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Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby JR8 » Tue, 28 Jul 2015 6:19 pm

midlet2013 wrote:People like OP should not post. But people like you should not reply if you cannot help or make a person feel better.


I disagree with that Midlet. IMO a person should be free to post, but if they haven't done basic research, and later come on as haughty etc then they should expect what's coming their way.

This forum is not a selfless emotionless charity. It's a bunch of people hanging out and hoping they might help some others. 'Making people feel better' doesn't come into it, it isn't a social service, and sometimes being told outright what you don't want to hear is far more valuable than 'stroking' and false promises.
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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby bgd » Tue, 28 Jul 2015 6:25 pm

midlet2013 wrote:

People like OP should not post. But people like you should not reply if you cannot help or make a person feel better.



SE's first post was pretty clear, that's what we try and do here. Making the OP feel better doesn't help him or anyone else following looking for information.

Edit: Snap :)

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby midlet2013 » Wed, 29 Jul 2015 3:36 pm

Do you guys practice this in real life, at work , with family. Be candid and blunt.

I hear that working with people is tough and that Emotional Intelligence ranks above anything else.

Perhaps, most of you are so tired of being Dr Jekyll in real life that you have to play Mr Hyde on anonymous forums.

You can tell the hard truth in a nice manner.

The most likable people are those who can make a person feel good, not those who tell the truth.

What politician, businessman, manager, executive speak the truth.

Even a PR reject or job interview reject letter if full or crap.


JR8 wrote:
midlet2013 wrote:People like OP should not post. But people like you should not reply if you cannot help or make a person feel better.


I disagree with that Midlet. IMO a person should be free to post, but if they haven't done basic research, and later come on as haughty etc then they should expect what's coming their way.

This forum is not a selfless emotionless charity. It's a bunch of people hanging out and hoping they might help some others. 'Making people feel better' doesn't come into it, it isn't a social service, and sometimes being told outright what you don't want to hear is far more valuable than 'stroking' and false promises.

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 29 Jul 2015 3:56 pm

midlet2013 wrote:Do you guys practice this in real life, at work , with family. Be candid and blunt.

My wife, kids and colleagues will say yes I do.

I hear that working with people is tough and that Emotional Intelligence ranks above anything else.

Perhaps, most of you are so tired of being Dr Jekyll in real life that you have to play Mr Hyde on anonymous forums.

I'm Mr. Hyde all the time. Only occasionally will I play the Doc. Being nice doesn't come natural. Being truthful does. As Popeye says, "I yam what I yam!"

You can tell the hard truth in a nice manner.

You mean like "please don't take offense, and I mean it in the best possible way, but frankly you are a jerk?" type of nice manner?

The most likable people are those who can make a person feel good, not those who tell the truth.

I didn't realize we were here to win popularity contests? Or here to molly-coddle adults.

What politician, businessman, manager, executive speak the truth.

Donald Trump? LKY?

Even a PR reject or job interview reject letter if full or crap.

Not sure how to answer that as it doesn't say anything........

JR8 wrote:
midlet2013 wrote:People like OP should not post. But people like you should not reply if you cannot help or make a person feel better.


I disagree with that Midlet. IMO a person should be free to post, but if they haven't done basic research, and later come on as haughty etc then they should expect what's coming their way.

This forum is not a selfless emotionless charity. It's a bunch of people hanging out and hoping they might help some others. 'Making people feel better' doesn't come into it, it isn't a social service, and sometimes being told outright what you don't want to hear is far more valuable than 'stroking' and false promises.


Is it Friday yet?

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby JR8 » Wed, 29 Jul 2015 6:13 pm

Midlet, if you don't help an OP with their question I'm not sure what grounds you have to criticise those who try. I believe the usual pattern is to give your own opinion/experience to an OP, and then develop any other points from others for clarity, or rebuttal etc. In that way an OP might hope to end up with a best and refined as possible answer to their question.

Styles of interaction vary from that one might use at work, to Friday night down the pub with your mates, to having an audience and tea with the Queen. I've always found this forum pretty fact-based and direct. I.e. little time for waffle and 'stroking'; and I really don't think that is what newbies want or expect either. That'd be like opening an encyclopedia and requiring it to only give you a nice/candied version of facts, rather than the actual ones.

Is it beero'clock yet? :)
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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby MikeJones » Wed, 29 Jul 2015 7:23 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:...
You mean like "please don't take offense, and I mean it in the best possible way, but frankly you are a jerk?" type of nice manner?
...


Ahh like the fantastic phrase "with all due respect..." which really means with "no respect whatsoever but you are the customer/boss and therefore I can't call you a tw*t" :)

Mike

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby Strong Eagle » Wed, 29 Jul 2015 9:27 pm

Since I started the brouhaha by my response to the OP, I offer the following. When I posted my original response, I was simply irritated because it was, clearly and once again, a question that has been asked and answered dozens, if not hundreds, of times... and mostly by sub-cons... do I have to follow the rules. That he 'disguised' it as a poll is of no relevance. Maybe he did read all of the other posts, maybe not, but that is of no relevance, either, because he wants to know if he is somehow extra special.

His response to me was textbook, exactly as SMS has previously described such people, including the classic, "so don't post here anymore" routine, along with a condemnation of my "prejudices". I chose to get in his face. You will notice that at least 95 percent of the time, I avoid baiting people, I make neutral responses even when I would like to be sarcastic, cynical, or worse... but this poster crossed the line. When boundaries are violated, I will push back.

And although it may appear to you all that as board moderator, I have god like qualities, I am in fact, mostly human. :)

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 30 Jul 2015 9:33 am

Mike, even if you did call me a twit/twat/twut/twot I just have to consider the source, nothing more. Like water off'n a duck's back, I've been called a lot worse by much better, I assure you. :-)

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby MikeJones » Thu, 30 Jul 2015 9:50 am

SMS just to clarify I was not suggesting you were any of the above :) More agreeing with your point that the sort of false politeness discussed is a waste of time and at the end of the day dishonest. Best customer I ever worked with was a guy in the North East of the UK, we used to have stand up arguments in his office then go for a beer and a curry :)

Mike

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 30 Jul 2015 11:21 am

I'll drink to that, Mike! ;-) My boss and I do that at least once a week (He's the MD and a local but spent 22 years on High St in London in a Japanese FX Bank). The new locals however, tend to duck under their desks as they figure we'd be throwing one or the other through the large window facing the office before it was over. Oh, been there over a decade already. ;-) Works because he uses me as a sounding board (locals tend to say only what they think the boss wants to hear). I tend to say what he NEEDS to hear with no holds barred. I've found it always works best as long as you let 'em know up front in the interview! That way no surprises.

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby MikeJones » Thu, 30 Jul 2015 11:58 am

Yep worked with him for years, I think our best effort was when the guy in the office next door came in to see if we were OK and we both looked at him like he was an idiot and said we were fine and would be heading to the pub in a few minutes if he wanted to join us :D

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby martincymru » Thu, 30 Jul 2015 1:59 pm

I take a different slant.
I wish all posters on this Forum, if they are making a statement purporting to be fact, then they quote the source.
If it's an opinion then say so.

Often, which I like in fact, I observe a mixture of fact mixed in with opinion derived from some form of research and/or analysis. For me, that's great, since in Sg we have very little "facts" so many of us rely on anecdotal evidence which is usually wrong. Oh how I wish the govt. here would be brave enough to open that door just a little bit more.

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby Barnsley » Thu, 30 Jul 2015 2:06 pm

martincymru wrote: Oh how I wish the govt. here would be brave enough to open that door just a little bit more.


Good luck with that.....

Didnt they say "its not good for the citizens to know how many PR's there actually are" or something like that.

I will look for the quote and add :D
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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby ecureilx » Thu, 30 Jul 2015 2:33 pm

Barnsley wrote:
martincymru wrote: Oh how I wish the govt. here would be brave enough to open that door just a little bit more.


Good luck with that.....

Didnt they say "its not good for the citizens to know how many PR's there actually are" or something like that.

I will look for the quote and add :D


Heck, Citizens don't even know how much exactly is in SG Inc's reserves, just a number saying 260 billion ++ (apparently in the interest of the nation in case foreign powers can bring down SG Inc .. ), .....

What gives they will let martincymru have information he seeks ?? :P
Last edited by ecureilx on Thu, 30 Jul 2015 3:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Thumb Rule to wait for PR application

Postby the lynx » Thu, 30 Jul 2015 3:23 pm

Let me be the doormat and help OP:

They asked for 3 years of tax assessments but you only have 7 months. Your chance is very slim, especially when it is a common notion that Indian applicants may not stand good chance at this sociopolitical climate. It wouldn't be your fault from not knowing this or not picking this up from your research - after all you're only here for 7 months.

I'd say save your effort, think plan B (also known as plan singapore-may-not-be-your-destiny) and don't bother applying or harbouring false hope but if you really want, you owe it to no one not to try.

Different people had different outcome and that itself is very subjective because each application will be judged by its own merit. Some had it because they were here during the PR-floodgate 2009. Some had it because they are the favourite flavour (think Chinese ethnicity or ex-US billionaire).

I still agree to what others have already said here.


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