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PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Relocating, travelling or planning to make Singapore home? Discuss the criterias, passes or visa that is required.
littledesires
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PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby littledesires » Sat, 07 Nov 2015 1:27 pm

Hi

I am eligible for a PEP employment visa and would like to know from a PR standpoint , does it have any advantage over P1 visa?

Also what are the success rates for P1 and PEP visa holders for PR application?
When are P1 and PEP employment visa holders currently eligible to apply for PR?

Appreciate your advice and experienced stories

LD

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby bgd » Sat, 07 Nov 2015 2:39 pm

PEP used to be a stepping stone to PR, not sure whether that's the case anymore. Advantage of PEP over EP is that it is not tied to your job, unlike an EP.

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Re: RE: Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby ecureilx » Sat, 07 Nov 2015 3:15 pm

bgd wrote:PEP used to be a stepping stone to PR, not sure whether that's the case anymore. Advantage of PEP over EP is that it is not tied to your job, unlike an EP.

Stepping stone ?

It was more like for those who don't want PR or can't get PR.

More like a middle solution.

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby JR8 » Sat, 07 Nov 2015 5:53 pm

littledesires wrote:When are P1 and PEP employment visa holders currently eligible to apply for PR?


IIRC the general rule re: timing for PR, is that there is almost zero point applying before you've filed and paid 3 years of local tax returns.
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 07 Nov 2015 6:03 pm

Technically after 6 months, but I've never seen one successful, but I'm sure there is one somewhere. The requirements for you application "to be accepted" for consideration is 6 months. That just means you can apply after 6 months and they wont reject it. But getting it approved is another story altogether. As was already pointed out, minimum of three tax returns or at least 2 consecutive years on EP status. I usually advise after your first EP renewal (which, in normal practice is around 24 months).

Advantage over P1? none that I can think of as the benefits for which it was designed were so abused, that they even cut back the duration from 5 years to 3 years. At the end of three years, if you haven't applied for PR, the odds of getting it renewed are almost nil. Most used it solely as a 5 years residency visa so they didn't have to leave Singapore after losing their job to a local (happening a lot now days - not necessarily for the good, but what to do?)

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby BBCWatcher » Sat, 07 Nov 2015 8:28 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:At the end of three years, if you haven't applied for PR, the odds of getting it renewed are almost nil.

A Personalised Employment Pass (PEP) is not/has never been renewable. It's once per person per lifetime.

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby littledesires » Sat, 07 Nov 2015 11:05 pm

Thanks for your feedback

What I gather from your feedback is that it doesn’t really make a difference between P1 employment visa and PEP for applying for a PR. It only helps with regards to switching jobs.

My wife is an ex-Singaporean ( who grew up and studied all her life in Singapore)with her immediate family here who are Singaporeans. She is also elgible to be on P1 or PEP.

We have decided to take up Singapore as our home and with elderly parents from her side, it doesn’t make sense for us to leave Singapore . She does want to make sure she gets her PR and Singapore citizenship so that she can be there as her parents caregiver.

Which option for PR application seems the best from her perspective?
1. She and I apply on Separate PR application?
2. She as a main applicant?
3. I as the main applicant?

LD

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby BBCWatcher » Sat, 07 Nov 2015 11:40 pm

Not #1.

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 08 Nov 2015 9:38 am

How many working years has she been a non-Singaporean?

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby littledesires » Sun, 08 Nov 2015 12:22 pm

To explain further:
My wife wishes to get her PR and Citizenship more than me. I am flexible in remaining on employment pass. It gives her the flexibility to be here longer (incase she loses her job or I relocate within the region) so that she can be here for her parents.

Our main concerns are :
1. If we apply as a joint application , will my citizenship( Indian) pull down the application. She is a Canadian citizen. Would she applying alone be a better option, with me not applying?

2. She has the advantage that her immediate family is here for the application, but would the fact she was an ex Singaporean upto a few years back, work for her or against her?

She has been a non Singaporean for 4 ½ years, but she has email proof of writing into ICA within 3 months of renouncing asking whether she could regain back her citizenship. She was told that she needs to come back as a foreigner and reapply for PR and citizenship.

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 08 Nov 2015 1:26 pm

littledesires wrote:To explain further:
My wife wishes to get her PR and Citizenship more than me. I am flexible in remaining on employment pass. It gives her the flexibility to be here longer (incase she loses her job or I relocate within the region) so that she can be here for her parents.

Our main concerns are :
1. If we apply as a joint application , will my citizenship( Indian) pull down the application. She is a Canadian citizen. Would she applying alone be a better option, with me not applying?

Is she also an ethnic Indian? Not sure if it will have bearing or not, but just curious.

2. She has the advantage that her immediate family is here for the application, but would the fact she was an ex Singaporean upto a few years back, work for her or against her?

Gut feelings say it would work against her.

She has been a non Singaporean for 4 ½ years, but she has email proof of writing into ICA within 3 months of renouncing asking whether she could regain back her citizenship. She was told that she needs to come back as a foreigner and reapply for PR and citizenship.

Has she been working for the past 4.5 years?

She has email proof that is over 4 years old. Did I understand that correctly? So four years later you decide to try it? What she as been told is correct. But so far, I've never met somebody who gave up their Citizenship and then came back and manage to regain it. Taxico may have more information on that that I do. I do know that PR's who have given up their PR status and withdrawn their CPF are not able to obtain PR until such time as they have reinstituted all the CPF AND the interest AND the interest that would have accured had the CPF been left in situ. Whether they would require some sort of CPF top up for the years in Canada I don't know? When she gave up her Citizenship, did she withdraw her CPF (Regardless of the amount)?

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby littledesires » Sun, 08 Nov 2015 2:44 pm

Thanks sundaymorningstaple for your reply

Yes she is Indian by origin.

With regards to work in Singapore, it is a chicken and egg story. She has 15 years work experience ( 10 in Singapore and 5 in Canada). Her qualifications from primary to her postgraduate degree is in Singapore. It has taken her 4 1/2 years to get a job in Singapore. These 4 1/2 years she has not been working but trying to get a job in Singapore. She has been with her parents on and off in Singapore and trying to get a job at the same time.

Until she gets her job in Singapore, she cant move to the next step of applying for Pr and later citizenship. Now that she has found a job, she likes to plan when is the earliest she can apply and what her chances would be and which option works best, she applying alone or with me

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby JR8 » Sun, 08 Nov 2015 5:29 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:I've never met somebody who gave up their Citizenship and then came back and manage to regain it. Taxico may have more information on that that I do. I do know that PR's who have given up their PR status and withdrawn their CPF are not able to obtain PR until such time as they have reinstituted all the CPF AND the interest AND the interest that would have accured had the CPF been left in situ. Whether they would require some sort of CPF top up for the years in Canada I don't know? When she gave up her Citizenship, did she withdraw her CPF (Regardless of the amount)?


LD: It might be irrelevant, your description ['My wife is an ex-Singaporean ( who grew up and studied all her life in Singapore)with her immediate family here who are Singaporeans'] suggests to me your wife was 'born and bred' Singaporean. Is that the case?
SMS's question re: CPF might (or might not) alter things depending on the answer to the above; i.e. you need to be clear on what the answer to it is.

@SMS. I'm considering it from a 'Contact Singapore' viewpoint. IF it's a former SC with family in SG [care-giving to the elderly = 'good'], moved away ['bad'], now 'seen the error of her ways' and wants to return to the fold ['good'], are they going to give her problems? I can see if she was just an PR, they'd be unlikely to give her a second bite of the cherry, but a former SC who is willing to replenish her CPF if required?

Key question for inexpert me, was she born in SG; and/or how did she get her SGn citizenship?
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 08 Nov 2015 7:23 pm

I didn't dig that deep as I figured she probably withdrew her CPF when she renounced and that would be the real spanner in the works, regardless of whether or not she has family here. She may be given PR again, but citizenship? Unless she has left her CPF in situ, or is prepared to replace that which was withdrawn, etc, I don't see it happening regardless of the family situation. I would be surprised if they gave her PR even, if she withdrew her CPF. It's a real sticky point with the government.

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Re: PEP employment visa vs P1 employment visa

Postby littledesires » Sun, 08 Nov 2015 7:27 pm

She came here when she was 3, her parents took citizenship in a few years and so she got it to.

Left Singapore 10 yrs back when she could not get job opportunities, ( Singapore in the last 10 years has been moving towards finance services, bio technology, advertising, Energy). Certain fields like manufacturing moved over to China causing certain professions to become redundant.

She had two children from her first marriage to feed ( a boy and a girl). She got a good job offer and left for Canada first with the hope of bringing her kids when she settled down. The Canadian citizenship she thought would be a gateway for her kids. She did not change her children's citizenship , until they were of an age to give their approval to it. In a matter of few months after getting her Canadian citizenship , her children who then entered their teenage years did not wish to come to Canada. So she felt there was no point in being in Canada alone and decided to return back to face the same no job situation with the added constraint of being a foreigner. Her son will be doing NS next year. With her parents and kids in Singapore, she doesnt see any necessity for her to be in Canada or hold on to a Canadian passport.

With regards to CPF money, it was minimal and she had stated in her email when she had asked ICA above getting back the citizenship, that she is willing to replenish it. If it is required she is willing to do it.


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