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LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

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LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby Union Jack » Thu, 21 Jul 2016 4:41 pm

Afternoon all,

Currently trying to decipher what docs are required (and more importantly, how to get) regarding an application for my girlfriend to receive a LTVP here.

Key Points / Current Status:

1) Me: UK Citizen. In Singapore for 3 years & just had EP extended this week for another 2 years.
2) GF: Indonesian Citizen. Currently in Indonesia after living in Singapore for 5 years.
2A) GF: Previous status in Singapore was on a Work Permit (and living over 1 year with me).
3) MOM contacted GF advising that she should not extend on WP based on our situation & apply LTVP
4) GF returned two weeks ago to Indonesia just before WP expired - so no issue on overstay.
5) My company agreed (based on our relationship) to process request for LTVP.

Advised by my HR Department of the following requirement today on requesting said LTVP
================================================================================
Quote:
Documentary proof for one of the relationships between applicant and Main Pass Holder, as stated in the application:

(a) Common Law Spouse
 Common-law marriage certificate issued by the main pass holder/applicant's country (if applicable)

 A letter from the embassy acknowledging the common-law relationship between the main pass holder and the applicant under the laws of their country (if applicable)

 Affidavit stating that the work pass holder’s common-law relationship is recognised in his/her or the spouse’s home country. This affidavit must also be notarized in that same country.
Unquote:

So here we are in Singapore and Indonesia as long-term girlfriend / boyfriend, following the advice previously by MOM about changing her status from WP to LTVP holder and have this barrier.

Essentially this would be of relevance to my British ex-pat crowd of readers who had a similar situation on their partner application if not actually married, however given the EU fundamentals where we're all the same (at least for another two years)..... any other experiences from the 27 other member states ex-pats more than welcome !!!!

Many thanks to all in advance.
Adrian

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 21 Jul 2016 4:49 pm

Sadly, you will not get an LTVP for your gf. Singapore will NOT entertain any common law/de facto relationship entered into in Singapore. The only way Singapore will allow for de facto unions is if they were able to document the relationship as a common law marriage in the EP holder's native country. As the relationship was entered into here in Singapore it is completely out of the question. It's been tried with too many "maids" over the years as well, so don't even think about that scenario either.

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby Union Jack » Thu, 21 Jul 2016 4:56 pm

Thanks for the reply Sundaymorningstaple.
The thing is however is that MOM themselves informed us of having to follow up on this very basis.
By doing so, ie: Making sure she exited before expiry, me extending my own EP in a timely manner this would then allow us to pursue this particular course of action.

Is it really out of the question that boy meets girl in Singapore and then in order to follow due process attempt to get a LTVP?

Thanks in advance

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 21 Jul 2016 9:21 pm

They, with their subjective knowledge of English, probably assumed you were talking about getting married prior to changing the WP to an LTVP. Either they misunderstood or misinterpreted what you were asking. The only way she will get an LTVP is if you get married.

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Re: RE: Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby ecureilx » Thu, 21 Jul 2016 11:48 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:They, with their subjective knowledge of English, probably assumed you were talking about getting married prior to changing the WP to an LTVP. Either they misunderstood or misinterpreted what you were asking. The only way she will get an LTVP is if you get married.

+1 maybe they heard it as both are from UK.

And she coming from Indonesia... unless things changed... won't win points with Sg Gov.

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby BBCWatcher » Fri, 22 Jul 2016 3:12 pm

Adrian is an EP holder, so it'd be a DP (not LTVP) for his wife. Yes, agreed, marriage works.

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 22 Jul 2016 3:19 pm

BBCWatcher wrote:Adrian is an EP holder, so it'd be a DP (not LTVP) for his wife. Yes, agreed, marriage works.


So it makes a difference? Poke->

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby BBCWatcher » Fri, 22 Jul 2016 3:22 pm

Yes, applying for the correct pass type is important if one wants a family member to receive stay permission without unnecessary delay.

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 22 Jul 2016 4:16 pm

As long as the employer is willing to sponsor the trailing unmarried partner, they can get an LTVP if they can prove the existing relationship was entered into before coming to Singapore. If married then the DP is not a problem.

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby okonu » Sat, 23 Jul 2016 8:27 am

Is she Muslim? If so, then (while you are in Indonesia)

- convert to Islam
- Have a religious wedding (nikah sirih) This isn't recognized by the Indonesian government as a marriage, but is commonly done to avoid 'living in sin' Might be enough to establish 'common law wife' status for Singapore

Or you could just get married :)

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby PNGMK » Mon, 25 Jul 2016 12:27 pm

OP's best chance WAS to bring in the former WP holder as a WP holder for him (i.e. as an FDW). Unfortunately he mucked that up as MOM will see straight through this.
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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby Union Jack » Mon, 25 Jul 2016 2:16 pm

This is a bit of a frustrating situation as - in many cases the world over, even here in Singapore - one person meets another person in their new country of residence.

Based on certain Work Situations changing then to abide by residence requirements one of these persons leaves in a timely manner and requests the other to follow up with whatever pass will be relevant to once again satisfy the residence requirements.

Company agrees to process on behalf of me via their agency as long as all paperwork can be provided and then here we are - seemingly trumped - on a technicality whereby it's ok to have a GF in principal on a LTVP as long as the relationship started in 99.99999% of the countries in the world.
Just not here????

I'm not looking to get married, nor am I looking to convert to Islam, (not that shes an Indonesian Muslim in any case).
So are we saying that simply because we MET in Singapore then all bets are off????

Help?

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby ecureilx » Mon, 25 Jul 2016 2:24 pm

Union Jack wrote:This is a bit of a frustrating situation as - in many cases the world over, even here in Singapore - one person meets another person in their new country of residence.


Well, no offense but I guess SG inc, as usual, does a lot of profiling, and a westerner falling in love with an Asian, especially when that happened in Singapore - that raises some eyebrows- at times (no offense again .. ) And a few marriages of convenience cases have made the authorities to clamp down on anybody who even shows a hint of something like that ..

Union Jack wrote:Company agrees to process on behalf of me via their agency as long as all paperwork can be provided and then here we are - seemingly trumped - on a technicality whereby it's ok to have a GF in principal on a LTVP as long as the relationship started in 99.99999% of the countries in the world.
Just not here????


Correct, because, Singapore is in Asia, and "ASIAN" values are expected from Asian men and women. I hope, for example, you have heard of Section 377A, for a start.

And live-in-girl friend business is not encouraged in this part of the world !

I'm not looking to get married, nor am I looking to convert to Islam, (not that shes an Indonesian Muslim in any case).
So are we saying that simply because we MET in Singapore then all bets are off????


Sort of, YES, but, like winning the lottery, you may still get lucky. Though you gotta understand the odds are not in your favour, as of now.

Ah, welcome to Singapore

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 25 Jul 2016 2:49 pm

About the only way it's going to happen is if you marry the girl. This IS a conservative society and shacking up with a girl is not encouraged and is in fact disallowed when it comes to people wanting their foreign squeeze to live with them. It's not the kind of values that Singapore wants to project to the world. Personally, I think you are going to need a lot more than luck.

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Re: LTVP and Document for "common law relationship" ?

Postby PNGMK » Mon, 25 Jul 2016 2:54 pm

There is another option. Battam and Bintan are only a short ferry ride away. Many Singapore resident men have Indonesian wives or girlfriends in those islands. You can maintain a relationship that way until you depart for your home country and then hopefully bring your gf with you to your home country. (Your gf of course can also visit Singapore from Battam a few times a year without major issues).
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