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Citizenship renunciation

Relocating, travelling or planning to make Singapore home? Discuss the criterias, passes or visa that is required.
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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby BBCWatcher » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 11:10 am

PNGMK wrote:You may need to apply for citizenship in another country and surrender that to ICA.

A tongue in cheek suggestion I assume, but just in case not, that wouldn't work. Singapore requires (or attempts to require) termination of all other citizenships when becoming a citizen of Singapore. Mexican citizenship cannot be terminated (at least for citizens born in Mexico). Acquisition of another citizenship does not cause termination of Mexican citizenship.

This'll be solely up to the Singaporean government to decide. Mexico simply isn't going to play Singapore's game. Singapore can either have this new Singaporean citizen (Lizziees) who also happens to be a Mexican citizen (in legal fact at least) or not have this new Singaporean citizen -- those are the only two choices Singapore has. So, Lizziees, you just submit the letter from the Mexican embassy (translated) to ICA if you haven't already, and then ICA makes its decision. I can't think of anything else you can do. The "worst" outcome is that you're still a Singapore PR with Mexican citizenship, and that's certainly not bad. That would also mean that it's impossible for a Mexican citizen born in Mexico to acquire Singaporean citizenship -- and for citizens of a few other countries -- unless and until the Singaporean government changes its policy. I suspect the Singaporean government will quietly relent and not allow a foreign government to have effective veto authority over Singapore's citizenship granting decisions, but we'll see.

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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby PNGMK » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 12:22 pm

Not quite tongue in cheek but a pretty unworkeable scenario. What OP needs to do is look to a country she can migrate to that permits dual citizenship. Such as Australia.
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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 12:48 pm

When my children were born, they had dual citizenship. When it came time once to renew my daughter's passport I was related the following story by the Counselor Officer at the Embassy here. (This has subsequently been changed I believe, but was true back then). A dual citizen young girl, recently turned 21 (US & SG citizenship) was put in a predicament by the Singapore Government as she was required to renounce one of the citizenships by law.

She was engaged to a Singaporean boy at the time and wanted to stay here until the boy finished his Uni education here. But as she was 21 she was pushed to renounce by the local government. So. She penned the requisite letter and duly presented it to the Counselor Officer and at the time the officer asked her if she was sure this was what she wanted to do. At that time, she said no, she wanted to remain a US Citizen as they planned to go to the US after her BF finished university and they got married, but the Singapore Government was forcing the issue to make her renounce one or the other. The officer then told her something that caused a bit of a row eventually back then.

He said to her, "You have fulfilled your compact with the Singapore Government. Singapore law requires that you submit a letter of renunciation to your country of birth if you want to remain in Singapore as a Singapore Citizen after the age of 21. You have fulfilled that compact." Now here's the kicker! "However, no foreign government is going to tell the US State Department that their citizen must renounce their citizenship. You have followed the letter of the law and we duly note that you have done so, under duress. So it is the opinion of the State Department that you will still remain a US citizen."

It's because of that, Singapore now requires that a letter of acceptance be obtained by the person requesting renunciation and presented to MFA/ICA. There was another outcome as well, but I'm not a liberty to put it into print.

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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby Lizziees » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 12:50 pm

I guess i will be a Pr forever

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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby PNGMK » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 12:57 pm

Girls tend to fly under the radar IME if they are dual US/Singapore citizens. I know of a few >21 yo.

Lizzie, there's nothing wrong with being a PR forever. Nothing wrong at all. The only advantage of any significance is you might be able to buy a box in the sky for a subsidized price. When the South China Sea War with China starts you'll be evacuated back to Mexico at least.
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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby Barnsley » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 2:13 pm

Lizziees wrote:I guess i will be a Pr forever


If you are on PTS PR into old age with the intention of staying in Singapore , then I am pretty sure that with no job you will be shown the door.

I am sure there was a story of a European lady who had been PR for 30yrs+ or something like that , hit her 60's , suddenly no job, I think she retired , sent packing , was a couple of years ago.
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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby PNGMK » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 3:28 pm

SMS and I have discussed this off and on for a few years Barnsley. We think that's not the case provided you have the finances for self support.
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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby Barnsley » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 4:46 pm

PNGMK wrote:SMS and I have discussed this off and on for a few years Barnsley. We think that's not the case provided you have the finances for self support.


Fair enough :D

Ultimately though the PR is still only a 5yr Visa and you are at the whim of the Govt of the day.

If you are a citizen its considerably harder to remove you from the country.
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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 5:33 pm

That point I'll have to concede, Barnsley. This country is known for moving the goalposts or hiding the cheese.

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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby BBCWatcher » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 8:16 pm

Lizziees wrote:I guess i will be a Pr forever

Have you submitted the translated letter from the Mexican embassy to ICA yet?

U.S. law is different than Mexican law. It's not a comparison that works in this instance.

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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 03 Jun 2016 8:44 pm

Nobody said it was. It's Singapore law that is the problem.

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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby Mexikaner » Fri, 24 Jun 2016 4:32 pm

I think this is a tricky one, as the Mexican Constitution considers Mexican Nationality and Mexican Citizenship as two very different things. You are automatically a Mexican NATIONAL when you are either a. born in Mexico, b. born in a foreign country to a Mexican dad and/or mom, c. born in a foreign country to a naturalized Mexican dad and/or mom, or d. born while on a Mexican airplane/ship
On the other hand, you become a Mexican CITIZEN, once you turn 18 years of age (provided you are a Mexican NATIONAL by then, duh!)
So which one is the Singapore Gov asking the OP to renounce?
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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby mmhgloba » Tue, 20 Dec 2016 12:45 pm

Lizziees wrote:Yeah mexico embassy cant provide that letter and ica keep asking for it.


If you have $100,000 you can get a Caribbean passport that allows dual citizenship. https://www.newpassportpro.com/dominica-citizenship/
Last edited by mmhgloba on Tue, 23 May 2017 4:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby Barnsley » Tue, 20 Dec 2016 2:35 pm

mmhgloba wrote:
Lizziees wrote:Yeah mexico embassy cant provide that letter and ica keep asking for it.


If you have $100,000 you can get a Caribbean passport that allows dual citizenship. http://www.globaltravelpress.com/dominica-citizenship/


How does this help becoming a Singapore Citizen?

Good to know what I can get for $100K though ... Thanks.
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Re: Citizenship renunciation

Postby mmhgloba » Tue, 20 Dec 2016 2:51 pm

You would have a new passport to work with and you can reapply for the Singapore citizenship. JUst a thought.

Also, the Mexican consulate in Singapore may not be the authority on this issue. I would strongly suggest inquiring with another consulate about renunciation. With US renunciation it is the same. It is just human nature, if an embassy manager sees themselves as patriotic then your request will likely fall of the desk or you will get misleading info.
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