Singapore Expats Forum

Singaporeans and Caucasians

Discuss about life in Singapore. Ask about cost of living, housing, travel, etiquette & lifestyle. Share experience & advice with Singaporeans & expat staying in Singapore.

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kam

Postby kam » Sun, 30 Jan 2005 4:22 am

Hi Zebra,

Could you share your experience and tell us what sort of behaviour made you leaving Spore? If so, I feel ashamed and I apologize on behave of all Singaporean. Any sort of disrespectful behaviour should be denounced - whether we talk about stupid caucasians or stupid singaporeans.
What exactly made you leave Singapore?

Cheers

KHL
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Postby KHL » Sun, 30 Jan 2005 7:16 pm

I felt there are all kind of people, with all types of unique behaviour, no matter which part of the world you go....
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Peaceful

Postby Peaceful » Thu, 03 Feb 2005 5:56 pm

Hi Ya, I'm quite surprised that this topic is over 23 pages & counting.

I'm a local, Singaporean & wud not like to see such things happening. Please, once & for all stop all these arguing. Get on with yr life & stop making ourselves (expats & locals) miserable. What can we get out of these? Can't we see that some nations are still having 'tit for tat' battles for decades, with millions of innocent lives lost?

H'ever, if any of us dun like it here for any reason, than leave for a better place. But do remember that the fact that we can survive & thrive is due to our long standing values, Respect & Meritocracy.

Forget abt colonialism that was in the past. If u like it here then appreciate it, blend into e culture. We are a safe country with a credible defence force & strong homeland security. Anyone who stays here, including Singaporeans have a part to play.

So I hope everyone will think abt this & make peace. We got better things to share with one another, rite?! Happy Chinese New Year! :D

Guest

Postby Guest » Mon, 14 Feb 2005 1:08 pm

I find it really funny the way some people complained about little things
like being laughed or giggled at.

Have you ever had to leave a country because you are a Chinese descendant
living in Jakarta, Indonesia, (May 1998) ?
Have you ever been on a public transport in Melbourne, Australia, where you meet
someone that boldly claim he will kill all Asians on the bus?

The fact is... racism exists everywhere, as long as you are a minority
you will likely have to face such treatment.
I have been living as a minority all my life, 20 years in Indonesia,
10 years in Australia. The 2 examples above are only a few of my bad experiences.
But I have to note that there are lots of other locals both in Indonesia
and in Australia that are close to me and are like my own family.

I did think to go to the pole and live with the penguin, hopefully
they won't laugh and giggle at me. :).
But then again, I shouldn't be that narrow minded, right?

Peace to everyone. Love each other or perish.

Billy Brownless

Re: Racism occurs everywhere-

Postby Billy Brownless » Mon, 14 Feb 2005 6:45 pm

Nicole L. wrote:I read this thread with great amusement. I am a Singaporean currently doing my Masters in Australia, and I must say, the racism is pretty deep. I'm not only talking about Australia, but also from other countries. I am currently in a very cosmopolitan flat- my flatmates hail from Canada, USA, Malaysia, Singapore, China, Hongkong and Australia, of course.

We were talking about expatriates the other day and I think I figured out the reason why locals in any country feel a sort of resentment towards the expatriates. We do not hate you as an individual- we hate the system that pervades the Asian country where expatriates are a common sight and predominantly white. My friend who lives his whole life in Hongkong talks about the tiny expatriate community that existed there which is so closed up and unopened to the locals. He belongs to an expatriate family and even though he's been there for ten years, he doesn't know any Cantonese nor have any locals as friends, unless of course they were rich enough to squeeze into the expatriate neat little elitist society. Business deals, he observes, were often given to any companies who puts up some kind of British flag or icon in their company's logo or name. Cronyism, it seems, is not just an Asian thing.

I also felt a similar kind of injustice when I am in Singapore. I see my friends who are extremely capable, creative and innovative having their jobs or promotion stolen from them just because the company felt that the stereotype of "a White is always better" to be true. The anger we have is not directed against the individual, but against this nonsensical and illogical put down of local talents who already have much compeition to face anyway. Not only that, in my previous workplace, I have witnessed blatant cronyism. I was in the human resource department so I knew about an incident whereby a manager, who's an expat, gives preferential treatment to people from his own country among the job candidates. I have also met many expatriates who look upon the locals like we are children, needing to be told what to do etc. etc, being high and mighty about their own culture. The only claim they can lay on being "multi-cultural" is that they like chicken rice.

All I want to say is that I wish the mentality will change soon- that this inferiority complex which is so needless disappear in the new generation of Singaporeans. I think that it's time that Singaporeans figure out for themselves that they are just as good as an IT expert from Delhi or some manager from USA. Yet, if the expatirates are here, welcome them and respect them. Help them appreciate our culture as much as we can. One note to fellow Singaporeans though, especially shop owners- do not look down on your fellowmen. I have seen in many occasions, and this disgust me, that shopkeepers are rude to locals but extremely friendly to anyone who appears White.


On the other hand, I also wish that expats who come to Singapore have an open mind about the country- you are our guests but do not stretch our patience. I have good friends who are caucasians and they may one day be expats in Singapore. I always give them this advice- Be open minded and do not ever place your culture above ours because we are all on equal standing.

I believe there's another side to the story but i can't honestly say that my experiences with expatriates are good. If I have one, I will definitely in future voice it out here. I'm a Singaporean and in my own country, I do want the top leadership positions in any field-science, business, politics (a defacto category, duh!), etc. to be headed by Singaporeans, not foreigners. This may be uncosmopolitan of me but I believe a country should look after its own people first and foremost and we are not a stupid nation. Australia does it- it protects its own citizens first when it comes to jobs. But it can hardly be accused of being racist. Singapore should do the same- welcome foreigners, yes. But take care of your own people, or at the very least, place them all on equal standing with the expats.

Peace out,
Nicole


Wake Up. Singapore has chosen to base its entire society on a western model and as such it needs western expertise to bring it together. There are many things that Singaporeans are quite capable of doing without foreign help - but let me tell you. in my industry, the locals have got no effing idea. In time they will, but only after they have learnt the ropes from a westerner. That doesnt make westerners better racially. Just more experienced in setting up things western.

Necessity

Postby Necessity » Wed, 23 Feb 2005 12:24 am

Its idealistic to assume Singapore could survive by kicking out all foreigners.
In order to keep its unique competitive advantage it needs to remain its capacity to attract foreign talent and expertise. But those will only settle down there if they feel comfortable living there.
So racism is one thing: self-destructive and harmful for Singapores future. Singapore is lucky in a sense that most of its foreigners contribute immensly to the country - unlike other countries which also allow foreigners in who mainly strain their budgets like refugees from eastern Europe or soutern America...
So why complain if people contribute, paying their taxes and import knowledge and experience?
Wouldn it be boring if there were 100% Chinese in Spore???
As boring as 100% whites in America...!!!

Visitor

My experience with racism

Postby Visitor » Tue, 08 Mar 2005 2:46 am

I went to study in Australia and I never encountered any meaness or cruelty. So i have to agree with a previous poster that it's not your race but your whole attitude.

Ironically, it's back in Singapore that I would encounter racism. I often get rude stares by female caucasian expats who push their way infront of the line in a store like as though, "The natives or coloreds have to be served last".

I suppose I don't blame these "cellulitic" & anemic, looking women feeling threatened when they know that their husbands are surrounded by exotic Singporean beauties everyday :lol: :lol:

2 cents on Aust

Postby 2 cents on Aust » Sat, 12 Mar 2005 10:06 am

I went to study in Australia and I never encountered any meaness or cruelty. So i have to agree with a previous poster that it's not your race but your whole attitude.


To Visitor,

If you didn't experience racism in Australia then you are just lucky. It doesn't mean that racism doesn't exist there, or that the rest of us who experienced racism in Australia are making it up or somehow brought it upon ourselves by having the wrong attitude. Very often the onus is placed upon the victim to prove that they have been the victim of racism. It shouldn't be this way. Racism definitely exists there. And it's not the victim's fault. It's caused by the intolerance of the racist person.

With more luck, you may never experience racism when you're in Australia. But please remember that not everyone is that lucky.

Cheers,

Guest

Postby Guest » Sun, 13 Mar 2005 1:46 am

2 cents on Aust wrote:
I went to study in Australia and I never encountered any meaness or cruelty. So i have to agree with a previous poster that it's not your race but your whole attitude.


To Visitor,

If you didn't experience racism in Australia then you are just lucky. It doesn't mean that racism doesn't exist there, or that the rest of us who experienced racism in Australia are making it up or somehow brought it upon ourselves by having the wrong attitude. Very often the onus is placed upon the victim to prove that they have been the victim of racism. It shouldn't be this way. Racism definitely exists there. And it's not the victim's fault. It's caused by the intolerance of the racist person.

With more luck, you may never experience racism when you're in Australia. But please remember that not everyone is that lucky.

Cheers,


it does also depend where you reside. If you live in Pauline Hanson territory, you will undoubtedly come across more xenophobic people. In cosmopolitan areas, like melbourne, different nationalities wear their ethnicities with pride & have earnt the respect of all. It's become fashionable these days to be a "wog".

There, are however, some groups that are discriminated more than others, , such as muslims, purely because of their dress-code. & of course the negative publicity generated by good old Osama.

Visitor

Postby Visitor » Mon, 14 Mar 2005 9:15 pm

[quote="If you didn't experience racism in Australia then you are just lucky. It doesn't mean that racism doesn't exist there, or that the rest of us who experienced racism in Australia are making it up or somehow brought it upon ourselves by having the wrong attitude. Very often the onus is placed upon the victim to prove that they have been the victim of racism. It shouldn't be this way. Racism definitely exists there. And it's not the victim's fault. It's caused by the intolerance of the racist person
[/quote]

I do agree with you, I was lucky and also, as another poster said, "It depends on where you live". In addition to all that, alot had to do with the time that I was in Australia. I was there in the early 80s and before Pauline Hanson. I know racism exists in Australia and everywhere but I was just trying to reinforce that ironically, for me, I experienced racism only in my own country.

I have to say though you are right that it's not the victim's fault, in some cases, it's like a "self-fulfilling prophecy". I live in the US now and I am not racist against Blacks at all but many of them have this attitude like they expect you to be intolerant and so they have this "chip on their shoulder" attitude which makes one just not want to be nice in return and it has nothing to do with race but of course, it would be mis-interpreted by the "victim" as such.

It is a vicious cycle and how does one end it? Maybe one day, we will all learn to live together in peace.

adicen
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Postby adicen » Wed, 16 Mar 2005 2:37 am

Wow...this topic sure brings a lot out of each of us.

I am a student doing a research on the topic, well...not exactly the topic but something close to it.

As part of the research, I need to interview people. Anyone, be it a local or a foreigner. I would really appreciate it if you could help me out. Message me and we can talk about it.

Thanks people!!

aciden - wtf are you?

Postby aciden - wtf are you? » Thu, 17 Mar 2005 3:13 pm

It seems adicen is trolling all of the Expat boards and asking for the same thing - something very fishy about this person.

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Ignore

Postby Guest » Thu, 17 Mar 2005 3:36 pm

Then better ignore him/her best not to entertain his/her requests
Chicken and Egg Situation

adicen
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Postby adicen » Thu, 17 Mar 2005 5:27 pm

hey, I am really working on my research and I really do need people to do interviews. I am not working for the government, I am not here to con your money, I am not here because I am doing MLM and as researchers, we have research ethics, which means that if you do not want us to divulge your identity after the interview, we won't. I just want people to interview for the research! Geez....

flayzarenal

Postby flayzarenal » Wed, 23 Mar 2005 7:40 am

I just stumbled pon this page.. However, i really want to comment that singapore is a pretty good place for any kind of people to live in. The reason is simply because although there are still a little racism, but you can see the govt and most people trying to do something about it. I am a singaporean currently studying in Canada.. I can say that I am dying from the culture here simply because everything you say or do is being taken so seriously. I got into trouble with a couple of local because they could not/ refuse to understand the way i was saying things and doing things.

My view is that at least in singapore, the people are more receptive and trust me, they will never laugh at you or talk behind your back unless you are doing something really funny. However, if you are talking about singaporean kids laughing at you or being disrespectful, i will not be suprised because after going over to canada, i realised that the singaporean kids have alot to learn about accepting other cultures and watnot. However, I still miss singapore desperately cause it is a warm place.. (meaning both the weather and people)

I guess we all just have to learn to accept different cultures and not comment so much.. Lol.. Something I learnt from class about diversity.. haha..


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