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Query about NS

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bannie
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Query about NS

Postby bannie » Mon, 21 Aug 2017 9:31 pm

From this part of the forum, I can conclude that if a

SC/PR not show up for NS, they will be subject to fine or if very significant, a jail term

and if they renounce in time, they will not be allowed to return to work

can SC/PR renounce their status in time and return to work, obviously with repercussions, perhaps at less significant than a defaulter? perhaps fine and requirement for national service?

would this attract men who are serious about returning to singapore but might have been too young (teenager) when they had to renounce. also seems like it would help the other concerns of lack of number of servicing men

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Re: Query about NS

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 22 Aug 2017 8:38 am

bannie wrote:From this part of the forum, I can conclude that if a

SC/PR not show up for NS, they will be subject to fine or if very significant, a jail term

Basically correct.

and if they renounce in time, they will not be allowed to return to work

Incorrect. If they have followed proper protocol for renunciation (e.g., the process was started before the age of 13 (11 to be safe) and all the t's were crossed and i's dotted. Proper exit permits were applied for, etc. then if they want to return to Singapore at some point in the future, they can apply for an employment pass like any person trying to obtain work here. They will not have any more problems than anybody else in gaining a employment pass. However. They will never be given a PEP, PR or SC. Therefore their stay here will be based on getting a employment pass and they will have to leave when it is finished. Marriage to a SC or PR will not help.

can SC/PR renounce their status in time and return to work, obviously with repercussions, perhaps at less significant than a defaulter? perhaps fine and requirement for national service?

If SC or PR is given up properly see my answer above. If not given up properly, e.g., defaulter, probably, as noted, possibly fine (if PR) and maybe jail term as well if SC if defaulter is no longer young enough to do NS.

would this attract men who are serious about returning to singapore but might have been too young (teenager) when they had to renounce. also seems like it would help the other concerns of lack of number of servicing men

PRs? I doubt it. SC's? Yeah, maybe. Chicken Rice seems to be a real magnet.

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Re: Query about NS

Postby bannie » Tue, 22 Aug 2017 9:31 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:would this attract men who are serious about returning to singapore but might have been too young (teenager) when they had to renounce. also seems like it would help the other concerns of lack of number of servicing men

PRs? I doubt it. SC's? Yeah, maybe. Chicken Rice seems to be a real magnet.


are there PRs who renounced between the age of 13 and NS callup (so not officially a defaulter but fell into the grey zone where they cant get EP) but are interested in returning to singapore and prepared to redo national service, or even pay a fine (like a defaulter even if they arent)?

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Re: Query about NS

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 22 Aug 2017 4:42 pm

Sadly, I don't have any anecdotal evidence to support this. This is an area where you will have to just buys yer ticket and takes yer chances. A call to MinDef or the CMPB might shed some light on it, but don't give them your name or NRIC number if you can avoid it.

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Re: Query about NS

Postby bannie » Tue, 22 Aug 2017 5:12 pm

n = 1 is no from my experience
but i dont understand why.

wud be more than happy to do NS, pay fine, and even sit in jail for abit.

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Re: Query about NS

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 22 Aug 2017 8:47 pm

bannie wrote:n = 1 is no from my experience
but i dont understand why.

wud be more than happy to do NS, pay fine, and even sit in jail for abit.

One good reason is that if they show there is a way to come back, then even more will abscond without doing their obligation to the country, knowing that they will be able to come back and rejoin Singapore society by getting a slap on the wrists. Singapore has always played for keeps. It's their ball, their ball park and they make the rules and change them as they see fit.

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Re: Query about NS

Postby PNGMK » Tue, 22 Aug 2017 9:09 pm

There's a gap here in the policies and it will never close. Singapore will never allow that male second gen PR's who renounced as late teens (or potential SC born to one SC parent in Singapore but don't take SC) can move back and access full range of SC benefits without a penalty. The numbers affected were traditionally fairly low and there will never be enough noise to change it.

I know quite a few parents who have made the decision to either have their son renounce PR (at 15 for example) or have their half Singapore son not take SC only as a baby to find that Singapore has closed her doors to them (the latter case is more severe - no EP at all for them).
I have gay, black, Asian friends and then JR8.

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Re: Query about NS

Postby bgd » Wed, 23 Aug 2017 10:17 am

bannie wrote:... and even sit in jail for abit.


Don't take that lightly. From everything I have read, prison here is a tough regime. Somewhere on this forum a former inmate recounted his experience. Try and find that thread.

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Re: Query about NS

Postby ecureilx » Wed, 23 Aug 2017 11:09 am

bannie wrote:n = 1 is no from my experience
but i dont understand why.

wud be more than happy to do NS, pay fine, and even sit in jail for abit.


Sit in jail = you are indesirable immigrant.

Sit in Military brig = I am sure it is the same as above !

So it's not win-win.

Oh, by the way, in the past, ex-Singapore born-but left SG were offered NS when they came to SG to work, in exchange for PR/SC.

Know 2 guys who went that route, ended up in SCDF I recall.

I guess that route is not guaranteed anymore.

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Re: Query about NS

Postby bannie » Wed, 23 Aug 2017 11:48 am

well not me. just saying someone i know.

but yeah. that little gap between 11 or 13 and 18 or 21 seems grey

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Re: Query about NS

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 23 Aug 2017 11:59 pm

bannie wrote:well not me. just saying someone i know.

but yeah. that little gap between 11 or 13 and 18 or 21 seems grey

On the 11 or 13 gap, it all depends on whether you were issued with a biometric passport or not. When they came out with biometric PPs they upped the age to prior to age 13 from the former age 11. For males, renunciation can only take place within 12 month of their 21st birthday. But. Only if they had completed their NS obligation. No NS, no renunciation. If you take up a 2nd passport, then you are guilty of breaking the law there as well.


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