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Leaving singapore without telling landlord

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PNGMK
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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby PNGMK » Fri, 20 May 2016 10:51 am

JR8 wrote:
PNGMK wrote:Now the real stickler - what the hell is the LL doing in the apartment while the lease is still valid? And how did they know the tenant has done a runner?


A LL with reasonable grounds has a right of re-entry upon serving reasonable notice. Not just for rentals, same applies to leasehold property too (ie 100 or whatever years).


and I bet he didn't give notice.... come on JR8 the whole thing is fishy...
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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby Wd40 » Fri, 20 May 2016 12:06 pm

To the OP: If I were in your neighbors shoes, I would tell the landlord. There is nothing to lose. There is something to gain, may be the landlord will let them go with or without deposit. At least morally you are doing the right thing.

I was in similar situation 2 yrs back told the landlord about a month back and maximum loss was the deposit, but we parted on good terms. The lost deposit I made good by being overseas for a month so anyways I would have lost the 1 month rent. I then came back with a new job and rented a house cheaper than the previous one.

Morally you should tell the landlord the moment you decide to leave, not after you leave. At least they have sometime to find another tenant.

It also depends on how well you convey it. Offer full support to find a replacement tenant on a best effort basis. Place ad in gumtree, that's what I did and some tenants came and saw the house as well.

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x9200
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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby x9200 » Sat, 21 May 2016 9:32 am

PNGMK wrote:...and who will he report it to? You guys are in fantasy land. There is no hyped up, armed, land lord recovery unit in Singapore. We've seen already how toothless the Small Claims Tribunal is. You truly think a LL is going to go all the way to the SC; get a judgement and then have that order somehow enforced overseas?

You must have assumed the LL is just a mean person, otherwise you wouldn't be helping some anonymous guy on the Internet to scr**w some other person we know nothing about. For exactly that reason (being mean), the LL may just damage his own property (if he is vindicative enough, and intended to renovate/replace it anyway) and report it to the police. Intentional damage is a criminal offence. And we all know how much local guys love to report and complain.

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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby PNGMK » Sat, 21 May 2016 12:14 pm

I just get tired of the misinformation X.... there is very little chance of someone suffering criminal charges because of fleeing a landlord in Singapore .... there is no issue with immigration and civil debts... I agree it's not ideal that someone flees a debt but there is so little protection for tenants in this country (particularly wrt to their bonds and deposits).

The day a set of gallows is set up in front of the Small Claims court for errant landlords who fail to return deposits will be the same day I agree that errant tenants should be arrested by immigration over a civil debt (and this is obviously sarcasm).
I have gay, black, Asian friends and then JR8.

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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby Sunrisesingapore » Thu, 09 Jun 2016 11:27 am

Singapore has in the last few weeks ratified the Hague Convention. In a nutshell, this means as follows:

(1) This "neighbour" leaves Singapore without paying rent or notifying landlord.
(2) Landlord is fully entitled to the rent for the remainder of the term.
(3) Landlord sues in Singapore, and of course wins very quickly and easily in the absence of any defence or the tenant even showing up.
(4) Now, this is the important part....the landlord can take his Singapore court judgment to the country where the tenant is living, and convert it into a court judgment in that country.
(5) If the tenant still doesn't pay, he will have the local bailiffs knocking on his door wherever he is hiding.

Obviously all this depends on the country to which the tenant has scarpered. But I can tell you, Singapore judgements are pretty much enforceable in most developed places.

The long arm of the law eventually catches up with you. Good luck to your neighbour.

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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby PNGMK » Thu, 09 Jun 2016 12:09 pm

Interesting information Sunrise.

A quick review shows you're indeed correct except the costs and difficulties of finding an oveseas address and process server seem to have pretty much made this impractical...
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sundaymorningstaple
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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 09 Jun 2016 1:31 pm

PNGMK wrote:Interesting information Sunrise.

A quick review shows you're indeed correct except the costs and difficulties of finding an oveseas address and process server seem to have pretty much made this impractical...


Impractical, yes, but scary enough to maybe lessen the number of runners (if they think that they are no longer safe once out of the country). Over the long term, maybe a big enough reduction of runners will cause some of the onerous deposits being lessened (for utilities/phones/credit cards/whatever that have been rising over the past 3 decades.

=D>

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JR8
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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby JR8 » Thu, 09 Jun 2016 4:40 pm

Finding someone in the UK; well here's one reputable and quite well known firm of landlords legal agents... Price about £120. A 'runner' tenant would be liable for that and any other reasonable costs incurred in enforcing debt recovery.
'Landlord Action' - https://www.landlordaction.co.uk/
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x9200
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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby x9200 » Thu, 09 Jun 2016 5:11 pm

Sunrisesingapore wrote:Singapore has in the last few weeks ratified the Hague Convention. In a nutshell, this means as follows:

(1) This "neighbour" leaves Singapore without paying rent or notifying landlord.
(2) Landlord is fully entitled to the rent for the remainder of the term.
(3) Landlord sues in Singapore, and of course wins very quickly and easily in the absence of any defence or the tenant even showing up.
(4) Now, this is the important part....the landlord can take his Singapore court judgment to the country where the tenant is living, and convert it into a court judgment in that country.
(5) If the tenant still doesn't pay, he will have the local bailiffs knocking on his door wherever he is hiding.

Obviously all this depends on the country to which the tenant has scarpered. But I can tell you, Singapore judgements are pretty much enforceable in most developed places.

The long arm of the law eventually catches up with you. Good luck to your neighbour.

Have you checked what countries are the signatories of the convention before posting this uber optimistic message?

It will be completely useless for most of the local LL chasing the tenant cases. Singapore joined the convention for a very pragmatic reason - to become a local legal hub with the ruling recognised by EU and a few other countries. SG is the only country in the region that signed it.

Besides, if the LL is a very persistent person it is possible even now to go after the tenant.

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x9200
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Re: Leaving singapore without telling landlord

Postby x9200 » Thu, 09 Jun 2016 5:35 pm

Actually there is chance the convention may be useful to recover the deposit for the citizens of the said nations. Sue the LL in your own country and execute the ruling in Singapore. But then again, this part was almost never a problem. SCT works well to rule against the local LLs. What happens after or if the LL is not from SG, is a problem.


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