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PR application under PTS or Family Ties

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homer_shenzhen
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PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby homer_shenzhen » Sat, 24 Oct 2015 8:36 pm

Hello fellow forummers. Occasional lurker and first time poster here with a question.

I am planning to apply for PR, and debating whether I'd have better chances under PTS or family ties scheme (in relative terms at least). Details of my situation:

Me: Male, US citizen (ethnicity Indian), early 40s, salary high teens monthly (non-financial sector), working in Singapore on EP for 2 years

Wife: Chinese citizen, mid 30s, salary low teens monthly (non-financial sector), working in Singapore for total 6 years, PR for 3 years (citizenship recently applied result pending), property owner.

We've been married for 2 months, no kids yet

I noticed on the PTS application form that there is no place to mention that wife is PR. In fact it only asks spouse's FIN number if any (not NRIC), her citizenship, and whether she will be applying for PR with me. I suppose a comment that she is already PR can be added to the application form though.

If applying under family ties the application form has no place for professional profile or eduction details (both of which I believe would be to my advantage, as I've worked for well known organizations and both my degrees are from top ten schools)

I am tending towards PTS application simply because its easier to add a comment that wife is PR, rather than to append my professional/academic background to a family ties application. Besides we've been married only 2 months. On the other hand, age and ethncity don't seem to be in my favor for a PTS based application, reading from several other threads on this forum.

Any thoughts/suggestions/perspectives greatly appreciated :-k

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Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby BBCWatcher » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 8:26 am

I'd vote for family ties. But why do you feel that you need to append details about your professional background to a family ties PR application? ICA doesn't ask, and they assess based on family ties criteria which you and your spouse appear to have extremely well covered.

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Re: RE: Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 10:20 am

BBCWatcher wrote:I'd vote for family ties. But why do you feel that you need to append details about your professional background to a family ties PR application? ICA doesn't ask, and they assess based on family ties criteria which you and your spouse appear to have extremely well covered.


Speechless ...... I am

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Re: RE: Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby BBCWatcher » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 10:56 am

ecureilx wrote:Speechless ...... I am

Good! :mrgreen:

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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 11:23 am

BBCWatcher wrote:
ecureilx wrote:Speechless ...... I am

Good! :mrgreen:

In case you didn't get it, if the applicant is working in Singapore, regardless of PTS or family ties, he or she has to submit all documents including employment information and credentials
And ICA wants all that and more, before they decide what they will keep or return.

There's no escape route there.

Just wait for somebody who has gone down that path to affirm this ....

Or if you know something contrary to the above, do let me know.

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Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 1:47 pm

Actually, I went the Family Ties route many years ago but was on an EP at the time and I questioned ICA about this (days of manual submissions only). They told me that when vetting a Family Ties application, they check both the applicants PTS values as well as the Family Ties and then gives the PR based on the strongest set of values. So, if you apply on PTS, they will only judge based on PTS, but if you apply via Family Ties, your PTS quals will play into it as well, just upping your chances. Go via Family Ties.

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Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby BBCWatcher » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 1:57 pm

I agree with SMS. I'm not sure what you mean, Ecureilx, but here's what ICA says.

I understood Homer perfectly. Homer has the choice to apply for PR as a spouse of a PR (Form 4) or on his own as an EP holder (Form 4A). Forms 4 and 4A are different and request somewhat different information. For example, Form 4 does not ask for "Details of Achievements and Innovations which you have made in your Profession/Occupation." He's concerned about that omission if he applies via Form 4. I'm not concerned, but perhaps you have a different view? Both application paths allow the applicant to add an attachment, but I would recommend doing that only for something truly exceptional and outstanding that is not otherwise reflected in the application. And Form 4 is the better path to lead with, so go with that to get the best shot at approval.

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Re: RE: Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 2:56 pm

BBCWatcher wrote:, but I would recommend doing that only for something truly exceptional and outstanding that is not otherwise reflected in the application.


That's the part I don't agree but what do I know ...

As I said, you should prepare and bring everything ..

SMS, how long ago was your first REP ?

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Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 3:18 pm

20+ years. Due to renew next year I think. Difficult to remember without it being stamped in the passport now. I think I need to go online to make sure as my last one was one of the last 10 year renewals.

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Re: RE: Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 3:27 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:20+ years. Due to renew next year I think. Difficult to remember without it being stamped in the passport now. I think I need to go online to make sure as my last one was one of the last 10 year renewals.

:) I haven't heard of any ten year REP of late. Used to be the norm years ago, for first renewal itself.

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Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 3:51 pm

I didn't realize my REP expires on 4 Jan 2016. So, it took all of 5 minutes to renew it. Done and dusted for another 5 years. ;-)

Thanks for the reminder, squirrel! :-)

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Re: RE: Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby BBCWatcher » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 4:08 pm

ecureilx wrote:As I said, you should prepare and bring everything ..

I assume you don't actually mean "everything" -- preparing and bringing one's certificate of perfect attendance at elementary school, as an example. I hope we can agree to use some good judgment in considering what (if anything) to include with Form 4 that ICA does not specifically request.

As an imperfect analogy, the prosecutors in O.J. Simpson's trial clearly made a grave error in over-arguing their case. I don't recommend over-arguing a PR application.

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Re: RE: Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby JR8 » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 4:35 pm

BBCWatcher wrote:As an imperfect analogy, the prosecutors in O.J. Simpson's trial clearly made a grave error in over-arguing their case. I don't recommend over-arguing a PR application.


Reminds me of a JPnese expression: 'He who seeks to convince cannot persuade'.

There is also a British expression in a similar vein: 'He doth protest too much'. I.e he's lying. The original is from Shakespeare's Hamlet.

---
'The lady doth protest too much
When somebody keeps denying something to the point where you start to think they actually did it

From Hamlet
"I never borrow your clothes. I have enough of my own clothes that I would never take from your closet... You would know if I borrowed them"

"the lady doth protest too much... Why would you be so passionately denying something you weren't accused of"

---
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.p ... t+too+much
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby homer_shenzhen » Mon, 26 Oct 2015 12:23 am

Thanks for everyone's inputs, all very helpful, in particular the first hand suggestions from SMS and BBCWatcher. I had read a few other threads on this topic prior to posting, but they did not seem to cover any situations similar to mine. So, I'll be posting the progress of my application for other's reference, and in the meanwhile hopefully be a more regular participant on the forum than I have been in the past.

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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: PR application under PTS or Family Ties

Postby ecureilx » Mon, 26 Oct 2015 7:32 am

BBCWatcher wrote:I assume you don't actually mean "everything" -- preparing and bringing one's certificate of perfect attendance at elementary school, as an example. I hope we can agree to use some good judgment in considering what (if anything) to include with Form 4 that ICA does not specifically request.
.


But are you able to confirm that ICA ain't gonna ask the high school completion certificate ?

Anyway, upto you and OP, and good luck to you and OP if you think I am spewing drivel.

From what I have seen, ICA staff of late been asking more documents at their discretion, than less, so go prepared, than not, and let the ICA staff decide, is my 2 cents

Over arguing ? Oh man, I give up. I didn't know you need to argue and appeal and present your case at ICA.


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