered no foreign transaction fees, go back 30 years ago and annual fee for life was still a novelty (I actually got one of the first cards to offer it, the AT&T Universal card). Nowadays, 80-90% of all cards have no annual fee and 40-50% have no foreign transaction fees… and it’s only gone one direction — more competitive. Credit card companies are too greedy not to give the goodies in hopes of growing what is a rather lucrative business for them.

they would have used pre SEP data as this was some time back. It was just annoying teething issues I couldn't be arsed dealing with.

[malcontent]

Here is my assessment after the first time using Trust Bank credit card overseas last week, in my case it was a transaction in Euros.

While I believe Trust Bank doesn’t “add” any foreign transaction fees, the 1% charged by Visa appears to remain — baked into the rate. Even using the absolute worst currency rate traded in the past 24 hours of my transaction, the rate was worse by more than 0.9%. That is far worse that a typical money changer.

While it’s a lot better than most all other credit cards in Singapore, my US cards have no foreign transaction fees and the 1% fee by Visa is absorbed.. so I get super close to mid-market, plus cash back. Considering I only lose 0.5% when I use Wise to transfer SGD to USD, I would still do that before using the Trust card for major transactions.

[PNGMK]

Trust is craps. It's stanchart junk in a wrapper.

[JWNYsg]

Took up GXS in July as part of some invite. Started well with almost 3.5% pa interest but that promo got revised quite quickly to current 2.38% pa

There’s also a function for a loan facility. You get a designated credit and can draw on the loan anytime with payments ranging from minimum 2 months and above. Since interest is calculated daily, if you pay before the stipulated loan dates you save more on interest

They also have a debit card function which I don’t use

[malcontent]

As our family plans to move out of Singapore for at least 7 years, I can see some advantages of having a Trust account. First, the physical card has no expiry - the expiry is found in the app. That (presumably) means I don’t have to worry about replacement cards coming in the mail after we’ve left. Trust has no foreign transaction fees, so I can charge some to keep it alive. Trust has no annual fees, so I don’t have to worry about calling here for a waiver. Trust has no minimum balance requirement, so I don’t have to leave idle cash in the account while we are gone, or worry about account fees.

Only two areas I’ve found where it falls short, one is you can’t add someone as joint account, and second, you can’t set automatic payments for the credit card when due. I imagine the second one will be addressed in the future, and the first one is not a must for me.

Overall, it’s worked fine so far, but time will tell.

[JWNYsg]

Mal. Why not use giro

[the observer]

Here is my assessment after the first time using Trust Bank credit card overseas last week, in my case it was a transaction in Euros.

While I believe Trust Bank doesn’t “add” any foreign transaction fees, the 1% charged by Visa appears to remain — baked into the rate. Even using the absolute worst currency rate traded in the past 24 hours of my transaction, the rate was worse by more than 0.9%. That is far worse that a typical money changer.

While it’s a lot better than most all other credit cards in Singapore, my US cards have no foreign transaction fees and the 1% fee by Visa is absorbed.. so I get super close to mid-market, plus cash back. Considering I only lose 0.5% when I use Wise to transfer SGD to USD, I would still do that before using the Trust card for major transactions.

If you would like to talk about credit card perks and not the savings interest rate component per se, hsbc premier mastercard is worth a mention.

So long as you open an account and credit a minimum of 15k in each month as well. You can use that 15k deposited to pay off bills etc etc.

5% cash back on your credit card bills, and if you link it with instarem when you’re overseas, you’d actually be net earning.

It’s not an advisable option if you can’t credit the minimum sum. There’s a $50 maintenance fee charged each month you fall short.

So it’s ideal if the cash portion of your salary is 15k or more, and you want a credit card that gives you a cash back of 5%, capped at $500.

I have to emphasize, it’s only a viable option if you’re based in sg, and not migrating elsewhere, and regularly crediting your salary in monthly without fail.

[malcontent]

Just an update on overseas usage on the Trust Card. I’ve now made a few more transactions and what I have found is that definitely there is a 1% hidden charge for non-USD. Just yesterday I made a JPY transaction and it came through at 109.5 versus the spot rate of 110.5, so the 1% is there. However, when I make USD transactions, the rate DOES NOT include this 1%, and it’s quite close to spot, within a few tenths of a percent. So for USD transactions I’m pretty happy — using the card is going to be better than even doing a Wise transfer.

[PNGMK]

Good info Mal.