Stupid news articles

[Lisafuller]

This would be of great interest to many Singaporeans, but they'll never read about it in ST/CNA.

https://kenjeyaretnam.com/2023/05/12/ho ... e-a-guide/

I obviously have no way of knowing whether they leased the properties through the proper channels, but at the very least living in these massive mansions seems incongruent with the down to earth personas they try to portray as ministers. Hard to see them as "one of us" when most of us would never be able to afford to live in such homes.

[Lisafuller]

This would be of great interest to many Singaporeans, but they'll never read about it in ST/CNA.

https://kenjeyaretnam.com/2023/05/12/ho ... e-a-guide/

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapo ... la-3485161

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/ ... procedures

Incidentally, anyone can bid on SLA properties, and the amounts of the winning bid are in their website, 6mos back. The atas bungalows are going for about 30k/mo. There are less atas ones for 6-8k.

I recalled reading that the yearly rental based on land size would be closer to 2 million than 300,000.

[NYY1]

I agree that healthy competition can be great at motivating and pushing children to be their very best. Unfortunately though, that's not really what we see here.

I wouldn't assume all kids here are only exposed to unhealthy competition. I know numerous kids of varying academic ability that have benefitted from healthy competition. Many are student athletes (some even in the blah blah blah schools) that had little chance of being above average academically yet they let the school and peers help push them along (faster). Others were the kids that were born lucky and could excel academically without excessive effort and they were going neck and neck with peers for years.

In the end, not everyone got the prized university admission, but they are all happy and probably further along than they would otherwise be.

So it all depends. But yes, many kids are either forced to race (either directly or implicitly) by their parents or become self-addicted to the race. Unfortunately, when you look at the numbers, winning at P6 (PSLE) or S4 (O Levels) doesn't 'mean you will win (as per public opinion of greatness or prestige) at the end of 12 years. Acknowledging and accepting this doesn't make one any less ambitious either, but it can change how he/she approaches the situation and his/her attitude.

Maybe it comes down to the kind of circles you run in. The kids who I've met as friends of my daughter or children of my friends mostly go to a certain kind of school and involve themselves in certain kinds of activities, if you get what I mean. They are hungry to beat out others and mostly feed in to the competitiveness.

Pretty presumptuous to assume (all of) the people I'm talking about are of lesser academic ability or less ambitious or didn't go to certain schools. They are/were competitive and benefit(ed) from healthy competition; not everyone has this unhealthy competition mindset or behaviour, and that's what I was responding to.

Likely, birds of a feather flock together; kids and parents with similar attitudes seem to end up associating with each other and some then think that's everyone here (it's not).

Lastly, please don't assume kids with this other mindset don't get into the most selective or best of the best universities because some of them did. And the kids that didn't get in or weren't at that level/capability were still happy to go elsewhere instead of just complaining about how things aren't fair, blah blah blah.

[jalanjalan]

This would be of great interest to many Singaporeans, but they'll never read about it in ST/CNA.

https://kenjeyaretnam.com/2023/05/12/ho ... e-a-guide/

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapo ... la-3485161

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/ ... procedures

Incidentally, anyone can bid on SLA properties, and the amounts of the winning bid are in their website, 6mos back. The atas bungalows are going for about 30k/mo. There are less atas ones for 6-8k.

I recalled reading that the yearly rental based on land size would be closer to 2 million than 300,000.

I dunno how SLA formulates its guide rent, I was quoting from the site itself where they list the winning bids.
Anyway, my point was, anyone can bid on them.

Some people have really gone all out to decorate, even though it's a rental:
https://www.insider.com/singapore-black ... tos-2022-5

[tiktok]

Recent winning bid for this property was 31k:
https://app.sla.gov.sg/spio/preview/SPIO2022110010E

If we extrapolate by land area:
This property: 51,032 sq ft
26 Ridout road (tenant Shanmugan): 306,930 sq ft
Guide rent should in the region of 180k (approx 2m a year).

[Lisafuller]

I wouldn't assume all kids here are only exposed to unhealthy competition. I know numerous kids of varying academic ability that have benefitted from healthy competition. Many are student athletes (some even in the blah blah blah schools) that had little chance of being above average academically yet they let the school and peers help push them along (faster). Others were the kids that were born lucky and could excel academically without excessive effort and they were going neck and neck with peers for years.

In the end, not everyone got the prized university admission, but they are all happy and probably further along than they would otherwise be.

So it all depends. But yes, many kids are either forced to race (either directly or implicitly) by their parents or become self-addicted to the race. Unfortunately, when you look at the numbers, winning at P6 (PSLE) or S4 (O Levels) doesn't 'mean you will win (as per public opinion of greatness or prestige) at the end of 12 years. Acknowledging and accepting this doesn't make one any less ambitious either, but it can change how he/she approaches the situation and his/her attitude.

Maybe it comes down to the kind of circles you run in. The kids who I've met as friends of my daughter or children of my friends mostly go to a certain kind of school and involve themselves in certain kinds of activities, if you get what I mean. They are hungry to beat out others and mostly feed in to the competitiveness.

Pretty presumptuous to assume (all of) the people I'm talking about are of lesser academic ability or less ambitious or didn't go to certain schools. They are/were competitive and benefit(ed) from healthy competition; not everyone has this unhealthy competition mindset or behaviour, and that's what I was responding to.

Likely, birds of a feather flock together; kids and parents with similar attitudes seem to end up associating with each other and some then think that's everyone here (it's not).

Lastly, please don't assume kids with this other mindset don't get into the most selective or best of the best universities because some of them did. And the kids that didn't get in or weren't at that level/capability were still happy to go elsewhere instead of just complaining about how things aren't fair, blah blah blah.

I believe you've misunderstood me. I was very clear that this is the case with the kids I know, not with all kids in singapore. I was making an observation that the kids I know who are/were educated in elite schools with competitive environments tend to feed in to the competition.

[Lisafuller]

Recent winning bid for this property was 31k:
https://app.sla.gov.sg/spio/preview/SPIO2022110010E

If we extrapolate by land area:
This property: 51,032 sq ft
26 Ridout road (tenant Shanmugan): 306,930 sq ft
Guide rent should in the region of 180k (approx 2m a year).

Makes sense. Perhaps that's where they got the figure from. If the rental is actually 2 million a year, I would really struggle to understand how the ministers afford. Even with their minesterial salaries and assuming their partners work, it seems financially improbable that they'd be able to afford it.

[Lisafuller]

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapo ... la-3485161

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/ ... procedures

Incidentally, anyone can bid on SLA properties, and the amounts of the winning bid are in their website, 6mos back. The atas bungalows are going for about 30k/mo. There are less atas ones for 6-8k.

I recalled reading that the yearly rental based on land size would be closer to 2 million than 300,000.

I dunno how SLA formulates its guide rent, I was quoting from the site itself where they list the winning bids.
Anyway, my point was, anyone can bid on them.

Some people have really gone all out to decorate, even though it's a rental:
https://www.insider.com/singapore-black ... tos-2022-5

Actually, upon reading a little deeper into the issue, I believe the problem some members of the public have isn't about whether or not the properties were rented legally, but more about how the ministers are able to afford them at all if they're supposed to be making the salaries of public servants, and on the same note, why they would choose these properties if they are supposed to be living among the people.

[sundaymorningstaple]

I recalled reading that the yearly rental based on land size would be closer to 2 million than 300,000.

I dunno how SLA formulates its guide rent, I was quoting from the site itself where they list the winning bids.
Anyway, my point was, anyone can bid on them.

Some people have really gone all out to decorate, even though it's a rental:
https://www.insider.com/singapore-black ... tos-2022-5

Actually, upon reading a little deeper into the issue, I believe the problem some members of the public have isn't about whether or not the properties were rented legally, but more about how the ministers are able to afford them at all if they're supposed to be making the salaries of public servants, and on the same note, why they would choose these properties if they are supposed to be living among the people.

I wasn't aware that there was a moratorium on whether Ministers were not allowed to be rich before become involved in politics. They have excellent educations for the most part and came from high paying positions in public life. The may have inherited sizeable estates from their families and those investment may well be sufficient to allow one to pay that type of rental if one really wanted to have a lot of land and greenery around them. Just sayin'....

[NYY1]

I believe you've misunderstood me. I was very clear that this is the case with the kids I know, not with all kids in singapore. I was making an observation that the kids I know who are/were educated in elite schools with competitive environments tend to feed in to the competition.

OK. I replied in the context of your original reply, which seemed to suggest there was no healthy competition. Regardless, we can move on from this and I apologise if in misinterpreted what you were trying to say.

But I will add it is not just the type of schools mentioned above, although they are the most highly streamed and would stand to benefit from such behaviour (obviously, there are also negative aspects that come out of this arrangement too). Spend time understanding what some kids that a) weren't so lucky to score as well or b) have distinct interests besides academics are doing and one can see a bunch of good things. Of course, there are many students that do otherwise as well (I'm not trying to deny it exists but everyone has a choice on how they approach things).

[Lisafuller]

I dunno how SLA formulates its guide rent, I was quoting from the site itself where they list the winning bids.
Anyway, my point was, anyone can bid on them.

Some people have really gone all out to decorate, even though it's a rental:
https://www.insider.com/singapore-black ... tos-2022-5

Actually, upon reading a little deeper into the issue, I believe the problem some members of the public have isn't about whether or not the properties were rented legally, but more about how the ministers are able to afford them at all if they're supposed to be making the salaries of public servants, and on the same note, why they would choose these properties if they are supposed to be living among the people.

I wasn't aware that there was a moratorium on whether Ministers were not allowed to be rich before become involved in politics. They have excellent educations for the most part and came from high paying positions in public life. The may have inherited sizeable estates from their families and those investment may well be sufficient to allow one to pay that type of rental if one really wanted to have a lot of land and greenery around them. Just sayin'....

I considered that, but it seems highly unlikely that they would have been able to earn enough over the course of their careers before joining politics, and after to be in a position to spend that much on rental, which would be just one of many expenses.

At any rate, I'm not suggesting that anything dishonest is going on, I'm just saying that I understand why some people might have that idea.

[Lisafuller]

I believe you've misunderstood me. I was very clear that this is the case with the kids I know, not with all kids in singapore. I was making an observation that the kids I know who are/were educated in elite schools with competitive environments tend to feed in to the competition.

OK. I replied in the context of your original reply, which seemed to suggest there was no healthy competition. Regardless, we can move on from this and I apologise if in misinterpreted what you were trying to say.

But I will add it is not just the type of schools mentioned above, although they are the most highly streamed and would stand to benefit from such behaviour (obviously, there are also negative aspects that come out of this arrangement too). Spend time understanding what some kids that a) weren't so lucky to score as well or b) have distinct interests besides academics are doing and one can see a bunch of good things. Of course, there are many students that do otherwise as well (I'm not trying to deny it exists but everyone has a choice on how they approach things).

Don't worry about it, I've enjoyed all our other conversations about education.

And yes, I definitely see your point. Not all kids are born into the same circumstances but that doesn't mean that they will achieve any less, or are any less hungry for success. More than that, it's also important for us to look inwards, and see how we define success. There's a lot more to it than just numbers.

[jalanjalan]

Actually, upon reading a little deeper into the issue, I believe the problem some members of the public have isn't about whether or not the properties were rented legally, but more about how the ministers are able to afford them at all if they're supposed to be making the salaries of public servants, and on the same note, why they would choose these properties if they are supposed to be living among the people.

Most comments just sound like green-eyed envy to me.
Ridout is next to HDB actually - I used to live across the street from that cute McDonalds tea garden.

[tiktok]

Can't really blame people for being jealous - those properties are massive and the rents could be very sweet.

The more serious allegation is they have broken the Code of Conduct for Ministers, specifically:

A Minister must scrupulously avoid any actual or apparent conflict of interest between his office and his private financial interests. Such a conflict, or a perception of conflict, can arise
(a) from the exercise of powers or influence in a way that benefits or may be seen to benefit private interests held; or
(b) from using special knowledge acquired in the course of his activities as Minister to bring benefit or avoid loss (or could arouse reasonable suspicion of this) in relation to his private financial interests.

Bearing in mind one of them oversees the SLA and certainly "could arouse suspicion" of "using special knowledge acquired in the course of his activities as Minister to bring benefit".

[jalanjalan]

Can't really blame people for being jealous - those properties are massive and the rents could be very sweet.

The more serious allegation is they have broken the Code of Conduct for Ministers, specifically:

A Minister must scrupulously avoid any actual or apparent conflict of interest between his office and his private financial interests. Such a conflict, or a perception of conflict, can arise
(a) from the exercise of powers or influence in a way that benefits or may be seen to benefit private interests held; or
(b) from using special knowledge acquired in the course of his activities as Minister to bring benefit or avoid loss (or could arouse reasonable suspicion of this) in relation to his private financial interests.

Bearing in mind one of them oversees the SLA and certainly "could arouse suspicion" of "using special knowledge acquired in the course of his activities as Minister to bring benefit".

Hmm, people with long standing gripes alleging things, when an election is coming up. I'll make popcorn and watch a little before I grab my virtual torch and pitchfork.

And, no, jealousy is no reason for a public tantrum. Anyone can bid to rent these places. There are even term limits to how long any individual can rent so more people can get a chance. This isn't any secret insider club - it was all over the news with the Chip Bee rentals years ago.