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Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Relocating, travelling or planning to make Singapore home? Discuss the criterias, passes or visa that is required.
DC_672491
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Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby DC_672491 » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 6:42 pm

I arrived in SG about two months ago on the standard 90 day visit pass that you get when you arrive at Changi (I intended to stay about 2 months then head home to the US). I work for a company in the US and telework remotely -- no clients, projects, payments or anything else (other than my typing) takes place in SG, so based on this earlier post, the consensus seems to be that SG taxes don't apply and I'm not running afoul of any work restrictions (please correct if wrong).

Shortly after getting here, I quickly met an amazing Singaporean girl, and we've fallen head over heels for each other. I skipped my flight home and am planning to stay here indefinitely -- it's super early (we've been dating for only a couple months), but we're both serious about getting married to each at some point in the next 1-3 years. In the next few months, we'll begin working on the PMLA paperwork and, after we're married, we'll apply for PR status in each other's countries (I'll apply for PR here in SG and she'll apply for a Green Card in the US).

Here's my question: Should I even both with any other paperwork (e.g. WP in SG) until that happens? Assuming I don't need a WP to continue teleworking from SG for my US company (see above and please lmk if you disagree), it seems to me like the path of least resistance is to just continue here on tourist visas/90 day visit passes until I'm married (I'm off to HK or Tokyo every 1-2 months for work so I'm never here longer than 90 days anyway). Is there any flaw in this logic? Am I "missing" any huge benefit by not applying for a WP? Will a series of 4-6 tourist visas be a red flag when applying for a PMLA?

Just want to make sure I'm not missing the point on any of this... I'd rather avoid paperwork if I can, but certainly don't want to break any rules or miss any major benefits.

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Re: RE: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 7:20 pm

DC_672491 wrote:I arrived in SG about two months ago on the standard 90 day visit pass that you get when you arrive at Changi (I intended to stay about 2 months then head home to the US). I work for a company in the US and telework remotely -- no clients, projects, payments or anything else (other than my typing) takes place in SG, so based on this earlier post, the consensus seems to be that SG taxes don't apply and I'm not running afoul of any work restrictions (please correct if wrong).

Shortly after getting here, I quickly met an amazing Singaporean girl, and we've fallen head over heels for each other. I skipped my flight home and am planning to stay here indefinitely -- it's super early (we've been dating for only a couple months), but we're both serious about getting married to each at some point in the next 1-3 years. In the next few months, we'll begin working on the PMLA paperwork and, after we're married, we'll apply for PR status in each other's countries (I'll apply for PR here in SG and she'll apply for a Green Card in the US).

Here's my question: Should I even both with any other paperwork (e.g. WP in SG) until that happens? Assuming I don't need a WP to continue teleworking from SG for my US company (see above and please lmk if you disagree), it seems to me like the path of least resistance is to just continue here on tourist visas/90 day visit passes until I'm married (I'm off to HK or Tokyo every 1-2 months for work so I'm never here longer than 90 days anyway). Is there any flaw in this logic? Am I "missing" any huge benefit by not applying for a WP? Will a series of 4-6 tourist visas be a red flag when applying for a PMLA?

Just want to make sure I'm not missing the point on any of this... I'd rather avoid paperwork if I can, but certainly don't want to break any rules or miss any major benefits.


:)

There'll be no red flags but you are pretty optimistic!

Nothing wrong with that though

Though one day your visa could be curtailed to 30 days ...

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Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 7:28 pm

I didn't think there were any of them left here? She must have hired the services of the Malaysian Coconut Bomoh man. Put a spell on him.

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Re: RE: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby DC_672491 » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 9:07 pm

ecureilx wrote:Though one day your visa could be curtailed to 30 days ...


Given that Malaysia is a 30 minute drive away, I always thought the concept of a day limit on visit passes was kind of odd... I mean, can't I always just take a bus to Malaysia, stay for a night or two in KL, then turn around and come back & get a new 30 day stamp? If I'm spending money here (in SG hotels and riding in SG taxis and eating in SG restaurants) and not taking any job or benefits from any Singaporeans, I don't understand why they'd not want me here if I'm not breaking any rules...

ecureilx wrote:There'll be no red flags but you are pretty optimistic!


Agreed. Although I'm the least optimistic (and romantic) person in the world, so the fact that I'm willing to think this far ahead kind of shocks me. :wink:

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Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby DC_672491 » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 9:10 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:I didn't think there were any of them left here? She must have hired the services of the Malaysian Coconut Bomoh man. Put a spell on him.


Wait... so that's why this guy was following us around on our first date?

Image

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Re: RE: Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 9:23 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:I didn't think there were any of them left here? She must have hired the services of the Malaysian Coconut Bomoh man. Put a spell on him.

Ah, they do exist

Old man, old school romance is still alive, accept it ;) its not dead. Though pretty impressive to go steady in 2 months !!

DC_672491 wrote:Wait... so that's why this guy was following us around on our first date?

Image


Do you remember any Malay satay shall she was frequenting with you ? Or mamak shop serving soup tulong ?

It could have been in the satay sauce or soup.

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Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby taxico » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 10:22 pm

DC_672491 wrote:I arrived in SG about two months ago on the standard 90 day visit pass that you get when you arrive at Changi...

Assuming I don't need a WP to continue teleworking from SG for my US company (see above and please lmk if you disagree), it seems to me like the path of least resistance is to just continue here on tourist visas/90 day visit passes until I'm married (I'm off to HK or Tokyo every 1-2 months for work so I'm never here longer than 90 days anyway)...


to clarify your current plan: how many months do you intend to stay in singapore in total?

there's a 183-day tax resident rule you need to be mindful of...

i suspect if you're staying in SG for >180 days/year, ICA will eventually catch on... the last thing you want during an LDR is to be given a "final visa"/barred from entry.

especially if your girlfriend holds a steady job in singapore (at least for now).
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Re: RE: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby taxico » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 10:31 pm

DC_672491 wrote:
ecureilx wrote:Though one day your visa could be curtailed to 30 days ...


Given that Malaysia is a 30 minute drive away, I always thought the concept of a day limit on visit passes was kind of odd... I mean, can't I always just take a bus to Malaysia, stay for a night or two in KL, then turn around and come back & get a new 30 day stamp? If I'm spending money here (in SG hotels and riding in SG taxis and eating in SG restaurants) and not taking any job or benefits from any Singaporeans, I don't understand why they'd not want me here if I'm not breaking any rules...


just to prevent abuse in "worse case scenarios" i suppose... i too think that if i have enough money to pay for my living expenses, i should be allowed to stay in any country i want on a visitor visa.

sadly, this is not the case anymore.

you may want to plan for the worse - ie, it may be better to plan to get your own work pass if you think this is serious. or move her away on a k-1 (?).
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 10:34 pm

DC_672491 wrote:If I'm spending money here (in SG hotels and riding in SG taxis and eating in SG restaurants) and not taking any job or benefits from any Singaporeans, I don't understand why they'd not want me here if I'm not breaking any rules...


Singapore is not that hard up for your money, unless you put in a couple of million $ ;) or buy an apartment as proof of money.

In fact, they don't want crowding in this little red dot, all else comes next.

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Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 25 Sep 2016 10:55 pm

If you are teleworking you are not contributing anything at all to Singapore. Do you think spending money here is contributing to Singapore? If you do, you are sadly mistaken.

Contributing to Singapore is paying large amounts of corporat taxes or setting up companies that employ Singaporeans. What you are doing is only contributing to some private citizens wealth, not the country's or contributing to your own wealth. In fact you are trying NOT to contribute by teleworking. The little red dot is a small place. Unless you earn your right to be here they know it only takes 3 to 5 days max to "visit" Singapore. Anything else should be on a residency visa of one form or another. Be it Employment, LTVP due to marriage, Student Visa, etc. But On a Social Visit Pass and hopping in and out of the country will only get you banned in the long term. Has happened too many times. It used to be de rigueur back in the '80~90s before it got too expensive for Oil Field hands to stay here (I know - I was one of them till 1994) I left the oilfield and got a job in Singapore and subsequently PR so didn't have to deal with the subterfuge any more. Since the mid '90's it's been rough doing visa turnarounds.

4 to 6 visa turnarounds? You'll be called out on number 3 and will be told when you leave that you wont be back for at least 6 months (if you are lucky). Also LTVPs are very hard to get for foreign Male spouses in normal instances as most ICA officers see that as only a way for them to get residency here. If they give it to you, that may be all you get if you are not working here as the girl will have to be able to support you in ICA's eyes as you are not reporting your own income to IRAS. This will only happen after you get married. PR might never happen and I personally see a troubled relationship fraught with difficulties.

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Re: RE: Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby ecureilx » Mon, 26 Sep 2016 12:30 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:. PR might never happen and I personally see a troubled relationship fraught with difficulties.


+1

Or maybe not so, if she got her green card ;)

Or they set up shop in MM2H or something....

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Re: RE: Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby taxico » Mon, 26 Sep 2016 3:30 am

ecureilx wrote:
sundaymorningstaple wrote:. PR might never happen and I personally see a troubled relationship fraught with difficulties.


+1

Or maybe not so, if she got her green card ;)

Or they set up shop in MM2H or something....


i have a friend (SC) who met a south korean woman on the train, back before uber, war on diabetes, when there were no national terrorism plans...

and they had a whirlwind romance. married in like months? still together. even more fashionable and fartsy now.

so... it CAN happen. but for a singaporean woman... it's gonna be a rare one, that. hope it works out.
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Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby rajagainstthemachine » Mon, 26 Sep 2016 9:19 am

I'm surprised that OP hasn't realized that thousands of people who get off the plane each day have that same fabulous thought of checking into Singapore for 90 days and then doing the visa run to Malaysia or Indonesia.
Btw nice job there hooking up with a local girl, the reason that could have happened was because the local guys here mostly suck.
To get there early is on time and showing up on time is late

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Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 26 Sep 2016 9:30 am

I tried not to say that, Raj! LOL

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Re: RE: Re: Living, dating, and tele-working from SG on a tourist visa

Postby ecureilx » Mon, 26 Sep 2016 10:25 am

rajagainstthemachine wrote:Btw nice job there hooking up with a local girl, the reason that could have happened was because the local guys here mostly suck.


Attack of the SPG ?


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