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Asking to resign

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Yahaan
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Asking to resign

Postby Yahaan » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 9:32 am

I noticed that in my company, my manager has let go many people, in between their contract, due to performance reasons. But in all cases he asks people to resign instead of firing them.

I wonder what if I refuse to resign? I am wondering if my manager is having an easy way out by asking people to resign on their own. If he has to terminate them he will probably have to get the hr involved and the justify etc?

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nakatago
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Re: Asking to resign

Postby nakatago » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 9:41 am

Does your company provide severance packages? If yes, people resigning won't qualify them to getting that.

On the other hand, people resigning means no one can every say they were fired, let go, retrenched or whatever.

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the lynx
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Re: Asking to resign

Postby the lynx » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 9:44 am

Yahaan wrote:I noticed that in my company, my manager has let go many people, in between their contract, due to performance reasons. But in all cases he asks people to resign instead of firing them.

I wonder what if I refuse to resign? I am wondering if my manager is having an easy way out by asking people to resign on their own. If he has to terminate them he will probably have to get the hr involved and the justify etc?


Yes, especially when there is severance clause in your employment contract that states that the company will have to pay you big money if you are retrenched or terminated against your will for reasons any other than disciplinary matters. Asking you to resign means they don't have to do that, and it will be viewed as termination on mutual grounds.

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Re: Asking to resign

Postby rajagainstthemachine » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 9:54 am

nakatago wrote:Does your company provide severance packages? If yes, people resigning won't qualify them to getting that.

On the other hand, people resigning means no one can every say they were fired, let go, retrenched or whatever.


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Yahaan
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Re: Asking to resign

Postby Yahaan » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 10:06 am

No my company doesn't have severance package.

I think in Asia the norm is to ask people to resign on their own rather than terminate them. I was just wondering what are the legal implications if your manager asks you to resign but you don't.

I think the main impact could be for reference checks. If you resign on your own and make I easy for your boss, he and hr may give a positive reference check. If not may be the experience letter too will say terminated due to bad performance, I guess?

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the lynx
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Re: Asking to resign

Postby the lynx » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 10:43 am

Yahaan wrote:No my company doesn't have severance package.

I think in Asia the norm is to ask people to resign on their own rather than terminate them. I was just wondering what are the legal implications if your manager asks you to resign but you don't.

I think the main impact could be for reference checks. If you resign on your own and make I easy for your boss, he and hr may give a positive reference check. If not may be the experience letter too will say terminated due to bad performance, I guess?


Not sure if MOM will be prepared to assist in cases where unlawful termination like this happens to EP holders.

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Re: Asking to resign

Postby x9200 » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 12:03 pm

Yahaan wrote:No my company doesn't have severance package.

I think in Asia the norm is to ask people to resign on their own rather than terminate them. I was just wondering what are the legal implications if your manager asks you to resign but you don't.

I think the main impact could be for reference checks. If you resign on your own and make I easy for your boss, he and hr may give a positive reference check. If not may be the experience letter too will say terminated due to bad performance, I guess?

Yes, the reason you mentioned is the correct one. It is a local custom.
If one doesn't want to resign there are IMHO the following possible scenarios:
(1) if this is some bigger company, they will simply wait till the end of the contract. I have seen it happened even with really bad performers.
(2) if for some reason they have to get rid of the employee they will do it with a standard, contract based termination note under some false but neutral pretext (position reduced, funds reduced etc.)

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Re: Asking to resign

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 3:02 pm

As long as you either give them notice or salary in lieu of notice at the minimum of MOM requirement or the terms of your contract,whichever is larger, you don't need to give any reasons whatsoever for the dismissal. One I've used often in the past is "lack of corporate fit". Pay them their salary in lieu or let 'em work out their notice, depending how badly we want to see the backside of the employee.

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Re: Asking to resign

Postby Addadude » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 3:26 pm

If you are an executive, MOM take the view that, since you as an employee can resign without having to give a reason, likewise your boss can fire you without having to give a reason.

I suppose it looks better on your resume to say you 'resigned'.

But a senior recruiter recently told me that being fired is no longer considered a huge negative by potential employers and recruiters since it is very often a fact of corporate life.
"Both politicians and nappies need to be changed regularly, and for the same reasons."

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Re: Asking to resign

Postby Yahaan » Fri, 18 Sep 2015 7:37 pm

Thanks everybody. SMS, so what do you prefer, when you want to fire someone for being a misfit, since you are a HR, and why?



1)Notify employee officially that they are going to be terminated



2)Ask them off the record, to tender their resignation, so officially it looks like the employee resigned on his own.







In my decade long experience in Asia I have never seen an employer officially terminating someone for poor performance. Its always been employer asking the employee to tender resignation. There are only 2 scenarios where I have seen official termination.



1) In case the employer wants to offer severance, and the termination mostly due to cost cutting measures.



2) In case the employee created some serious fraud or breach of contract.

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sundaymorningstaple
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Re: Asking to resign

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 19 Sep 2015 12:26 am

Depends on whether the employee is a general misfit or termination for cause. General Misfit I normally give them a letter explaining exactly that or give them the chance to resign. But I do give them a choice unless it's for cause.

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Re: Asking to resign

Postby thismyvoice » Sat, 19 Sep 2015 8:10 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:As long as you either give them notice or salary in lieu of notice at the minimum of MOM requirement or the terms of your contract,whichever is larger, you don't need to give any reasons whatsoever for the dismissal. One I've used often in the past is "lack of corporate fit". Pay them their salary in lieu or let 'em work out their notice, depending how badly we want to see the backside of the employee.


SMS is correct. I have known of people who were terminated without cause.They just need to be given notice.


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