Question on renunsciation of Citizenship by descent (for Mad Scientist)

[StarSight]

Hi Mad Scientist,

I have a question for you about renunsciation of Singapore Citizenship by descent for a child, particularly as my son is about to turn 13 this year. Here is a recap of my situation, i need to confirm my steps are correct, please reach out to me, thanks:

Background:

1) Over 15 years ago I moved overseas to country X (where me and my family reside). My wife is and always has been a foreign national.

2) My son was born overseas and has been a citizen of the country X from birth.

3) I applied for my son's Singapore citizenship by descent when he was 1 year old and hence he has been a dual citizen of Singapore and Country X, since. As I do not wish for hin to take the Oath of allegiance at 21, his Singapore Citizenship will cease within 12 months of him turning 21.

4) I have renounced my Singapore Citizenship, withdrawn my CPF and have no assets whatsoever or ties to Singapore.

5) My son has not held a Singapore passport or IC and has never lived in Singapore. He has only ever travelled to Singapore once in his life for a short family holiday (before turning 11), with the family as a Citizen of Country X, on his foreign passport.

6) I have written to both ICA and CMPB seperately on my intention to renounce my child's Singapore citizenship (about 2 years ago when he was 11) and have been informed he can only renounce his citizenship by descent, when 21.

7) I was also advised by CMPB that a request for deferment from NS pending renunsciation at the age of 21, can only be assessed once the child turns 13 years of age.

Next Steps

1) I plan to contact CMPB again when he turns 13 this year, and request for application for deferment until he turns 21.

2) My expectation is that the application should be accepted for him to renounce at 21 and if so , CMPB will provide him another exit permit until 21 and then at 21 he can go to any Singapore Mission to renounce within 3 months of him turning 21 ?

Mad Scientist, if you could please confirm I haven't missed anything from the above that would be appreciated. Ideally, I am hoping for a positive outcome as me and my family are foreign citizens and this issue has been giving me stress for over a decade.

[PNGMK]

WTF did you even register him as a Sinkie? For what it's worth I don't think you've missed anything except the bond issue for sons outside Singapore./ If that comes up then register for 364 days (less than a year at a time). Make sure ICA always have your address accurate so you don't miss any notices.

[StarSight]

Agreed, shouldn't have registered him as a dual citizen in the first place, not fully understanding that renunsication is only being possible at 21, even if the child has never lived in Singapore. Can't change that now, so will have to look forward.

I would think the bond issue becomes a factor if the application to defer from 13 to 21 (pending renunsciation on family migration grounds) is not accepted. If so, then 364 days at a time would be the go.

[Mad Scientist]

Hi Mad Scientist,

I have a question for you about renunsciation(wrong spelling RENUNCIATION, seriously!!) of Singapore Citizenship by descent for a child, particularly as my son is about to turn 13 this year. Here is a recap of my situation, i need to confirm my steps are correct, please reach out to me, thanks:
Your lucky day , I'm back on board for a wee while
Background:

1) Over 15 years ago I moved overseas to country X (where me and my family reside). My wife is and always has been a foreign national.


2) My son was born overseas and has been a citizen of the country X from birth.
ok

3) I applied for my son's Singapore citizenship by descent when he was 1 year old and hence he has been a dual citizen of Singapore and Country X, since. As I do not wish for hin to take the Oath of allegiance at 21, his Singapore Citizenship will cease within 12 months of him turning 21.
Well done, you have learn well my padawan. You still need to renounce be it the child is a male or female once you apply SC by descent

4) I have renounced my Singapore Citizenship, withdrawn my CPF and have no assets whatsoever or ties to Singapore.
OK, good on you
5) My son has not held a Singapore passport or IC and has never lived in Singapore. He has only ever travelled to Singapore once in his life for a short family holiday (before turning 11), with the family as a Citizen of Country X, on his foreign passport.
Excellent !!

6) I have written to both ICA and CMPB seperately on my intention to renounce my child's Singapore citizenship (about 2 years ago when he was 11) and have been informed he can only renounce his citizenship by descent, when 21.
Good

7) I was also advised by CMPB that a request for deferment from NS pending renunsciation at the age of 21, can only be assessed once the child turns 13 years of age.
Yup, that's correct from what I understood. Been there and done that

Next Steps

1) I plan to contact CMPB again when he turns 13 this year, and request for application for deferment until he turns 21.
Apply Exit Permit first when he turns 13. Apply 1 year and 364 days.
Contact CMPB with your Exit Permit number then do the process.
You will receive another letter if they approve deferment pending renounciation at 21. When he turns 16 1/2 of age, CMPB will contact you again and that you will get an extension on your Exit Permit till 21. If they did not email or sent you a letter to that effect. For Pete's sake , contact them. Do not wait before everything hits the fan.

2) My expectation is that the application should be accepted for him to renounce at 21 and if so , CMPB will provide him another exit permit until 21 and then at 21 he can go to any Singapore Mission to renounce within 3 months of him turning 21 ?
If you cross all the dots and tick all the T, you will get it

Mad Scientist, if you could please confirm I haven't missed anything from the above that would be appreciated. Ideally, I am hoping for a positive outcome as me and my family are foreign citizens and this issue has been giving me stress for over a decade.

Please do not stress out, it is just the most important thing in your life and you only have one chance down the slippery slope.

[PNGMK]

I am in the middle of helping my son renounce his Australian citizenship (completed now) and taking the oath of allegiance to Singapore once he turns 21 on Sunday. The process is quite interesting. If you advice let me know.

[Lisafuller]

Agreed, shouldn't have registered him as a dual citizen in the first place, not fully understanding that renunsication is only being possible at 21, even if the child has never lived in Singapore. Can't change that now, so will have to look forward.

I would think the bond issue becomes a factor if the application to defer from 13 to 21 (pending renunsciation on family migration grounds) is not accepted. If so, then 364 days at a time would be the go.

At least you realized it before he turned 13 but I’m just curious, why would you have registered him at all in the first place?

[Lisafuller]

I am in the middle of helping my son renounce his Australian citizenship (completed now) and taking the oath of allegiance to Singapore once he turns 21 on Sunday. The process is quite interesting. If you advice let me know.

How did he acquire Australian citizenship? I don’t remember you being aussie, is your wife?

[Lisafuller]

Hi Mad Scientist,

I have a question for you about renunsciation(wrong spelling RENUNCIATION, seriously!!) of Singapore Citizenship by descent for a child, particularly as my son is about to turn 13 this year. Here is a recap of my situation, i need to confirm my steps are correct, please reach out to me, thanks:
Your lucky day , I'm back on board for a wee while
Background:

1) Over 15 years ago I moved overseas to country X (where me and my family reside). My wife is and always has been a foreign national.


2) My son was born overseas and has been a citizen of the country X from birth.
ok

3) I applied for my son's Singapore citizenship by descent when he was 1 year old and hence he has been a dual citizen of Singapore and Country X, since. As I do not wish for hin to take the Oath of allegiance at 21, his Singapore Citizenship will cease within 12 months of him turning 21.
Well done, you have learn well my padawan. You still need to renounce be it the child is a male or female once you apply SC by descent

4) I have renounced my Singapore Citizenship, withdrawn my CPF and have no assets whatsoever or ties to Singapore.
OK, good on you
5) My son has not held a Singapore passport or IC and has never lived in Singapore. He has only ever travelled to Singapore once in his life for a short family holiday (before turning 11), with the family as a Citizen of Country X, on his foreign passport.
Excellent !!

6) I have written to both ICA and CMPB seperately on my intention to renounce my child's Singapore citizenship (about 2 years ago when he was 11) and have been informed he can only renounce his citizenship by descent, when 21.
Good

7) I was also advised by CMPB that a request for deferment from NS pending renunsciation at the age of 21, can only be assessed once the child turns 13 years of age.
Yup, that's correct from what I understood. Been there and done that

Next Steps

1) I plan to contact CMPB again when he turns 13 this year, and request for application for deferment until he turns 21.
Apply Exit Permit first when he turns 13. Apply 1 year and 364 days.
Contact CMPB with your Exit Permit number then do the process.
You will receive another letter if they approve deferment pending renounciation at 21. When he turns 16 1/2 of age, CMPB will contact you again and that you will get an extension on your Exit Permit till 21. If they did not email or sent you a letter to that effect. For Pete's sake , contact them. Do not wait before everything hits the fan.

2) My expectation is that the application should be accepted for him to renounce at 21 and if so , CMPB will provide him another exit permit until 21 and then at 21 he can go to any Singapore Mission to renounce within 3 months of him turning 21 ?
If you cross all the dots and tick all the T, you will get it

Mad Scientist, if you could please confirm I haven't missed anything from the above that would be appreciated. Ideally, I am hoping for a positive outcome as me and my family are foreign citizens and this issue has been giving me stress for over a decade.

Please do not stress out, it is just the most important thing in your life and you only have one chance down the slippery slope.

LOL! Reminds me of something Kevin O’Leary would say on shark tank.

[PNGMK]

I am in the middle of helping my son renounce his Australian citizenship (completed now) and taking the oath of allegiance to Singapore once he turns 21 on Sunday. The process is quite interesting. If you advice let me know.

No actually, from myself and he was born in Australia so acquired it naturally.
How did he acquire Australian citizenship? I don’t remember you being aussie, is your wife?

[sundaymorningstaple]

Yep, he's an Aussie through and through!

[Mad Scientist]

PNGMK; On the Oath of Allegiance day, from memory, they require you to submit you son foreign passport cancellation, renounciation of foreign citizenship etc, There a few more other docs you have to provide before the Angkat Sumpah. For the life of memory , it just slipped my mind
One thing though , your son can still regain AUS PP before 27 or 30 not sure the exact age.
That said you still have a back order open if you get what I said. AUS government allows this in particular if your son has to renounce for the sake of NS liabilities etc... Been there and done that. Your son may want to change his mind. The back door back to AUS is always open. Food for thought ??

[Mad Scientist]

PNGMK; On the Oath of Allegiance day, from memory, they require your to submit you son foreign passport cancellation, renounciation of foreign citizenship etc, There a few more other docs you have to provide before the Angkat Sumpah. For the life of me , it just slipped my mind
One thing though , your son can still regain AUS PP before 27 or 30 not sure the exact age.
That said you still have a back order open if you get what I said. AUS government allows this in particular if your son has to renounce for the sake of NS liabilities etc... Been there and done that. Your son may want to change his mind. The back door back to AUS is always open. Food for thought ??

[PNGMK]

PNGMK; On the Oath of Allegiance day, from memory, they require your to submit you son foreign passport cancellation, renounciation of foreign citizenship etc, There a few more other docs you have to provide before the Angkat Sumpah. For the life of me , it just slipped my mind
One thing though , your son can still regain AUS PP before 27 or 30 not sure the exact age.
That said you still have a back order open if you get what I said. AUS government allows this in particular if your son has to renounce for the sake of NS liabilities etc... Been there and done that. Your son may want to change his mind. The back door back to AUS is always open. Food for thought ??

Yes correct. The Australian govt has a website that outlines the process for Renunciation and states specifically which reasons given for Renunciation will allow a person to reapply for Aussie citizenship at a later date. Reasons such as financial hardship and compulsory requirements (ie national service) are seen as valid and should be stated by the applicant at the time of Renunciation.

There is no age limit to reapply for resumption of Aussie citizenship actually. You just need to have requested Renunciation under duress as above and the immigration minister will almost certainly allow you to regain your Australian citizenship.

For the process of taking the oath of allegiance we need to take in the letter from Australia and his Singapore naturalisation cert and Singapore IC. He does not have a valid Australian passport so that is moot.

[Lisafuller]

PNGMK; On the Oath of Allegiance day, from memory, they require your to submit you son foreign passport cancellation, renounciation of foreign citizenship etc, There a few more other docs you have to provide before the Angkat Sumpah. For the life of me , it just slipped my mind
One thing though , your son can still regain AUS PP before 27 or 30 not sure the exact age.
That said you still have a back order open if you get what I said. AUS government allows this in particular if your son has to renounce for the sake of NS liabilities etc... Been there and done that. Your son may want to change his mind. The back door back to AUS is always open. Food for thought ??

Yes correct. The Australian govt has a website that outlines the process for Renunciation and states specifically which reasons given for Renunciation will allow a person to reapply for Aussie citizenship at a later date. Reasons such as financial hardship and compulsory requirements (ie national service) are seen as valid and should be stated by the applicant at the time of Renunciation.

There is no age limit to reapply for resumption of Aussie citizenship actually. You just need to have requested Renunciation under duress as above and the immigration minister will almost certainly allow you to regain your Australian citizenship.

For the process of taking the oath of allegiance we need to take in the letter from Australia and his Singapore naturalisation cert and Singapore IC. He does not have a valid Australian passport so that is moot.

Is this something you think he might pursue?

[Lisafuller]

PNGMK; On the Oath of Allegiance day, from memory, they require you to submit you son foreign passport cancellation, renounciation of foreign citizenship etc, There a few more other docs you have to provide before the Angkat Sumpah. For the life of memory , it just slipped my mind
One thing though , your son can still regain AUS PP before 27 or 30 not sure the exact age.
That said you still have a back order open if you get what I said. AUS government allows this in particular if your son has to renounce for the sake of NS liabilities etc... Been there and done that. Your son may want to change his mind. The back door back to AUS is always open. Food for thought ??

This is very interesting, I had always assumed most the governments take it personally when you decide to renounce citizenship, and won’t make the path to regaining it as easy. Are there any other countries that do this?