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Company paying lower than stated EP salary

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MathsGuy
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Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby MathsGuy » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 2:38 pm

Hi all

So I got my EP (temp, with real EP card in the post for next week) which declares on the paperwork that the company will be paying me 5k per month.

However what happens if the company says,

"we had to write 5k to get the EP"... "we cant actually pay you that".... "we can only pay you 3k"

I understand the company can get in trouble for doing that, but thats up to them, its their company not mine, but would I also get in trouble?

I know most of you will say, to tell them to pay me 5k but if they won't then 3k is better than no job and no EP. At least ill be getting work experience for the CV and its always easier to find a job once you have a job, applying for a jobs from a position of strength, rather than applying for jobs when I don't have job and I'm not even in the country makes it almost impossible to find a job here in Singapore.

Any advice of what to do in this situation

Restored by moderator with big thanks to jamie9vardy for the save! ;-)
Last edited by MathsGuy on Wed, 19 Oct 2016 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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sundaymorningstaple
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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 3:03 pm

If that should transpire, you MUST refuse and walk away from the job. Go directly to MOM and report them. They might not be able to charge them but it will absolve you of any repercussions.

Here's why: If you agree to this (and a lot have in the past for the same reasons) and the company is found out, yeah, they'll get a fined and a slap on the wrists. You on the other hand, can/will spend some time in jail and then when you get out, deported and banned from ever returning to Singapore. Why? Because the term is called collusion. You colluded with your employer to knowingly defraud the Government. A serious offense that is seriously looked down upon by the powers that be. If it happens, don't do it. Take it from an HR Mgr of an SME here. It's not worth it.

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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 3:06 pm

If they will do it to you, they are probably doing it to all of the other foreigners there as well. All it will take is ONE disgruntled leaving foreign employee, with some proof, to bring down the whole house of cards after he leaves Singapore.

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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby PNGMK » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 3:09 pm

Considering SMS opinion who I consider to be extremely relevant but also considering your situation.... if you think you can jump jobs within a few months stick it out and then jump.

One option is to insist that you be paid $5,000 but the company can charge you $2,000 for training or accommodation.
I have gay, black, Asian friends and then JR8.

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sundaymorningstaple
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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 3:25 pm

The most deductible is all deductions a combined maximum of 25% of his salary or $1250. And then proof should be available and MOM will ask for it if there is a suspected breaching of the policy. We do not recommend doing anything ILLEGAL on this forum, right PNGMK?

MathsGuy
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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby MathsGuy » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 3:33 pm

So they can deduct 25% for training costs, and pay me 4k and that will be legal?

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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby bgd » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 4:09 pm

MathsGuy wrote:So they can deduct 25% for training costs, and pay me 4k and that will be legal?


It's gaming the system, MOM will see through that if they ever find out and then you are back to SMS's earlier reply.

From what you have said you obviously suspect this might happen. Do you mind sharing why? Have they already implied it?

MathsGuy
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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby MathsGuy » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 4:20 pm

bgd wrote:From what you have said you obviously suspect this might happen. Do you mind sharing why? Have they already implied it?


because they have said I need to come in a sign the contract and talk about my salary. What else do they mean by this? whats there to talk about my salary? It clearly says 5k in the EP, so there's nothing to talk about, theres certainly not going to be a bonus or extras or contributions etc, and originally they applied to pay me 4k but the EP would be rejected with 4k, so they wrote 5k on the EP application. And so why would they say "come in a sign the contract and talk about your salary" I'm very worried this is the "well we cant actually pay you 5k".... talk.

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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 5:43 pm

Don't sign it if they want to talk about your salary 'after' you sign it. Because if you agree then you are colluding with the employer to defraud the MOM. You WILL go to jail.

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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby MathsGuy » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 6:30 pm

Go directly to Jail, do not pass Go, do not collect $200!

oach!

MathsGuy
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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby MathsGuy » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 7:00 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Don't sign it if they want to talk about your salary 'after' you sign it. Because if you agree then you are colluding with the employer to defraud the MOM. You WILL go to jail.


Easier said than done. The reality is, if I dont sign, EP gets cancelled, I have to return to my home country, it took me 1 year and a bit of luck to land this job, so perhaps at best it will take another year or two to find another job in Singapore, if i dont get a job, by then I will have been 3 years unemployed which will almost destroy my chances of ever getting a job here. So I'm screwed if I do sign and screwed if I don't sign.

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Re: RE: Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby ecureilx » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 9:53 pm

MathsGuy wrote:. So I'm screwed if I do sign and screwed if I don't sign.


On the positive side, if you become a witness, you could be allowed to work any job while the case is in progress - ;)

PS, I have had the privilege of having worked for bosses who do stunts like what you have mentioned and then hold you by your balls for being complicit in the crime.

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Re: RE: Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby MathsGuy » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 10:05 pm

ecureilx wrote:
MathsGuy wrote:. So I'm screwed if I do sign and screwed if I don't sign.


PS, I have had the privilege of having worked for bosses who do stunts like what you have mentioned and then hold you by your balls for being complicit in the crime.


I was thinking of using a dictaphone app in my phone when we have the "salary" talk.

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andri.tjiu
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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby andri.tjiu » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 10:27 pm

Go straight to MOM and tell them you only get 3k, when they reported you getting 5k. They will be very happy to help you with the case.

You will be allowed to work in Singapore while the case is under investigation.

This kind of practice will take attentions not only MOM but IRAS also.

If you just accepted the company practice of paying you only 3k but reported 5k with MOM and IRAS, then the final one is IRAS will chase you for the tax that you need to pay based on the 5k salary.

MOM only can acted if you already working with them for full 1 month and where you should getting 5k but only get 3k based on their practice.
If you not yet working with them and not yet received the salary, then MOM also cannot proceed with the case and take the action to the company.

They will assess and interviews all the staff and selected employees that registered with working visa with the company, if found many have the same cases, the company can get fine and the owner will need to serve jail term and possible of company closure also.

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sundaymorningstaple
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Re: Company paying lower than stated EP salary

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Oct 2016 10:35 pm

Start anywhere you like. Ask Squirrel how long the employees caught up in this mess, even if they are not locked up, have to remain here as material witnesses. A year or more sometimes (the vast majority without salary and not allowed to work - There are some outfits that can help but it's a gamble). THINK! The previous poster made good sense if you have to sign it but it is also a calculated risk in doing so. There is not guarantee that you will be allowed to work while waiting on the court case. Yes it happens but there are way to many instances in the papers where it didn't happen.


http://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-re ... 22-workers

http://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-re ... -kickbacks

http://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-re ... k-offences

http://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-re ... 112-harrys

http://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-re ... plications

http://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-re ... -club-boss

http://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-re ... om-officer

http://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-re ... g-salaries

http://www.mom.gov.sg/newsroom/press-re ... plications


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