PR application - Aged applicant

[Dracc]

Hi all, it's me again. Earlier this year I have my PR approved under PTS scheme. As shared in my earlier posts, i greatly appreciated the support from the forum!

Wish to seek opinions from the forum readers regarding the PR application of my aunt, pls. Here is her profile:

Race: Chinese
Nationality: PRC
Age: 56
Degree: diploma in education, awarded by NTU
Apply under: spouse scheme. She's been married to a Singaporean for 19 years.
Job: TCM clinic assistant. $1600/mth.
Application submission: May 2023

She has no kid. She is planning to retire in Singapore after staying here for 19 years. The couple owns a HDB 5 room.

Thank you in advance. Pls let me know if you need any other information. : )

[MOCHS]

If under spouse scheme then need the sponsor’s details too.

Generally unfavourable due to age, no kids, and the fact she only want to apply after 19 years here. The boat has sailed. Should have applied much earlier, like 2 years after marriage. It’s obvious to ICA that she could be applying for medical subsidies.

[jalanjalan]

Yeah sponsor information is the vital one if applying under family ties. Not applying for 19 years is quite odd. I can understand it for applying for SC (as you have to give up the other citizenship) but there is really no downside to having PR if staying in SG permanently, that I can think of.
Wouldn't be surprised if they reject.

[Dracc]

If under spouse scheme then need the sponsor’s details too.

Generally unfavourable due to age, no kids, and the fact she only want to apply after 19 years here. The boat has sailed. Should have applied much earlier, like 2 years after marriage. It’s obvious to ICA that she could be applying for medical subsidies.

Aiyo, seems like a slim chance for her then. : (

Her sponsor (my uncle) info is as below:
Age: 76
Race: Chinese
Occupation: Retired
Citizenship: Singaporean
Length of marriage: 19 years, since 2004

This is his 2nd marriage. He had 3 kids from his 1st marriage.

From what I have gathered, they applied PR for my aunt for 5-6 times in the initial years of marriage. All applications were rejected within 3 months. Thereafter my aunt stayed on LTVP. This year she heard that my PR application was approved, so she decided to give another try.

[Dracc]

Yeah sponsor information is the vital one if applying under family ties. Not applying for 19 years is quite odd. I can understand it for applying for SC (as you have to give up the other citizenship) but there is really no downside to having PR if staying in SG permanently, that I can think of.
Wouldn't be surprised if they reject.

They have tried and failed. Well if it is another rejection, then probably she has to start planning on retirement as a foreigner in Singapore.

After 19 years in Singapore, she no longer has active connections with the side of family in China. I will try my best to appeal for her.

[malcontent]

Yeah sponsor information is the vital one if applying under family ties. Not applying for 19 years is quite odd. I can understand it for applying for SC (as you have to give up the other citizenship) but there is really no downside to having PR if staying in SG permanently, that I can think of.
Wouldn't be surprised if they reject.

They have tried and failed. Well if it is another rejection, then probably she has to start planning on retirement as a foreigner in Singapore.

After 19 years in Singapore, she no longer has active connections with the side of family in China. I will try my best to appeal for her.

Is there even a way she can stay here on LTVP if something happens to her husband? Is there a way she can keep their HDB without an occupier that is PR/SC? I doubt the concern is just medical insurance.

Foreigners without immediate family here to sponsor their stay would normally be expected to return home. Some in this situation will seek out a retirement visa in a neighboring country. Singapore does not have such a visa, for obvious reasons.

[NYY1]

Unfortunately, the two issues directly above were going to be my comments/questions as well.

Wish you luck, perhaps 19 years has shown something, although the other challenges and considerations are real. I've even wondered how successful late in the game SC conversions are (one person here did it)? Without kids, many of the same issues exist (there is the aged parent scheme, not sure how often it is used or when they approve).

[MOCHS]

Extended family like auntie/uncle/niece/nephew holds zero value to ICA. Only immediate family like father/mother/son/daughter is taken into consideration.

Being a sponsor means being able to financially sponsor themselves and the foreigner spouse. If her husband is retired aka zero income, how to be a sponsor? Sorry lah, don’t waste any more money on PR applications. Have a Plan B and retire in another country.

If she wants the entire share of the house to go to her, her husband must write a will now or else the inheritance automatically follows the law where the share is divided across the surviving children & spouse. She cannot own the HDB flat as a LTVP holder but can sell the flat and all proceeds go to her as long the will clearly states the flat goes to her only.

[Dracc]

Is there even a way she can stay here on LTVP if something happens to her husband? Is there a way she can keep their HDB without an occupier that is PR/SC? I doubt the concern is just medical insurance.

Foreigners without immediate family here to sponsor their stay would normally be expected to return home. Some in this situation will seek out a retirement visa in a neighboring country. Singapore does not have such a visa, for obvious reasons.

Sadly, I think the answer is No and No. It pains me to contemplate where she is heading and who she can rely on after the passing of my uncle, but I have to be the one to do something for her.

[Dracc]

Unfortunately, the two issues directly above were going to be my comments/questions as well.

Wish you luck, perhaps 19 years has shown something, although the other challenges and considerations are real. I've even wondered how successful late in the game SC conversions are (one person here did it)? Without kids, many of the same issues exist (there is the aged parent scheme, not sure how often it is used or when they approve).

Thank you NYY1 for your well wishes!

Certainly i hope the 19 years can mean something to ICA. But as a gov employee myself I know how pragmatic the SG gov can be. It is improbable for them to help a foreigner or grant PR on compassionate ground.

[Dracc]

Extended family like auntie/uncle/niece/nephew holds zero value to ICA. Only immediate family like father/mother/son/daughter is taken into consideration.

Being a sponsor means being able to financially sponsor themselves and the foreigner spouse. If her husband is retired aka zero income, how to be a sponsor? Sorry lah, don’t waste any more money on PR applications. Have a Plan B and retire in another country.

If she wants the entire share of the house to go to her, her husband must write a will now or else the inheritance automatically follows the law where the share is divided across the surviving children & spouse. She cannot own the HDB flat as a LTVP holder but can sell the flat and all proceeds go to her as long the will clearly states the flat goes to her only.

You are right MOCHS. Well I just find it difficult to discuss with her on "plan B", consider that she has lived here for so long but she must die else where.

[jalanjalan]

Yeah sponsor information is the vital one if applying under family ties. Not applying for 19 years is quite odd. I can understand it for applying for SC (as you have to give up the other citizenship) but there is really no downside to having PR if staying in SG permanently, that I can think of.
Wouldn't be surprised if they reject.

They have tried and failed. Well if it is another rejection, then probably she has to start planning on retirement as a foreigner in Singapore.

After 19 years in Singapore, she no longer has active connections with the side of family in China. I will try my best to appeal for her.

ah. That being the case, I think she already has her answer. This issue has come up in the news before, and as far as I know, in such cases the spouse hasn't any choice but to return to home country.

old article but I don't think much has changed: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/ ... eking-help

[Dracc]

ah. That being the case, I think she already has her answer. This issue has come up in the news before, and as far as I know, in such cases the spouse hasn't any choice but to return to home country.

old article but I don't think much has changed: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/ ... eking-help

Thank you Jalanjalan for sharing the article. I will forward the read to my aunt and discuss with her. : )

I have much empathy for this unseen group of residents in Singapore. Will research further and see if there's anything I can do for them, too.

[malcontent]

In just about any other country, a foreign spouse has the certainty of PR after x number of years of marriage. It seems considerably unfair if they don’t approve her PR after 19 years of marriage. If I were her husband, I would go down and appeal in-person.

My wife (who is a PR) did this when we thought our daughter was unfairly rejected for PR, and our appeal was successful. I recall having to write an appeal letter stating the grounds for our appeal, and one of the things I emphasized was how long we’d been in Singapore.

No guarantees of course, but one thing is for sure… if you don’t try, you don’t get.

Keep us posted on how it goes, and good luck!

[Dracc]

In just about any other country, a foreign spouse has the certainty of PR after x number of years of marriage. It seems considerably unfair if they don’t approve her PR after 19 years of marriage. If I were her husband, I would go down and appeal in-person.

My wife (who is a PR) did this when we thought our daughter was unfairly rejected for PR, and our appeal was successful. I recall having to write an appeal letter stating the grounds for our appeal, and one of the things I emphasized was how long we’d been in Singapore.

No guarantees of course, but one thing is for sure… if you don’t try, you don’t get.

Keep us posted on how it goes, and good luck!

I want to express my gratitude to you, Malcontent, on behalf of my aunt and myself. Together with my uncle, we'll put our hearts into working out an appeal plan (I hope it will never be used) following your advice. I'll keep the forum updated, whether the application gets approved or not.