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Landlord bankruptcy

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mb25
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Landlord bankruptcy

Post by mb25 » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 1:16 pm

Hi everyone,

I was wondering whether anyone can share their advice or experience on a situation I am going through at the moment.

Basically, I received a letter from IRAS this week stating that I should pay future rent to them until I hear otherwise as our landlord has unpaid taxes. My first thought was 'SCAM!', but having spoken with IRAS this morning, they confirmed it is legit.

Having done a bit more digging, it turns out that my landlord was made bankrupt two weeks ago. My agent has been trying to get in touch with him, but has discovered from a colleague of his that he has absconded. So who knows where he is!

I am now unsure what to do next. Obviously I am keen to keep IRAS happy and not have them on my back, and the amount they have requested is just below what we pay monthly anyway, so that isn't an issue at this stage. They also mentioned that this payment would settle his debt in full, which would put an end to this particular IRAS problem.

My main concern now is that if he is bankrupt, and has bunked it, do I continue paying rent to him once the IRAS bill has been settled? If I don't, will I breach my contract? I checked my tenancy agreement, and bankruptcy is only mentioned in relation to the tenant, not the landlord. I expect he has also chucked our 2 months deposit up the wall, so I don't expect to be seeing that when our tenancy ends in July. So could I potentially offset the deposit against future rents, if I am still liable for them?

Finally, I guess if he is officially bankrupt he will also be defaulting on the mortgage he has on our condo, so won't be long until the bank come knocking on the door. Hopefully this will tie in with the end of our tenancy in a few months, but that is going to throw another spanner in the works if they rock up sooner... Anyone know what the process is here? THe document online states he was declared bankrupt on 13th April.

I appreciate this is getting into a lot of legalities, and have started to engage professionals for their input. I was just wondering whether anyone had any personal experiences similar to the above and could add their thoughts.

Thanks in advance, MB25 :???:

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ecureilx
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by ecureilx » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 1:34 pm

mb25 wrote:Hi everyone,

I was wondering whether anyone can share their advice or experience on a situation I am going through at the moment.

Basically, I received a letter from IRAS this week stating that I should pay future rent to them until I hear otherwise as our landlord has unpaid taxes. My first thought was 'SCAM!', but having spoken with IRAS this morning, they confirmed it is legit.

Having done a bit more digging, it turns out that my landlord was made bankrupt two weeks ago. My agent has been trying to get in touch with him, but has discovered from a colleague of his that he has absconded. So who knows where he is!

I am now unsure what to do next. Obviously I am keen to keep IRAS happy and not have them on my back, and the amount they have requested is just below what we pay monthly anyway, so that isn't an issue at this stage. They also mentioned that this payment would settle his debt in full, which would put an end to this particular IRAS problem.

My main concern now is that if he is bankrupt, and has bunked it, do I continue paying rent to him once the IRAS bill has been settled? If I don't, will I breach my contract? I checked my tenancy agreement, and bankruptcy is only mentioned in relation to the tenant, not the landlord. I expect he has also chucked our 2 months deposit up the wall, so I don't expect to be seeing that when our tenancy ends in July. So could I potentially offset the deposit against future rents, if I am still liable for them?

Finally, I guess if he is officially bankrupt he will also be defaulting on the mortgage he has on our condo, so won't be long until the bank come knocking on the door. Hopefully this will tie in with the end of our tenancy in a few months, but that is going to throw another spanner in the works if they rock up sooner... Anyone know what the process is here? THe document online states he was declared bankrupt on 13th April.

I appreciate this is getting into a lot of legalities, and have started to engage professionals for their input. I was just wondering whether anyone had any personal experiences similar to the above and could add their thoughts.

Thanks in advance, MB25 :???:
I doubt he was made a bankrupt for a small amount.

So, pay the rental to IRAS, as they requested (in writing) and then start looking for a new place, in case the other debtors decide to auction out the house, including everything inside.

Send a letter since the property is not possible debt issue, you are vacating the property. You will continue to stay to clear the two months deposit. In case he was bankrupt, his bank account would be frozen, so you WILL NOT GET that money, if the guy really kept it in his account, so it's moot if he promises to pay you back or not. He can also include your deposit in his assets and then refuse to pay you, come time to pay you back.

Yes, scary it may sound, auctions include everything inside the house.

I am sure with the above, no need to pay another lawyer :D

mb25
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by mb25 » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 2:04 pm

Hello,

Thanks so much for the response. I guess we will start making alternative plans!

When you say everything in the house, I presume that means our possessions too? That is scary!! Best get packing if so.. :?

Regards, MB25

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ecureilx
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by ecureilx » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 2:36 pm

mb25 wrote:Hello,

Thanks so much for the response. I guess we will start making alternative plans!

When you say everything in the house, I presume that means our possessions too? That is scary!! Best get packing if so.. :?

Regards, MB25
As long as you have proof he was made a bankrupt, it's sufficient grounds to say you are worried about seizure of property.

Ah, yes, unless things changed, if there is a seizure order, EVERYTHING is considered as landlord's property.

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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by mb25 » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 2:50 pm

Yup I have got individual insolvency report stating the bankruptcy last week, so that's covered.

Very worrying our belongings, especially the playstation and the golf clubs!

Thanks again for the info

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PNGMK
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by PNGMK » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 3:11 pm

Move out ASAP. Don't pay the IRAS - explain to them in a letter than you are also owed two months rent by the landlord for your unpaid deposit and that you are assigning that debt (passing it on) to IRAS. If they continue to pursue you after moving out only pay them for the exact number of days you were in the property. I am not sure that the contract between you and the LL novates to IRAS and if it does whether all the T&C apply though. I am not a lawyer and I smell my shits.

The one thing Squirrel has not mentioned but I will is illegal money lenders. If they work out that this guy has a property they will be all over it with vandalism etc.


Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.Get out.
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You've been arrested? Law Society of Singapore can provide referrals.
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ecureilx
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by ecureilx » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 3:22 pm

PNGMK wrote:Move out ASAP. Don't pay the IRAS - explain to them in a letter than you are also owed two months rent by the landlord for your unpaid deposit and that you are assigning that debt (passing it on) to IRAS. If they continue to pursue you after moving out only pay them for the exact number of days you were in the property. I am not sure that the contract between you and the LL novates to IRAS and if it does whether all the T&C apply though. I am not a lawyer and I smell my shits.
+1 again. Move out ASAP, if you can.

mb25
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by mb25 » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 3:25 pm

Wow thanks for the info all.

We have done some further digging and understand the landlord has left Singapore. Must be really up to his neck in it..

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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by rajagainstthemachine » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 4:18 pm

i concur with PNGMK, explain to IRAS that you don't feel comfortable living in that house anymore and would like to move out, also get your deposit back... also is this starting to be a sign of things to come ?
To get there early is on time and showing up on time is late

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ecureilx
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by ecureilx » Fri, 28 Apr 2017 4:48 pm

rajagainstthemachine wrote:i concur with PNGMK, explain to IRAS that you don't feel comfortable living in that house anymore and would like to move out, also get your deposit back... also is this starting to be a sign of things to come ?
but .. my 2 cents says, the deposit is as good as GONE, as the Insolvency office don't dispense the credits :D

Start of what ?

Folks going bankrupt is not new in Singapore ;)

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PNGMK
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by PNGMK » Sun, 30 Apr 2017 3:35 pm

ecureilx wrote:
rajagainstthemachine wrote:i concur with PNGMK, explain to IRAS that you don't feel comfortable living in that house anymore and would like to move out, also get your deposit back... also is this starting to be a sign of things to come ?
but .. my 2 cents says, the deposit is as good as GONE, as the Insolvency office don't dispense the credits :D

Start of what ?

Folks going bankrupt is not new in Singapore ;)
Foreign folks is a little new...
I not lawyer/teacher/CPA.
You've been arrested? Law Society of Singapore can provide referrals.
You want an International School job? School website or http://www.ISS.edu
Your rugrat needs a School? Avoid for profit schools
You need Tax advice? Ask a CPA
You ran away without doing NS? Shame on you!

mb25
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by mb25 » Tue, 02 May 2017 10:44 am

Hi All,

Just an update on this. I spoke with IRAS this morning and the amount payable is not actually legally enforceable on us. The woman on the phone basically said it is not payable if we move out, and even if we stay, they are not going to chase us for the money. So I guess we can recoup some of the deposit owed to us.

Based on the info you all kindly provided above, I think we are going to get out ASAP anyway, so will save us contributing to the landlord's tax bill [-X

MB25

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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by PNGMK » Tue, 02 May 2017 11:01 am

mb25 wrote:Hi All,

Just an update on this. I spoke with IRAS this morning and the amount payable is not actually legally enforceable on us. The woman on the phone basically said it is not payable if we move out, and even if we stay, they are not going to chase us for the money. So I guess we can recoup some of the deposit owed to us.

Based on the info you all kindly provided above, I think we are going to get out ASAP anyway, so will save us contributing to the landlord's tax bill [-X

MB25
It sounds like a decent plan. Whatever you do don't pay the LL or agent anything though as that contravenes the IRAS rule.
I not lawyer/teacher/CPA.
You've been arrested? Law Society of Singapore can provide referrals.
You want an International School job? School website or http://www.ISS.edu
Your rugrat needs a School? Avoid for profit schools
You need Tax advice? Ask a CPA
You ran away without doing NS? Shame on you!

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ecureilx
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Re: Landlord bankruptcy

Post by ecureilx » Tue, 02 May 2017 11:21 am

mb25 wrote: Based on the info you all kindly provided above, I think we are going to get out ASAP anyway, so will save us contributing to the landlord's tax bill [-X

MB25
I guess the tax due by the LL is a big sum!!

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