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Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby TMD » Thu, 10 Dec 2015 4:10 pm

ecureilx wrote:
TMD wrote:
ecureilx wrote: So again, thanks for reinforcing my fears that Indians + alcohol = riots.
Talk about stereotyping in an extreme negative way again and again :)

Don't thank me. Rather is it how one interprets the COI finding. :P

The COI was given a mandate to find a scapegoat, so they did repeat the story that Indians are drunkards and troublemakers, and then you repeat it.]/quote]


Wooo...that is one serious allegation you hv here. :o
Now, assuming you are referring to the same COI report which I had shared in another post, it is clear to me that you have already decided it is targeting a specific community even-though the 5-pages summary hardly mention any ethnic/national group.

Perhaps the inconvenient truth is what got people a little tense up when comes to discussing post-LI riot.
(ps: I will ignore the rest of your comments, which I notice has become more of a rant driven by apparent strong feelings.)

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby ecureilx » Thu, 10 Dec 2015 4:23 pm

TMD wrote:Perhaps the inconvenient truth is what got people a little tense up when comes to discussing post-LI riot.
(ps: I will ignore the rest of your comments, which I notice has become more of a rant driven by apparent strong feelings.)


I see it quite funny, when I see you insisting the long held local stereotype - Indians = drunkards.

That's the most convenient story to divert attention from races who drink more ...

Years ago, an Indian colleague casually said that he likes to have a can of beer when we finish work, and it was just a can of beer. Nothing more.

When he went to the company CEO for some unrelated issue, the CEO didn't miss the chance to print out statistics showing "indians have drinking problem .. " etc. etc, In Singapore context.

My colleague just and asked, if a can of beer = drunkard, so what about out our office ah bengs and Ah lians, who on a weekly basis, get a bottle of Martel + Chivas +Vodka, and beer, and add in some colourful drinks / shooters, and finish all of it before they leave the bar / club. That's like 3 liters hard liquor, bottoms upped by 5 or 6 guys.

And my colleague went on to ask the boss that during a company event, the boss himself downed a dozen plus whiskey + Tequila shots, for my colleague's 3 mugs of beer. How did that make himself a drunkard.

No comments-

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby TMD » Thu, 10 Dec 2015 4:55 pm

ecureilx wrote:I see it quite funny, when I see you insisting the long held local stereotype - Indians = drunkards. That's the most convenient story to divert attention from races who drink more ...


Pray tell which of my comment in this Thread that have given you that impression ?
Or hv u confused me with some other posters ?

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby rajagainstthemachine » Fri, 11 Dec 2015 10:21 am

TMD wrote:Back to the sales of alcohol in the area, would you support or perhaps reconsider lifting the ban of sales and consumption control in LI ?


Look I've lived in LI/Farrer Park areas for 1.5 years from 2012-2014, apart from 1-2 brawls which is common in other areas of Singapore I've never witnessed something extraordinary.
so yes i would support lifting the ban on sales and consumption of alcohol in that vicinity
EXCEPT sundays!!
and the reason for this is because of crowd control not anything else, its insane to channel thousands on subcon folk into this area and then not have proper crowd control or pedestrian safety, as it is we have subcons who don't heed traffic lights jaywalking, jumping signals etc, now imagine the same guys who are tipsy or drunk? that's asking for trouble right there.
we don't need more accidents which could trigger another frenzy.
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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby nakatago » Fri, 11 Dec 2015 10:57 am

rajagainstthemachine wrote:
TMD wrote:Back to the sales of alcohol in the area, would you support or perhaps reconsider lifting the ban of sales and consumption control in LI ?


Look I've lived in LI/Farrer Park areas for 1.5 years from 2012-2014, apart from 1-2 brawls which is common in other areas of Singapore I've never witnessed something extraordinary.
so yes i would support lifting the ban on sales and consumption of alcohol in that vicinity
EXCEPT sundays!!
and the reason for this is because of crowd control not anything else, its insane to channel thousands on subcon folk into this area and then not have proper crowd control or pedestrian safety, as it is we have subcons who don't heed traffic lights jaywalking, jumping signals etc, now imagine the same guys who are tipsy or drunk? that's asking for trouble right there.
we don't need more accidents which could trigger another frenzy.


Stop being so reasonable!

You're dispelling my unfounded and biased impression of a group of people of which my preconception reinforces any unfair stereotypes my own group of people perpetuate about said group of people!

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby TMD » Fri, 11 Dec 2015 12:48 pm

rajagainstthemachine wrote:
TMD wrote:Back to the sales of alcohol in the area, would you support or perhaps reconsider lifting the ban of sales and consumption control in LI ?


Look I've lived in LI/Farrer Park areas for 1.5 years from 2012-2014, apart from 1-2 brawls which is common in other areas of Singapore I've never witnessed something extraordinary.
so yes i would support lifting the ban on sales and consumption of alcohol in that vicinity
EXCEPT sundays!!

and the reason for this is because of crowd control not anything else, its insane to channel thousands on subcon folk into this area and then not have proper crowd control or pedestrian safety, as it is we have subcons who don't heed traffic lights jaywalking, jumping signals etc, now imagine the same guys who are tipsy or drunk? that's asking for trouble right there.
we don't need more accidents which could trigger another frenzy.


No rules and regulations are caste in stone.

Reading at how some of those small businesses suffer under the banning of these product sales and consumption restriction, I too welcome the return of "normality" we had taken for granted before the Riot...which interestingly occured on a Sunday evening..

Having frequent the area and also gotten used to jayworkings and crazy traffic chaos that is unique there I can say that is part of the charm.

So there is a balancing act - How to ensure security, peace, and harmonious atmosphere while not impinging on commercial and social contribution that LI provides.

I guess in Singapore's context, we know where the priority is.

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby rajagainstthemachine » Fri, 11 Dec 2015 5:07 pm

nakatago wrote:Stop being so reasonable!

You're dispelling my unfounded and biased impression of a group of people of which my preconception reinforces any unfair stereotypes my own group of people perpetuate about said group of people!


i had to encapsulate some of your words within braces to interpret what you were trying to say there, can't you just be a normal pinoy dude for once?
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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby rajagainstthemachine » Fri, 11 Dec 2015 5:33 pm

TMD wrote:No rules and regulations are caste in stone.

Reading at how some of those small businesses suffer under the banning of these product sales and consumption restriction, I too welcome the return of "normality" we had taken for granted before the Riot...which interestingly occured on a Sunday evening..

Having frequent the area and also gotten used to jayworkings and crazy traffic chaos that is unique there I can say that is part of the charm.

So there is a balancing act - How to ensure security, peace, and harmonious atmosphere while not impinging on commercial and social contribution that LI provides.

I guess in Singapore's context, we know where the priority is.


Jaywalking on normal days is acceptable I'd imagine but on Sundays with bad crowd control it's harrowing for vehicle drivers. why can't there be a system to regulate the number of workers into LI by implementing different work patterns or shift schedules?
there is a technology called work force management and work force optimization you know?
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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 11 Dec 2015 5:42 pm

I reckon a bunch of spoiled PRC guys with hot Ferraris or locals with black BMWs could be paid to race up Serangoon Road. That would clean out the place pretty soon. Reduce the population of both in the process. But a heck of a waste of good machinery (Ferraris).

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby TMD » Mon, 21 Dec 2015 1:25 pm

rajagainstthemachine wrote:
TMD wrote:No rules and regulations are caste in stone.

Reading at how some of those small businesses suffer under the banning of these product sales and consumption restriction, I too welcome the return of "normality" we had taken for granted before the Riot...which interestingly occured on a Sunday evening..

Having frequent the area and also gotten used to jayworkings and crazy traffic chaos that is unique there I can say that is part of the charm.

So there is a balancing act - How to ensure security, peace, and harmonious atmosphere while not impinging on commercial and social contribution that LI provides.

I guess in Singapore's context, we know where the priority is.


Jaywalking on normal days is acceptable I'd imagine but on Sundays with bad crowd control it's harrowing for vehicle drivers. why can't there be a system to regulate the number of workers into LI by implementing different work patterns or shift schedules?
there is a technology called work force management and work force optimization you know?


What we can see since the riot is there are attempts to control, if not reduce the crowding. It isn't feabile nor acceptable to out-right for authority to decide who and when one can visit the place in a given period, the next best thing is to improve the area's public facilities.

End of the day, it all depends on individual behavior and someone needs to be on the ground to manage them even when new public infrastructures like the S$18m Little India Bus Terminal along Hampshire Road was build - which is one of the outcome of COI.

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/spe ... 38494.html
https://publictransportsg.wordpress.com ... -terminal/
Image

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby rajagainstthemachine » Mon, 21 Dec 2015 2:06 pm

have buses departing from the dormitories to other locations too.
for eg.

1. dormitory -> geylang
2. dormitory -> chinatown
3. dormitory -> gardens by the bay
4. dormitory -> botanic gardens
5. dormitory -> lucky plaza
etc..
To get there early is on time and showing up on time is late

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby TMD » Mon, 21 Dec 2015 3:20 pm

Precisely my point earlier - migrant workers have choices where they wanna go on weekends and are made easier with all these chartered tpt services. Now unless authorities/employers can determine where they can go (is this acceptable?), provided better facilities and better communication,the next best thing is to control the next plausible cause of the LI riot.

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Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 21 Dec 2015 3:33 pm

My only wish is that, everyone who has a hand in the curtailing of human rights selectively is, in the future, subjected to the same, some time, some where, some how. Whenever making decisions like this, one should actually walk a mile in their shoes first. George, old chap, you don't know how right you were.

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Re: RE: Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby ecureilx » Mon, 21 Dec 2015 4:55 pm

TMD wrote:Precisely my point earlier - migrant workers have choices where they wanna go on weekends and are made easier with all these chartered tpt services. Now unless authorities/employers can determine where they can go (is this acceptable?), provided better facilities and better communication,the next best thing is to control the next plausible cause of the LI riot.


They all want to go to LI.

That's why the shuttles operate.

And most shuttles are for return, not to send them to LI. They get to LI by BMW.

So ... are you gonna forcefully send them to elsewhere places like G, to ogle the cows?

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Re: RE: Re: Little India riot: Two years on, smaller businesses struggle to stay afloat

Postby TMD » Mon, 21 Dec 2015 6:18 pm

ecureilx wrote:
TMD wrote:Precisely my point earlier - migrant workers have choices where they wanna go on weekends and are made easier with all these chartered tpt services. Now unless authorities/employers can determine where they can go (is this acceptable?), provided better facilities and better communication,the next best thing is to control the next plausible cause of the LI riot.


They all want to go to LI. That's why the shuttles operate.
And most shuttles are for return, not to send them to LI. They get to LI by BMW.
So ... are you gonna forcefully send them to elsewhere places like G, to ogle the cows?


You just spark a BRILLIANT idea, though not original - how about tax them as entrance fee to LI ?
Kinda like crowd-control version of ERP.

Nothing about human-rights, cow-rights or whatever - it is a simple commercial application of market demand vs cost.


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