Help needed on MOM rejection for me to marry foriegner

[Peezahut]

Hi everyone,

I am a SPR who grew up and studied in Sg(including serving NS) since I was young. However I did not change to Pink ic, I didn't reject the offer, I just didn't choose.

What happen was that I recently got rejected by MOM to marry my China gf who USED TO BE a work permit holder. My gf was working in Sg for two months sometime back in 2012/2013(can't remember cos it's a long time ago), with a work permit, after that two months, she has returned to China ever since.

I met her two years ago overseas and are intending to marry but only to get a rejection by MOM. I feel so unfair that I have to ask MOM on my personal life, some more she is an Ex Wp holder, not a current one, I don't see why do I have to consult MOM for permission! Can I ask any seniors here on how to appeal?

Pls help me because we are really serious and marriage has been on our minds for a long time, we are not young anymore. Thank you so much in advance.

[BBCDoc]

Get married in China? Then apply for DP / LTVP?

More than one way to skin a cat


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[ecureilx]

I am a SPR who grew up and studied in Sg(including serving NS) since I was young. However I did not change to Pink ic, I didn't reject the offer, I just didn't choose.

What happen was that I recently got rejected by MOM to marry my China gf who USED TO BE a work permit holder. My gf was working in Sg for two months sometime back in 2012/2013(can't remember cos it's a long time ago), with a work permit, after that two months, she has returned to China ever since.

I met her two years ago overseas and are intending to marry but only to get a rejection by MOM. I feel so unfair that I have to ask MOM on my personal life, some more she is an Ex Wp holder, not a current one, I don't see why do I have to consult MOM for permission! Can I ask any seniors here on how to appeal?
.

You need to read up on MOM rules. Whether she is or was a WP holder, seeking permission is MOM rule. I presume to eliminate Marriages of Convenience..

You can check with your fiance what was her work in Singapore?

PS, if you don't think you don't need to get MOM approval, solution : marry elsewhere

[Peezahut]

Thank you ecruilx and bbcoc for your reply but the rejection letter states that even marriage outside Singapore is not allowed. Our plan is educate our future kid in sg, and that I've read many post saying if we were to ignore MOM rejection and marry overseas, my wife to be will be rejected entry to singapore. Is that true? My family mom n dad are all here... That's why we are planning to marry n live in sg

[Barnsley]

Thank you ecruilx and bbcoc for your reply but the rejection letter states that even marriage outside Singapore is not allowed. Our plan is educate our future kid in sg, and that I've read many post saying if we were to ignore MOM rejection and marry overseas, my wife to be will be rejected entry to singapore. Is that true? My family mom n dad are all here... That's why we are planning to marry n live in sg

Can't your missus come here and get another job requiring S-Pass or E-Pass?

The Govt is just looking after its Citizens/PR's interests

[ecureilx]

Thank you ecruilx and bbcoc for your reply but the rejection letter states that even marriage outside Singapore is not allowed. Our plan is educate our future kid in sg, and that I've read many post saying if we were to ignore MOM rejection and marry overseas, my wife to be will be rejected entry to singapore. Is that true? My family mom n dad are all here... That's why we are planning to marry n live in sg

Correction: MOM can't stop you from marrying elsewhere.

Yes, MOM can be very upset if you didn't seek approval. And yes, she can be denied entry to Singapore

So my question, what was she doing in Singapore before.

Another question: why didn't you get Pink IC ? If you had Pink IC, there is a very good chance MOM can change their mind, and also ICA can bend their rules.

Being on Blue IC Is not advantage now. Maybe work on that ?

PS, your parents too Blue IC ?

[Peezahut]

Thank you all for replying, ever since my gf worked for that two months years ago, she has returned to live in China, so at the moment, she isn't considering to work in sg, partly she isn't very educated to work as S pass or ep.

She used to work as a singer in ktv joint, but as we all know, normally such jobs means the work permit isn't really registered under the ktv company itself. As hard as she is honest with me, she really couldn't remember the details of her work permit as it was many years back. All she can recall is that she did have a work permit, worked two months n returned to China cos it wasn't suitable for her.

Why I didn't get pink ic cos last time young, didn't think so far, really regret now. And yes my family of 6 including me are all SPR, grew up and studied here since younG.

We did apply for ROM before but we passed it cos I later on found out bout this law.

If we get married outside n she gets denied entry to sg is a big deal to us cos we are planning to live in sg especially when my parents and friends are all here. I just called mom and they asked me to appeal through isubmit. Tried to make an appointment to meet the controller of work pass but wasn't given a direction.

Issit better for me to head down straight instead of asking them through helpline?

[ecureilx]

Thank you all for replying, ever since my gf worked for that two months years ago, she has returned to live in China, so at the moment, she isn't considering to work in sg, partly she isn't very educated to work as S pass or ep.

She used to work as a singer in ktv joint, but as we all know, normally such jobs means the work permit isn't really registered under the ktv company itself. As hard as she is honest with me, she really couldn't remember the details of her work permit as it was many years back. All she can recall is that she did have a work permit, worked two months n returned to China cos it wasn't suitable for her.

Why I didn't get pink ic cos last time young, didn't think so far, really regret now. And yes my family of 6 including me are all SPR, grew up and studied here since younG.

We did apply for ROM before but we passed it cos I later on found out bout this law.

If we get married outside n she gets denied entry to sg is a big deal to us cos we are planning to live in sg especially when my parents and friends are all here. I just called mom and they asked me to appeal through isubmit. Tried to make an appointment to meet the controller of work pass but wasn't given a direction.

Issit better for me to head down straight instead of asking them through helpline?

Well, she worked in KTV but not sure of the details ? Maybe there in lie the problem. Was she sent off legally or deported ? Never mind anyway.

You cannot meet the top boss of MOM. You can try to meet the Duty officer but let me put it this way, with information like "don't know, can't remember, maybe, possible . " you wont go far.

So you still didn't answer the other question: What is the IC of your parents ?

And, honestly, I don't see any progress for you, unless you have lady luck shining on you.

If, on the other hand, you were pink IC, you can fight for it. With blue IC, your options are very very limited. Limited to not even being treated second class nowadays.

[Peezahut]

My family are all blue ic. So should I just get married overseas? But forgo chances of her entering Singapore in future?

[ecureilx]

My family are all blue ic. So should I just get married overseas? But forgo chances of her entering Singapore in future?

No comments. Since I can't think of anything positive. You can marry, and fight for LTVP, maybe 10 years later she may be allowed in.

Where are you original from, in any case ?

[Peezahut]

I am from Malaysia. My gf told the agent that she is quitting, and returned to China. Issit possible the agent didn't complete all necessary procedures to cancel her work permit? Or is it that she didn't pay tax for her two months work? Sorry for not being to have more info. Especially when these jobs normally go through an agent so I'm thinking it may be possible some losses ends weren't complete when she left

[x9200]

Try to see the officer on duty at MoM. Perhaps you will get some clues. If the problem is her low education, consider her to study; if on the other hand, its something more serious then you may learn something that could influence your decisions. Nothing to lose.

[lee85]

For your information you can see this news as well as the conversation between MOM and Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong: https://sg.news.yahoo.com/blogs/singapo ... 09946.html

MARRIAGE RESTRICTION POLICY

11. Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong asked the Minister for Manpower (a) under what basis can the appeal of a Singapore citizen who had a relationship with an ex-work permit holder, resulting in the birth of a child, be granted approval for marriage; and (b) in view of our declining population figure, will such relationships resulting in the birth of a child be given easier approval for marriage by the Ministry.

The Senior Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Manpower (Mr Hawazi Daipi) (for the Minister for Manpower): Sir, there are presently more than 500,000 foreign work permit holders in Singapore. To maintain our social equilibrium, these large numbers of foreign workers are allowed to work in Singapore only if they agree to our marriage restriction policy. Those who marry without approval will be repatriated and disallowed entry into Singapore. This is made clear to all foreign worker applicants who apply to work in Singapore. This strict enforcement is necessary to maintain this policy. Therefore, all current and ex-work permit holders are reminded to adhere to this pre-condition to which they have agreed upon.

Appeals will be considered on an individual basis.

Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong (Non-Constituency Member): Sir, the Senior Parliamentary Secretary has not answered my question. How then can the child, who is born out of wedlock from a Singaporean and an ex-work permit worker, where they did not get married, but they have a relationship and a child was conceived in that process, now be able to live in an intact family in Singapore? Under what basis would the Ministry allow approval for the marriage to pass through?

Mr Hawazi Daipi: To start with, they are not allowed to live here and, more so, to have children. It is precisely because we have to control the population size of Singapore that we have to have this condition agreed upon when a foreign worker applies to work in Singapore. So he knows that he cannot contravene this marriage restriction policy and if he wants to get married to a potential Singaporean spouse, he has to seek approval. But if he is not given approval, he may be repatriated.

Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong: Sir, a mistake has been made by the child's parents where they actually entered into a relationship and have a child. In view of Singapore's declining population, is it not a helpful addition to the population when we have some new children being born for the sake of Singapore? Basically, my question is: why is the Ministry so "cruel" as to "punish" the child by not allowing their parents to get married and stay together as an intact family?

Mr Hawazi Daipi: Sir, the Ministry is not "cruel". In fact, we consider applications for marriage between Singaporeans and ex-work permit holders on an individual basis and allow, whenever possible, where they meet the conditions. However, we have to protect the interests of Singaporeans. As I have said earlier, we have more than 500,000 foreigners working in Singapore and larger numbers of them used to work in Singapore. So imagine if every other ex-work permit holder were to marry a Singaporean, we would not be able to manage our social services and social system. So I think Mr Chia must bear this in mind and be fair to Singaporeans in general first.

Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong: The Senior Parliamentary Secretary has not answered my question. Under what basis would an appeal be approved? The application for one of the residents was rejected after an appeal. I am trying to find out what is the basis for approval.

Mr Hawazi Daipi: Sir, we would consider on an individual basis the merits of the application. But, generally, all work permit holders know that they have agreed to abide by the marriage policy in Singapore before they are allowed to obtain a work permit and work in Singapore. That is the condition that all work permit applicants must understand and adhere to. To be fair to potential children of the future, they must ensure that they have to get approval to get married.

Ms Braema Mathiaparanam: May I please ask the Senior Parliamentary Secretary how many such cases have been approved on a case-by-case basis? And of these cases that have gotten approval, how many have become dependent on our social support services? In other words, have they been responsible enough to take care of their own families?

Mr Hawazi Daipi: Sir, I do not have the figures here. But in any case, what is more important is to ensure that everyone - Singaporeans and foreign workers working in Singapore - understands that Singapore is a small place and we have limited resources. Even though we want to increase our population size, we have to ensure that those who want to live and have families in Singapore can look after themselves, their children and their families. That is the basic premise that we all must understand. I can only go back to the earlier answer that I have given that all foreign workers who want to work in Singapore must understand and agree to abide by this basic principle.

Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong: Sir, if the Singaporean father undertakes to take care and raise up a child with his own resources, is that a good enough undertaking for approval?

Mr Hawazi Daipi: A child would need a motherly figure to look after him. A father alone would not be able to do that, no matter how much the father earns or is able to afford to look after the child. So it is very important. If we want to be really fair to the child, we have to understand the marriage restriction policy. And if they qualify, then they get married. But wherever possible, ex-work permit holders can be allowed to marry Singaporeans on a case-by-case basis.

Dr Wang Kai Yuen (Bukit Timah): I would like to ask the Senior Parliamentary Secretary whether a marriage can take place, under universal law, at any place on earth and does not require the approval of the Singapore Government. The Singapore Government can only grant permission to get married in Singapore, as a result of which, with our approval, they can gain residential status in Singapore. Is that a fact?

Mr Hawazi Daipi: Can the Member simplify his question?

Dr Wang Kai Yuen: My question is whether anyone would need the approval of Government to get married.

Mr Hawazi Daipi: No, only for work permit holders and this is a specific group of people.

Dr Wang Kai Yuen: Including work permit holders, they can get married anywhere in the world without our approval.

Mr Hawazi Daipi: Yes, it is a universal human right. However, Singaporeans do have human rights to be able to look after ourselves and manage our limited resources and to ensure that those legitimate Singaporeans would be well looked after and would not exact too much of our social system.

Mr Speaker: Last question, Mr Steve Chia.

Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong: Does it mean that if the ex-work permit holders are to get married overseas, they will be allowed to stay in Singapore as an intact family?

Mr Hawazi Daipi: The simple answer is no, Sir.

[ecureilx]

For your information you can see this news as well as the conversation between MOM and Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong: https://sg.news.yahoo.com/blogs/singapo ... 09946.html

MARRIAGE RESTRICTION POLICY

11. Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong asked the Minister for Manpower (a) under what basis can the appeal of a Singapore citizen who had a relationship with an ex-work permit holder, resulting in the birth of a child, be granted approval for marriage; and (b) in view of our declining population figure, will such relationships resulting in the birth of a child be given easier approval for marriage by the Ministry.

OP is a PR, above doesn't apply.

He is in a very bad state, to be honest.

As an SC, he would have had the right to fight.

As a Blue IC, and his family all being blue, his chance of winning Toto first prize is higher !!!

That's my 2 cents, you can disagree.

I know SG Gov has a long memory when it comes to those who marry WP without permission or refused permission, even the kids have been allowed but mummy - no-no. Even after 10 years I know one such case.

[lee85]

exactly that is my point! even if a Singaporean would like to marry a Work Pass holder is already so difficult. I am sure that it is even more difficult for PR.