Not sure whether to renounce citizenship yet

[gold.spot]

I see a lot of talk about this - but you WILL face an issue when going into and out of India. You are not allowed a foreign citizenship as an Indian citizen, so keeping both will screw things up for you.

If you travel to India, you have no basis to go to India as you have no visa to India and you cannot apply for one (on your Singapore passport) - but you can show your India passport to the airlines and cross Immigration on your SG passport. But when you leave India, you will be asked what the basis is for you to come to Singapore. You have no EP, no DP, no PR - you have a SG passport while holding an Indian passport at the same time. You cannot show your red passport to airlines and travel on your Indian passport while crossing Indian Immigration because you have no Singapore visa on your Indian passport. You cannot cross Indian immigration on your red passport either because you don't have an entry stamp on your Singapore passport (not to mention no Indian visa). Just based on logic, I confirm you will get caught.

If you don't know, let me tell you - there are no autogates in India at the moment. You cannot exit India without meeting an immigration officer.

Now there is a way to skim around this - which is to travel to a third country before coming to Singapore. But this will have to be done every time you travel. Even then, the next time you travel to India they are going to ask you upon entry what you were doing outside the country for so long. With this method, its only a matter of time before you get caught.

What nobody has told you is to apply for an OCI card after renouncing your Indian passport. This is the legal way for you to maintain 'ties' with India after renouncement. You are given a lifelong 'visa' for entry to India with no stay restrictions. Consider it an Indian PR with no resiency requirements. Plus, to regain Indian citizenship requires a 1 year stay in India thereafter.

You get caught ONE time by India holding two passports, I guarantee your OCI will not be approved thereafter. It is easier to climb Everest than for Indian bureaucracy to overturn a bad record in immigration matters in India.

[Lisafuller]

I see a lot of talk about this - but you WILL face an issue when going into and out of India. You are not allowed a foreign citizenship as an Indian citizen, so keeping both will screw things up for you.

If you travel to India, you have no basis to go to India as you have no visa to India and you cannot apply for one (on your Singapore passport) - but you can show your India passport to the airlines and cross Immigration on your SG passport. But when you leave India, you will be asked what the basis is for you to come to Singapore. You have no EP, no DP, no PR - you have a SG passport while holding an Indian passport at the same time. You cannot show your red passport to airlines and travel on your Indian passport while crossing Indian Immigration because you have no Singapore visa on your Indian passport. You cannot cross Indian immigration on your red passport either because you don't have an entry stamp on your Singapore passport (not to mention no Indian visa). Just based on logic, I confirm you will get caught.

If you don't know, let me tell you - there are no autogates in India at the moment. You cannot exit India without meeting an immigration officer.

Now there is a way to skim around this - which is to travel to a third country before coming to Singapore. But this will have to be done every time you travel. Even then, the next time you travel to India they are going to ask you upon entry what you were doing outside the country for so long. With this method, its only a matter of time before you get caught.

What nobody has told you is to apply for an OCI card after renouncing your Indian passport. This is the legal way for you to maintain 'ties' with India after renouncement. You are given a lifelong 'visa' for entry to India with no stay restrictions. Consider it an Indian PR with no resiency requirements. Plus, to regain Indian citizenship requires a 1 year stay in India thereafter.

You get caught ONE time by India holding two passports, I guarantee your OCI will not be approved thereafter. It is easier to climb Everest than for Indian bureaucracy to overturn a bad record in immigration matters in India.

Just wondering, would it be OK to enter India using the Indian passport, exit with it as well, and then use the Singapore passport to re-enter Singapore? That's what we always used to do for our daughter when going back to visit the US. She'd leave singapore with her singapore passport, and enter the US with her American passport, and then do the same on the way out. Never had any issues.

[Lisafuller]

Hi Thrinayan,

I checked with Indian Embassy and apparently minors are not allowed to hold 2 passports. Hence required to renounce Indian citizenship.
May I check if you did renounce before receiving Singapore citizenship?

OP mentioned she did not renounce. That's what this entire thread is about.

I’m a male, not a female


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My bad.

[ThrinayanS]

I see a lot of talk about this - but you WILL face an issue when going into and out of India. You are not allowed a foreign citizenship as an Indian citizen, so keeping both will screw things up for you.

If you travel to India, you have no basis to go to India as you have no visa to India and you cannot apply for one (on your Singapore passport) - but you can show your India passport to the airlines and cross Immigration on your SG passport. But when you leave India, you will be asked what the basis is for you to come to Singapore. You have no EP, no DP, no PR - you have a SG passport while holding an Indian passport at the same time. You cannot show your red passport to airlines and travel on your Indian passport while crossing Indian Immigration because you have no Singapore visa on your Indian passport. You cannot cross Indian immigration on your red passport either because you don't have an entry stamp on your Singapore passport (not to mention no Indian visa). Just based on logic, I confirm you will get caught.

If you don't know, let me tell you - there are no autogates in India at the moment. You cannot exit India without meeting an immigration officer.

Now there is a way to skim around this - which is to travel to a third country before coming to Singapore. But this will have to be done every time you travel. Even then, the next time you travel to India they are going to ask you upon entry what you were doing outside the country for so long. With this method, its only a matter of time before you get caught.

What nobody has told you is to apply for an OCI card after renouncing your Indian passport. This is the legal way for you to maintain 'ties' with India after renouncement. You are given a lifelong 'visa' for entry to India with no stay restrictions. Consider it an Indian PR with no resiency requirements. Plus, to regain Indian citizenship requires a 1 year stay in India thereafter.

You get caught ONE time by India holding two passports, I guarantee your OCI will not be approved thereafter. It is easier to climb Everest than for Indian bureaucracy to overturn a bad record in immigration matters in India.

I see. In that case i think it’s best to renounce citizenship


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[gold.spot]

Just wondering, would it be OK to enter India using the Indian passport, exit with it as well, and then use the Singapore passport to re-enter Singapore? That's what we always used to do for our daughter when going back to visit the US. She'd leave singapore with her singapore passport, and enter the US with her American passport, and then do the same on the way out. Never had any issues.

The US has no issues about a person having a second citizenship. India does (even for minors, unlike Singapore).

[Lisafuller]

Just wondering, would it be OK to enter India using the Indian passport, exit with it as well, and then use the Singapore passport to re-enter Singapore? That's what we always used to do for our daughter when going back to visit the US. She'd leave singapore with her singapore passport, and enter the US with her American passport, and then do the same on the way out. Never had any issues.

The US has no issues about a person having a second citizenship. India does (even for minors, unlike Singapore).

My daughter is 20.

[Lisafuller]

I see a lot of talk about this - but you WILL face an issue when going into and out of India. You are not allowed a foreign citizenship as an Indian citizen, so keeping both will screw things up for you.

If you travel to India, you have no basis to go to India as you have no visa to India and you cannot apply for one (on your Singapore passport) - but you can show your India passport to the airlines and cross Immigration on your SG passport. But when you leave India, you will be asked what the basis is for you to come to Singapore. You have no EP, no DP, no PR - you have a SG passport while holding an Indian passport at the same time. You cannot show your red passport to airlines and travel on your Indian passport while crossing Indian Immigration because you have no Singapore visa on your Indian passport. You cannot cross Indian immigration on your red passport either because you don't have an entry stamp on your Singapore passport (not to mention no Indian visa). Just based on logic, I confirm you will get caught.

If you don't know, let me tell you - there are no autogates in India at the moment. You cannot exit India without meeting an immigration officer.

Now there is a way to skim around this - which is to travel to a third country before coming to Singapore. But this will have to be done every time you travel. Even then, the next time you travel to India they are going to ask you upon entry what you were doing outside the country for so long. With this method, its only a matter of time before you get caught.

What nobody has told you is to apply for an OCI card after renouncing your Indian passport. This is the legal way for you to maintain 'ties' with India after renouncement. You are given a lifelong 'visa' for entry to India with no stay restrictions. Consider it an Indian PR with no resiency requirements. Plus, to regain Indian citizenship requires a 1 year stay in India thereafter.

You get caught ONE time by India holding two passports, I guarantee your OCI will not be approved thereafter. It is easier to climb Everest than for Indian bureaucracy to overturn a bad record in immigration matters in India.

I see. In that case i think it’s best to renounce citizenship


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If Gold spot is right (which I suspect is the case) then it would be smart for you to renounce.

[gold.spot]

Just wondering, would it be OK to enter India using the Indian passport, exit with it as well, and then use the Singapore passport to re-enter Singapore? That's what we always used to do for our daughter when going back to visit the US. She'd leave singapore with her singapore passport, and enter the US with her American passport, and then do the same on the way out. Never had any issues.

The US has no issues about a person having a second citizenship. India does (even for minors, unlike Singapore).

My daughter is 20.

Still no issue legally. She's allowed to hold her US passport and Singapore passport at the same time until she crosses 20, which is less than a year away. After that, she's required to take an oath at ICA within 12 months of crossing 20 and show renunciation documents from the US. At that point in time she has to either lose her Singapore citizenship or lose her US citizenship or play a double game with the Singapore government.

Age of majority in Singapore is 21. Age of majority in India is 18.

Edit: minor corrections

[gold.spot]

Just wondering, would it be OK to enter India using the Indian passport, exit with it as well, and then use the Singapore passport to re-enter Singapore? That's what we always used to do for our daughter when going back to visit the US. She'd leave singapore with her singapore passport, and enter the US with her American passport, and then do the same on the way out. Never had any issues.

So the logic fails at the point where he's trying to leave India on an India passport. It's not like the US where leaving the US does not require an exit stamp (if I'm not wrong). When leaving India, he will face an immigration officer, who will ask him, a purported Indian citizen, what he is doing in Singapore. He has no proof of anything to show his legal stay in Singapore other than his Singapore passport.

Check mate.

[Lisafuller]

Just wondering, would it be OK to enter India using the Indian passport, exit with it as well, and then use the Singapore passport to re-enter Singapore? That's what we always used to do for our daughter when going back to visit the US. She'd leave singapore with her singapore passport, and enter the US with her American passport, and then do the same on the way out. Never had any issues.

So the logic fails at the point where he's trying to leave India on an India passport. It's not like the US where leaving the US does not require an exit stamp (if I'm not wrong). When leaving India, he will face an immigration officer, who will ask him, a purported Indian citizen, what he is doing in Singapore. He has no proof of anything to show his legal stay in Singapore other than his Singapore passport.

Check mate.

Ah, that's how they get ya. And what happens then?

[Lisafuller]

The US has no issues about a person having a second citizenship. India does (even for minors, unlike Singapore).

My daughter is 20.

Still no issue legally. She's allowed to hold her US passport and Singapore passport at the same time until she crosses 20, which is less than a year away. After that, she's required to take an oath at ICA within 12 months of crossing 20 and show renunciation documents from the US. At that point in time she has to either lose her Singapore citizenship or lose her US citizenship or play a double game with the Singapore government.

Age of majority in Singapore is 21. Age of majority in India is 18.

Edit: minor corrections

I read somewhere a while back that minors can hold on to their citizenship past the age of majority provided they do not exercise their citizenship rights. Not sure if the rights in question refer to singaporean or foreign citizenship rights.

[MOCHS]

LMAO using a passport is already exercising citizenship rights.

ICA is also starting to crack down on dual-citizen females as well. Better follow the law.

[Lisafuller]

Well, she's not 21 yet so she still has time. And technically if we move back to the US she can leave Singapore and move purely on her American passport, so she would cease to exercise her citizenship rights from that point forward. Though I do see how being unable to make use of the passport would negate the need for Singapore citizenship in the first place.

[NYY1]

For minors that received SC by descent or registration, they need to take the Oath (ORAL) after turning 21 years old (and before they turn 22 years old). That is clear in 122(4) and 126(3) of the Constitution.

For minors that obtained SC by birth and foreign by descent (or possibly birth depending on how the birth certificate was issued), you need to read 134(1)(a), 135(1)(a)-(b), 135(2) of the Constitution. 134 deals with acquiring or retaining a foreign citizenship after the age of 18 and 135 deals with the exercise of rights of foreign nationals.

[Lisafuller]

For minors that received SC by descent or registration, they need to take the Oath (ORAL) after turning 21 years old (and before they turn 22 years old). That is clear in 122(4) and 126(3) of the Constitution.

For minors that obtained SC by birth and foreign by descent (or possibly birth depending on how the birth certificate was issued), you need to read 134(1)(a), 135(1)(a)-(b), 135(2) of the Constitution. 134 deals with acquiring or retaining a foreign citizenship after the age of 18 and 135 deals with the exercise of rights of foreign nationals.

She was born in Singapore, and acquired American citizenship by descent, so she falls in to the second group.