Hong Kong is better?

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smoulder
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Hong Kong is better?

Post by smoulder » Wed, 08 Dec 2021 1:50 am

The author lays out the facts and its hard to disagree that he's right about the points he raises.
However, there's the issue of Hong Kong's uncertainty. What are your thoughts?

https://www.efinancialcareers.com/news/ ... or-bankers

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by Myasis Dragon » Wed, 08 Dec 2021 4:02 am

I judge that the fellow is rather partial to Hong Kong, and glosses over the many problems that exist there.

I think he's wrong about several points. For example, no trader cares about SGX, trades are done globally. I did contract work for a couple of banks... both had very large trading floors in Singapore, with no intention of moving anywhere else. They didn't have trading floors in HK.

His taxi points are moot... you can get taxis fast in Singapore as well... and you can't get a taxi in either city when it rains. I judge the transit systems about equal, so long as you stay in the heavily populated areas of HK. HK's cost of living is higher than Singapore by about 25 percent.

And then, there are the thugs in Beijing who have decided to erode freedoms in HK. I've got no idea what he means by having "less freedom" in Singapore, unless he's talking about snorting coke on Boat Quay. If you're an expat you don't get to vote in either city.

At one time, I might have said that you can trust the justice system in HK... that's certainly not the case anymore... if you're on the radar of the Beijing thugs, watch out... as many have already discovered. I'd much rather deal with Singapore courts.

And finally, while not particularly related to an individual career... HK became the hub for many businesses because it was close to China but still afforded data protections. Not now... no company is safe from the decision making process in Beijing... and I would ask, "Which city state would be most likely shut down your business because they don't like it?" I'd offer up that HK is the place.

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by tiktok » Wed, 08 Dec 2021 2:18 pm

- In HK you can get a motorbike on the road for <S$1k and park for free on the street.
- You can buy a fishing boat and moor for free in a typhoon shelter.
- You see people smiling and laughing on the street. Here everyone has their noses buried in their phones and looks miserable.
- Yes the standard of local English is poor, but they don't bastardise the language and it's grammar as badly as they do here.
- They have a distinct, singular and well defined culture with its own language. Singapore does not, it's an invented concept full of people from other parts of the world.
- People are not scared of the government and proud to stand up for their freedoms (what remains of them).
- You can hike for hours over hills and beautiful countryside.
- You can camp on deserted beaches or almost anywhere in the countryside without a permit.
- Seasons.
- Art scene: movies, music, TV.
- Offshore income is not taxable. Yup I'm ready for the arguments over this but I know for a fact in my case at least that this is was the case.

There are many disadvantages too:
- Family oligopolies dominate the economy causing severe unequal distribution of wealth.
- property prices are stupid.
- China future. This negates all the benefits above.
I not troll/wacko/spammer.
Me no expat. Me foreigner.

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by smoulder » Wed, 08 Dec 2021 3:56 pm

Yea. As I thought. No doubt HK has been a vibrant place, the food and the culture. Singapore is too sterilized to allow the constituents of it's sum to shine through and bring the vibrancy.

BUT, the future looks uncertain in HK. And very secure in Singapore. And Singapore has done a good job of keeping property prices in check, relatively speaking.

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by malcontent » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 12:34 am

I have been to HK many times. Definitely more vibrant, cosmopolitan and edgy. People are less conservative and more open minded compared to straight laced Singapore. It’s a real shame that the city is now devolving thanks to heavy handed interference.

Thinking back on my last visit there, the biggest difference that struck me was the crowds, the population density in HK is far worse than SG. I remember thinking to myself, maybe this is what Singapore will be like in the future.

I also remember thinking to myself, the next time I come to HK, I need to bring a small portable folding chair. The availability of public seating (in malls and such) is even worse than here. Go to any mall in the US and you’ll often find husbands lounging in the public seating area while their wives are busy shopping. I definitely need a place to chill while my SO is getting her retail therapy fix!
It’s not what happens to you, but how you react to it that matters ~ Epictetus

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by tiktok » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 11:08 am

I was told malls don't provide public seating because they would be full of old people with nowhere else to go. Here they can hang in void decks.

Yes the crowding is quite something. It requires practice to walk along an HK street without bumping into people and getting called a "sei gweilo" (damn foreigner).
I not troll/wacko/spammer.
Me no expat. Me foreigner.

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by malcontent » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 11:53 am

Ahhh, there’s something to look forward to… void deck hangouts.

✔️ Added to my retirement to do list!
It’s not what happens to you, but how you react to it that matters ~ Epictetus

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by tiktok » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 12:07 pm

Don't wait till you're old, you can be cool like these guys :D
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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by malcontent » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 12:38 pm

Maybe I should make a parody of the song California Dreamin’ … except it would be “void deck dreaming” and replace “on such a winters day” with “in such a confined space” 🤪
It’s not what happens to you, but how you react to it that matters ~ Epictetus

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by tiktok » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 12:53 pm

One thing I notice here is that people seem deeply dissatisfied. Many older people I've met are bitter about something. There are so many ads about ways to retire earlier - as if that's going to make life better.
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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by malcontent » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 1:33 pm

tiktok wrote:
Thu, 09 Dec 2021 12:53 pm
One thing I notice here is that people seem deeply dissatisfied. Many older people I've met are bitter about something. There are so many ads about ways to retire earlier - as if that's going to make life better.
Yes, some feel exploited, oppressed, taken advantage of and unfairly treated… they perceive the elite are laughing all the way to the bank on the backs of their blood, sweat and tears.

But even to the extent their perceptions are true, Mark Twain said it best - to succeed in life you need two things, ignorance and confidence. Knowing too much, whether perceived or reality, can really hinder one’s success. Focus on what you can control and disregard that which you cannot.
It’s not what happens to you, but how you react to it that matters ~ Epictetus

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by BigginHill » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 2:29 pm

The author does have a point on one key subject:

Attaining permanent residency / right of abode is completely transparent in HK & based on length of residency. (7 years) It's something you can plan for.

SG permanent residency is completely non-transparent & skewed to specific demographics and categories. Not something you can plan for. SPR almost qualifies as "invitation only".

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by smoulder » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 7:11 pm

BigginHill wrote:
Thu, 09 Dec 2021 2:29 pm
The author does have a point on one key subject:

Attaining permanent residency / right of abode is completely transparent in HK & based on length of residency. (7 years) It's something you can plan for.

SG permanent residency is completely non-transparent & skewed to specific demographics and categories. Not something you can plan for. SPR almost qualifies as "invitation only".
No doubt that is true. The comparison between the two cities should first assume that you have managed to get yourself a Singapore PR in the first place.

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by the observer » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 8:28 pm

If I am single, or without kids. HK is more appealing.

But since that’s not my case, Singapore trumps.
What’s more, no doubt there’s public housing in HK, my fear is that the future generations have been priced out of it.

Singapore’s kinda headed that way, but at least there’s ample public housing, relative to HK.

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Re: Hong Kong is better?

Post by smoulder » Thu, 09 Dec 2021 9:22 pm

the observer wrote:
Thu, 09 Dec 2021 8:28 pm
If I am single, or without kids. HK is more appealing.

But since that’s not my case, Singapore trumps.
What’s more, no doubt there’s public housing in HK, my fear is that the future generations have been priced out of it.

Singapore’s kinda headed that way, but at least there’s ample public housing, relative to HK.
Future generations of Hong Kong residents will be PRCs and mostly Han Chinese.

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