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Considering the jump....

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby thismyvoice » Sat, 25 Jul 2015 9:10 am

JR8 wrote:
ts77fox wrote:Went with a few colleagues to KL. We were all in a relatively modest Camry. As they are all locals, we stopped along the way at their familiar eateries. Quite an enjoyable trip, minus the heat. Somewhat wondering whether it is generally safe for foreigners to be driving in Malaysia?



The N/S highway is reputed for truck and bus drivers who are doing loooong shifts and hence tired. Also, SGn hot-rodding kids giving their cars the work-out they'd never get at home. Plus local traffic cops who [apparently] might pull you over for an alleged infraction, and give you the choice of settling it there for RM500 cash, or going down to the police station to file a formal report which might take hours.

I've seen the hot-rodding kids and that is pretty frightening, IMHO. I've also known hot-rodding SGns who'd leave SG late after work on Friday and go flat out (averaging 100+mph on the highway) to get the earliest ferries out of Mersing the next morning. The rest is general hearsay...
Either way, the N/S highways are not routes I'd choose for anything like an pleasurable road-trip.


RM500 is only for ang mo. Market rate is RM50.

Travelling 100+mph on highway. This will get you a higher fine, if caught. Make sure to keep to the limit when near Malacca. Fridays are good because there are less traffic police.

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby bgd » Mon, 27 Jul 2015 4:01 pm

I ride that road relatively frequently and find it fine but boring. The local drivers seem more competent than their Sg cousins. If you see a car off the road, which is pretty common, it will usually have Sg plates.

Never had any trouble with the traffic police, been through a few checkpoints but never pulled over.

And CNY is a time to avoid. Tried it once, 4 lanes of stationary traffic. There are only 3 lanes, even the hard shoulder was blocked. Cleared after Malacca.

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby Benji1975 » Sun, 25 Oct 2015 5:29 pm

After what feels like an eternity of negotiation, it's official...we're definitely off to SG! Flights are booked for 9th Dec and we have a really nice 3 bed apartment lined up via AirBnB until end of Jan which then gives me time to get to know the areas and find out long term landed house.
I suppose the delays has given us plenty of time to keep on researching so I think we are getting up to speed on most things. Going to be quite daunting giving up work but I might do some more studying, maybe a photography course, cooking...who knows.
One car has already been sold, my beloved Porsche 911 is up for sale and we have the mother of all excel spreadsheets which is basically being used to 'project manage' our move.
Just need that haze to disapear and I'll be looking forward to Christmas lunch at the Ritz Carlton followed by a BBQ round friends house.

regards
Ben

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby JR8 » Mon, 26 Oct 2015 2:44 am

Congrats Benji :)
7 weeks in temp housing will give you *plenty* of time to find a new home. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if you'll be itching to move after say 4 weeks. You're doing your advance research here which helps, once you find 'the place' you just want to move in and get your freight in there. [Check you can terminate that AirBnB place prior to 7 weeks if needs be, just in case].

You're facing an equivalent of early retirement. I've touched on this before. Your pride, ego, sanity, needs a proxy reason to get up each morning, some form of 'externally imposed timetable'. Something that's also a worthwhile reply to a strangers 1.01 seeking-to-bond question: 'So what do you do?'. If there is no proxy mandated time-table of some kind it really messes with your well-being.
Studying is one useful channel, as it gives you purpose, and hopefully equips with you useful skills. Attending cooking school is another I did (a good school is great, hard to find in SG though), another avenue was consciously pursuing an aim of understanding something then completely ridiculous/illogical to me, modern art [yes, I DO get it now, what an epiphany :)]. A third was learning SCUBA diving. Each of the three is almost open ended, I'll never reach the end point, and men (IMHO :)) need challenges like this, a reason to get up, a challenge come every tomorrow.

Xmas at the R-C sounds great; I take it you've booked.
p.s. Big change for you, country, culture, purpose in life. It helps knowing inside in advance when one aspect is lacking and so having 2ndary impacts on you, and you have to actively work to back-fill it to return to an even keel.

- Apols if this is superficially 'too deep' to some readers. Early retirement (or it's equivalent) can be much harder than imagined... more so if it is externally enforced and you haven't had years to adapt for it.
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby Primrose Hill » Mon, 26 Oct 2015 3:55 pm

JR8, how do you do early retirement? a bunch of us were discussing precisely this issue in London last week, there were 5 couples to dinner, all of whom are older than us, but quite the captains of his/her industry. And although they are older, they are all rather active, run 10km twice a week type of folks.

We were all discussing where it is that we want to live, some of us want to spend winter in Cape Town/ Buenos Aeres and the rest of the time in London and these folks live in London, Zone 2 type of folks. What about the rest of the time, what do you do to occupy your time? Some talked about renting an office space to ease into the transition of retirement. It certainly is giving me plenty of food for thought.

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby JR8 » Mon, 26 Oct 2015 6:30 pm

Ramble-Alert: To other than PH, this is rambling and looooong, and ... well, odds-on not of interest to you. Only risk wasting time reading it if you are considering lifestyle and issues that come with planning retirement :)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The 'snowbird' lifestyle is something I first came across in the US, migrating south for the winter. I can certainly see it's appeal, and if you can afford it why not? I have considered it as a possibility, but for the time being consider that it requires owning two homes. The running costs of which would be pretty horrific. Not only obvious stuff, like maintaining bill payments while away (utils etc), but would your household insurance still be valid if you're away 3-4 months? Would you need post forwarding? Language barriers... and so on? Also would you have two sets of possessions, one at each location? All in all I'm not sure how relaxing such a burden might be. An alternative might be renting for a winter at a location. But that comes with it's own challenges, high costs and potential tenancy issues and so on. Right now I'm thinking more of having one home and hopefully being at liberty to travel within reason/budget 'as and when' but either to hotels or short-term rentals.

What I do to occupy my time? When I was employed (banking) I reached a point I realised two things:
- I had a good job, but the hours required meant any life outside of work was very limited. That was when I decided that a challenge and goal of seeking to understand contemporary art would be a good way to spend some time. I genuinely didn't expect to, so at the start it was something of an unachievable challenge, which perhaps held my curiosity. Like music it is also open ended, there are always new genres and style to experience and consider. It's permanently open-ended, same as cooking, same as pursuing an interest all the way up to a professional level, hence why I started diving.
- But I also accepted that for people in my career it's usually quite a brief one. Banking is a 'young persons game', not least due to the hours it requires of you. If you're still there at 50 you are going to have to be senior, i.e. most of your former peers have fallen by the wayside and been made redundant. They often can never get back in, and that can really break people. Especially when you are living and spending at a level that depends on you maintaining your career. I've seen colleagues lose their job, and then that has sparked them losing their spouse, home and children. A couple have started out coming from nothing, and after decades of toil and huge success ended up right back there. Absolutely terrible.... just thinking of their journeys makes me physically cringe.

Hence you need to start early providing for the future. Two attempts at investing in stocks and watching them go up in flames taught me a lot :) The first time due to naively investing in high-risk things like equity warrants (incl. later doomed Japanese ones). Hence realising you can't just blindly follow investment fads and fashions, the tortoise beats the hare, but you need a strategy. That's why I bought my first B2Ls (rentals), a niche thing back then, but the numbers stacked up and it appeared a low and manageable risk. So that was going on in the background. I briefly made a smaller foray back into slightly faddish stocks in the late 90s, thought I had a strategy and was being conservative, then the '99/+ crash happened and it brought down everything. That put me off stocks altogether for 10+ years :)
Well you know what's happened to London property over the last 20 years... A few years ago signs started emerging that the govt were going to start broadening the capital gains tax net to non-residents/foreigners. New policy avenues like that often start in a small way, and year by year progressively get worse. Worth heeding what might be a warning-call?

Anyway, apols if I'm rambling on down a blind avenue here. Please re-focus me if needs be :)
In brief, I now only have my long-time home in London, and that is currently rented out. I'm still expated as a dependent, and any future partial CGT liability remains unclear... it's a very opaque area to me.

I'm back in stocks again [shaking my head, but this time much lower risk, and I've a 2-year timeline/plan to further de-risk it]. Over the past 5/6/7 years it's done well. I am following a conservative and clear strategy (per my previous mention of Motley Fool/LTBH portfolio). So, then as a baseline in a couple of years [touch wood!] I'll have my London home plus stocks providing the regular income stream I need for a 'decent retirement'. (I have tried to calculate the budget for the latter using a household budgeting spreadsheet I've mentioned/linked here before, so I'm pretty clear on what we need). The capital value of the stocks is secondary, maintaining the dividend stream is what matters. But that is what good long-term 'LTBH' stocks bend over backwards to do anyway. I enjoy observing the markets day to day (an interest that is also open-ended). I can engage in it as much or little as I want and apart from the planned de-risking I'm a passive investor.
A couple more years here (3rd country) and I'd hope to return to London for a while. Get my head around/optimise my CGT position on my home there, and then ultimately sell it and buy a place in calmer location (a regional city). That would release the difference between the higher value home, vs a less expensive new place and be the final piece of equity to generate income from ... maybe stocks, not sure yet.

That would be the current end-goal. Retired but with active interests that keep me fully engaged, and a secured income stream. I'll probably also seek to diversify out of stocks somewhat, to partially hedge the risk. Not sure how yet, bonds/trusts/funds etc all seem to come with downsides, bonds - how to access at a retail level, and the latter two the charges that often come with them. ... we'll see!

Renting office space? I can see why some people do this. It maintains a sense of routine, social interaction outside the home, 'having to go to work'. But such rental is expensive so it has to add net value. I have a home-office. The plus is there is no incremental rent, a minus if no one wants to sit at home all day. What with IT/comms these days you can use it to provide some level of daily social interaction. The face-to-face still lacks, so you work to fill that gap as well...

--- I can't help smile at the stereotype portrayal of the care-free and contented retiree reclining in his garden chair day after day. IME it's simply not like that; and I don't know a single retiree who could do such lazing all day long who chooses to.
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby Benji1975 » Mon, 26 Oct 2015 9:34 pm

JR8, I read your reply after an afternoon in the pub and then vino watching the GP....it was far too deep for slightly sloshed brain!
Interesting thoughts and well captured from your perspective so thanks for your insight. I am being a bit tongue in cheek if I say I am retiring. I am giving up my current job and we've done our assumptions on me not working as we didn't want to be in a situation where we ended up struggling or stressing if I didn't find a job.
After nearly 2 decades in an 'office' role and hitting the big 40 I actually fancy a change so this is pretty much the perfect opportunity to kick myself up the butt and venture outside of my comfort zone.
I'm not discounting going back into engineering or project management but I suspect it would be a bit of a culture shock as the set up I have at the moment is pretty cushty.
I'm more thinking that I will go into business with someone or set something up. I have a few ideas and the luxury of time to explore them. For other ideas, I am going to just observe life in SG and note what I find lacking compared to UK/Europe. I'll then see if there if there is an opportunity to turn that into something.
Or, I could buy a PS4 and play video games a lot...

Interesting you mention your banking history. I had the opportunity at 25 to go into the city and mulled it over as engineering graduates with a bit of experience appear to be reasonably valued. The commute and whole lifestyle put me off a bit so I'm glad I stuck with engineering to be honest. And, actually, after spending an evening in a city bar full of young city types....I would hate myself if I was part of that set. Obnoxious doesn't even begin to cover it. Of course, I'm sure they aren't all like that at that age but when some random stranger comes up to you, starts banging on about your watch and how he's going to buy one like that with his next bonus you do wonder...

Anyway, I've always fancied a dabble in the markets but I'm acutely aware that if people with plenty of experience (such as yourself) can get horribly burned, then it's not a game. I have some colleagues here who day trade on the side and are pretty successful. I just haven't had the time to devote to studying the markets. I'd like to think I would use my data analysis skills and completely rational and non-emotional decision making abilities to good use. We shall see though, I intend to use a bit of spare cash (that can afford to be lost) to invest and see what comes of it.

Or I could stick to the PS4...

regards
Ben

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby JR8 » Tue, 27 Oct 2015 5:47 am

Ben: JR8, I read your reply after an afternoon in the pub and then vino watching the GP....it was far too deep for slightly sloshed brain!

-- Nah, I think that’s probably the best way to read my posts :wink:



B: Interesting thoughts and well captured from your perspective so thanks for your insight. I am being a bit tongue in cheek if I say I am retiring. I am giving up my current job and we've done our assumptions on me not working as we didn't want to be in a situation where we ended up struggling or stressing if I didn't find a job.

-- It can be a good way to approach it, as you start with solid in-built contingency, nothing reliant or premised upon what you *might* or might not manage to achieve within an the added burden/challenge of an alien country, where you’re not leading the family off to as the bread-winner. Your household stands on her primary income, then, if you later add to it then all the more rewarding.

After nearly 2 decades in an 'office' role and hitting the big 40 I actually fancy a change so this is pretty much the perfect opportunity to kick myself up the butt and venture outside of my comfort zone.

-- Yep understand, it’s not a gear-change we get coached for. And it often seems to be only when obliged to crystallise such longer term thoughts, that it’s only then they come together. Quite understand (remaining in the comfort zone is invariably easier – tis human nature).

I'm not discounting going back into engineering or project management but I suspect it would be a bit of a culture shock as the set up I have at the moment is pretty cushty.
I'm more thinking that I will go into business with someone or set something up. I have a few ideas and the luxury of time to explore them. For other ideas, I am going to just observe life in SG and note what I find lacking compared to UK/Europe. I'll then see if there if there is an opportunity to turn that into something.
Or, I could buy a PS4 and play video games a lot...

-- Nice :) / :wink:. And as hard as you perceive the shift in status to put you under some kind of societal duress, I’d encourage you to enjoy the transitory ‘let-off’. At least until you have had time to give it a trial period and find it’s (likely?) perhaps not wholly fulfilling. But even then it wouldn’t be a case of being under duress to $contribute, more finding how to thrive in that position.


Interesting you mention your banking history. I had the opportunity at 25 to go into the city and mulled it over as engineering graduates with a bit of experience appear to be reasonably valued. The commute and whole lifestyle put me off a bit so I'm glad I stuck with engineering to be honest. And, actually, after spending an evening in a city bar full of young city types....I would hate myself if I was part of that set. Obnoxious doesn't even begin to cover it. Of course, I'm sure they aren't all like that at that age but when some random stranger comes up to you, starts banging on about your watch and how he's going to buy one like that with his next bonus you do wonder...

-- Yeah, that’s around when I started +/- a few years, c86.
Coincidentally a couple of the most ‘decent’ traders I worked with were a ‘mech-eng’ who’d started off as a graduate trainee in Ford Europe, and an Oxbridge PhD 2nd career (late 20s) PhD in Astro.... er, not astrology Smile.... building satellites or something. I think what we all shared was abandoning an externally assumed/imposed career (‘mothers expectations’), throwing it away and going for an unstable unknown.
Those engineer guys were the easiest going, but yet usually the most day in/day out successful. There was varying and apparently no limit to the drama and histrionics from the wildly cyclical 20+ other egos I dealt with each morning on the floor. I don’t know, maybe the discipline that draws one to engineering is closer to trading than might meet the eye? The logical thought-out pragmatic approach is perhaps common...

Yes the commute to the City is usually a bummer. Esp if you’re older and need more space hence out of town. The hours are brutal (and you have to compete, or face getting spat out). So in some respects you need to really feel either a calling to it, or, be fool enough to consider it easy money. I’m not sure why else you’d wager upon such a risky gamble.
I don’t agree with the ‘snobby city types clique’ stereotype; no more than birds of a feather tend to flock together. Friday night after work is almost a ritualistic off-gassing after work, and tribal. Same same as after work down at Boat Quay after work on a Friday. Either way early/mid careerists are inherently competitive. Lawyers as a clique are completely insufferable IME (even to a ‘’’banker’’’ :wink:). So are many other professions. I think ‘the banker thing’ in the UK it crystallises around many things, envy, no one knows what they do for it, assuming it’s easy money from which they’re denied, etc., assuming *all* bankers earns shedloads, don’t deserve it, and are all arrogant tw*ts.... none of which are even alone true IME. The trader I mentioned above, [‘Rich’] who’d interned at Ford Europe, he was mid-20’s, working class, earned $2mm/pa (that’s 20 years ago!) and then still drove a 10 year old Ford Escort/XR3. One of the most level-headed colleagues I’ve known.
The other really grounded easy to deal with other ones, example: Andy, (really lovely bloke and super successful) started out as a valet parker at the Dorchester Hotel (so, as it was, figured out how he one day he too might own a Ferrari, and he did, and then later, late 20s, about 6-8 IIRC. He came from being a virtual '''shoe-shine boy''' - and he would be the first to remind you of that).

Some do that and bank it, some go nuts spend it and end up losing it all. For Rich and Andy, there were 3200 others earning less (ie. everyone else). Take out 10 top traders, board level, and I doubt the average salary was above £30-50k/pa. But the ‘’’articles in the Daily Mail’’’ never mention the 90% majority do they... [so the conveniently angry myth continues?]. Meanwhile we the 90% strived to get on within the meritocracy.

Anyway, I've always fancied a dabble in the markets but I'm acutely aware that if people with plenty of experience (such as yourself) can get horribly burned, then it's not a game. I have some colleagues here who day trade on the side and are pretty successful. I just haven't had the time to devote to studying the markets. I'd like to think I would use my data analysis skills and completely rational and non-emotional decision making abilities to good use. We shall see though, I intend to use a bit of spare cash (that can afford to be lost) to invest and see what comes of it.
Or I could stick to the PS4...

I’m glad you’re thinking that way. Not because I wish to put you off or ‘scare you’. But I think these days there are several channels promoting how easy it is; and it’s not. If I can encourage proceeding with thought, research etc then great.
I wouldn’t advocate day trading. The shorter term the horizons the closer you have to be to the market to hope to beat it. Most don’t, most won’t admit they had no hope of doing so, and didn’t. Perhaps most don’t even know that themselves or accept it.
Study the markets. As you would now, more than you will have to in future if seeking a living from it. Keep your powder dry until then :wink: Taking 6-12 months standing back observing and learning might be time well spent...
I suspect with your ‘Eng’ rigour, + a logical approach you will click. Consider it, test it for a while on paper. As an engineer you’ll stress-test it too (good!).... then when happy and ready, set sail :)
Last edited by JR8 on Tue, 27 Oct 2015 5:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby Benji1975 » Thu, 29 Oct 2015 5:37 pm

Good advice there, appreciated!

Hmm, mech-eng working with Ford Europe. Yup, that’s me! All my contracts have been with FMC over the years….

Exactly, I don’t want to have to find work because we need the money. I have this excellent opportunity to go and do what I want safe in knowledge we are ok financially so you can’t really ask for more than that. Of course, I intend to enjoy at least a few months of that weird state where I don’t actually have a function in life (bar raising my children)

Yeah, I know there is a huge pool of banking that earn a perfectly ‘normal’ salary but the papers like to pick up on the few that get the huge bonus’s. I have a couple of friends at Deutsch Bank and he earns good money but doesn’t get huge bonus’s as the department he works in doesn’t operate such schemes. Compared to most industries though, the opportunities to make serious money are more available in banking I would suspect. That’s principally because you are involved with money! To make mega bucks in engineering you either have to set up your own business i.e be a good entrepreneur or you need to be at the very top of the profession, and there aren’t that many people with that finely honed but broad skill set.

Any plan or approach would definitely be ‘stress tested’ first. There are enough programs allowing virtual dabbling and then, of course, you can just do your own spreadsheet, invest imaginary amounts and then track it over a period of time to see if the plan works. Of course, all of this goes out of the window in the event of a sudden downturn etc…that’s just one of the risks obviously.

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby JR8 » Thu, 29 Oct 2015 7:44 pm

Wow! - what a coincidence :-O
I'll be interested to see how you find your 'period of inactivity', expectations v outcome.
re: yr final para. Yep that was what I meant re: 'paper trading'. Set yourself an investment budget, and then 'virtually' invest it.

You can set up such a thing via sites such as http://www.digitallook.com/ it's parent company is Spanish but the site is 100% English language and it covers effectively all the global stock-markets. Then you can monitor the markets, and your portfolio, in just about real-time (20 minute delay on the price feed). The amount of info on there is vast, way beyond just rolling news and prices.

For 'Technical Analysis' [TA] I go to -> http://www.ig.com/uk/indices-news , the rest of the site is loaded with info too and quite a lot of news there takes a more 'macro' view. If you're not familiar with TA I suspect the engineer in you will find it quite a fascinating subject to ponder and learn about :)

For more TA I also drop by http://www.fxempire.com/technical/techn ... is-reports Again it's global, and you can watch the daily vids which are narrated in American ball-chewing 'New York minute' style :)

Another I use for macro market analyses is http://www.morningstar.co.uk They have a blend of a highly respected professional offering and also resources and analyses pitched at DIYers (you and me :)). So I can go there and watch daily vids of bank economists (etc) being interviewed re: what happening in the markets, and then also read columns from the likes of Rodney Hobson who is a self-investing retiree. http://www.morningstar.co.uk/uk/author/ ... obson.aspx He's interesting because he reveals elements of investing life that other writers tend to avoid. Admitting to losses, describing how his emotions shift with the markets, sometimes describing his occasional 'I give up!' moments ...lol. The latter actually is a recognised mental state and boundary re: trading aka capitulation, it happens to all of us at times, veeery few write about it, and he is eye-wateringly candid :-D

I also follow The Motley Fool (fool.co.uk). They were a unique resource back in the early/mid 90s, but now their offering is replicated by some others. They have other versions in the US, Aus and others incl a newish and veery light SGn offering that comes without forums. What they do have [US/UK] that's worthwhile and pretty rare is moderated discussion forums of a generally very good quality, mostly financial, but many recreational ones too. That is also where my baseline investing strategy derived c15-20 years ago. So I follow about a dozen of the sub-forums there. Many 'Fools' have been around years, and each board tends to have the whole spectrum, say the 'Legal Issues' forum will include a couple of professional solicitors who are like any other members just there, unpaid, hanging out... plus a rump of well informed amateurs, and the rest people dropping by seeking advice...
Here is a link to the sub-group of boards re: self-investing http://boards.fool.co.uk/investors-roun ... ?bid=51676
The FAQ/strategy is outlined here -> http://boards.fool.co.uk/faqs-10554265.aspx
The discussion regarding the strategy is on a near-neighbour sub-forum here -> http://boards.fool.co.uk/high-yield-hyp ... d=13286455

[Note: I don't pay to use any of the above at the depths that I have described. Similarly neither do I gain any benefit from suggesting them to others - just to be aaabsolutely clear :)]

Edit/ps.
Make sure that before you leave the UK you have any/all financial accounts that you need opened and tested. Reason being that it is a *severe PITA* opening them from abroad these days, quite often literally impossible. However on the flip-side, many financial service providers will tolerate you being absent from the UK for a temporary period/posting. Oh, and I use Interactive Brokers for trading, have for c5-6 years now, and still very happy with them...
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby Benji1975 » Sat, 31 Oct 2015 1:49 am

Thanks JR8, that's some quality advice there. I am aware of some of those links and have started to read up before of the tech analysis of trends i.e bollinger bands and all that good fun. Statistics wasn't my finest part of the A-Level maths i did...I tended towards pure maths but still managed an A and aced every maths part of my mech eng degree so, whilst a bit rusty, I'm reasonably placed to try and grasp it. Obviously, there is way more it than this and the ability to spot trends and use accumulated knowledge to make an informed decision is part of a complete package that you ultimately need to make more of a return (loss) than just chucking virtual darts at the pages of the virtual FTSE 100 etc. I might be completely rubbish long term and just hand it over to hargreaves and lansdown (for example) who have done very well for my FIL who invested over 30 years with them and spread risks and turned moderate investment into a good retirement pot and enough to buy houses etc.

Good point about UK accounts...haven't thought that through yet. Without asking you to sort it out....wouldn't i wish to do any trading from a SG account to lower tax liability?

I have my UK personal account and then my UK business account which will still be active as i have yet to file 2014/2015 accounts. I will then need to file 2015-2016 accounts so my business account will be active with funds but no income for the foreseeable after dec 2015. I could use this for any trading (should i wish to) but surely easier just to open a SG account? We have a contact out there anyway who is going to advise as we want to know the most efficient way of sending money back to cover ongoing costs associated with our UK property that we're keeping

regards
Ben




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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby JR8 » Sat, 31 Oct 2015 2:57 am

Lol re: para 1. Yes, my parents used HL too. A good reputation I believe. Not sure what their charges are etc. More Lol re: Bollinger Bands though :) I watch RSIs and stochastics a bit more closely than BB's, but Bollinger is my veeery occasional fav champagne... RSIs/'Stochs' it's (arguably) more about depth of sentiment/conviction and it's how that changes - depth of conviction + it's ebbs/flows.

Quite, it's more than 'spotting trends', after all what equips us small retail investors more so than the big-fish in order to spot and ride trends ahead of them? No I don't think so. Recognise weaknesses, and play to strengths. It's about simply learning how to sift the wheat from the chaff in the first place and then being very patient (this is 'the philosophy of a Fool (and NOT fool')).

You'd have a job opening a SGn account to trade UK shares IME. Any such would be pitched towards higher end private clients, as in, perhaps min. bal 1/4mm, or maybe 1/2mm/+, with fees to go with it. Anything less and the fees alone might rape your returns. To the long-term investor with time to research, fees are the first avoidable poison vs returns, whether that be account fees, high trade fees, or managed product (funds/trusts etc) commissions.
So note.... if you do it through a UK a/c, open it in the UK, move, tell them you're offshore for a year or maybe two, they won't charge withholding tax off your divi income since you're non-resident. Then, live in a place like SG which doesn't levy tax on foreign earned income earned and banked abroad (at least of this nature) ... and there you go, that's a major leg-up that will compound year on year. /// So really there would be no relative virtue in a SGn account, in fact your UK stocks income earned via a SG account might be liable to local SGn taxes... [?]

It's a real pain re: keeping home based and local SGn accounts, and channelling funds between them as needs be, esp these days. [ref also: previous chats here re: changing money in SG and taking it home in cash].
If you have a home (owned) in the UK and intend to rent it out, then that side might/should hopefully be self-sustaining. That alone is useful for when you simply need to 'BACS' your parents £20 or what ever, or maintain UK direct debits/subscriptions etc... could you do BACS>UK from a SGn account, even via a British bank branch there? IME/short-answer, no!


For UK tax returns, for anything above the plainest of plainest vanilla ... well, I use TaxCalc. Wizard front-end (literally hehe). Hooks up and files directly into the IR. Offers simplified/human-level input and transliterates it into the Bongoland IR tax form returns. I pay about gbp25/pa for the core plus some supplementary sections - a bargain given how much it simplifies my filing. Used for about 5 years/filings now, a bit of a 'must have/rave' product for me...
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby Benji1975 » Sun, 01 Nov 2015 11:45 pm

Again, great advise there....appreciated. That little lot will keep me busy when I get there!

I've got some more questions I'm sure when I digest that last post fully (currently multitasking my two 3 year old twins...)

One thing thiough...you said about the pain of transferring money between accounts? We're opening a HSBC account out there and I've been assured by both the international moving team here and the customer service I spoke to out there that I can just transfer money between my two accounts with no issue? Once I've set it up once, apparently, the other account will just show up as a payee. It takes a couple of days but it's free if done online.
There is a method for instant transfer and the ability to see all your accounts on one log in (their premiere service) but you have to lodge something crazy like $250,000 with them or have a big mortgage to get this facility.
We're not renting our place here as we bought it with our inlaws 5 years ago....because at the time we were thinking of relocating and splitting the costs of a house meant they got something bigger and with nice garden and we 1/2'd our liability which meant we could move abroad and still have a property asset in UK (she's an only child so no issue with inheritance). Seems odd that 5 years later after getting settled and having kids, we're now taking the plunge!
Whereabouts are you based by the way? We're starting off with a place secured in Somerset and then we'll be looking for something around faber/holland as she'll be based in fusionopolous which is by one-north MRT.
P.S am reading lots of positive reports about blue skys over SG again!

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby JR8 » Mon, 02 Nov 2015 2:59 am

Benji1975 wrote:One thing though...you said about the pain of transferring money between accounts? We're opening a HSBC account out there and I've been assured by both the international moving team here and the customer service I spoke to out there that I can just transfer money between my two accounts with no issue? Once I've set it up once, apparently, the other account will just show up as a payee. It takes a couple of days but it's free if done online.
There is a method for instant transfer and the ability to see all your accounts on one log in (their premiere service) but you have to lodge something crazy like $250,000 with them or have a big mortgage to get this facility.


Oh, I meant between say a local UK bank, and a local SGn one (for me Barclays UK > StanChart SG). Wiring funds x-banks costs about £30 these days, it adds up. Hopefully it’ll be easier with the same bank at each end. Just watch the fees (esp ‘hidden’ FX-spreads, vs what you can get for cash down at Change Alley or Mustaffa in SG). I looked at that HSBC account just recently, but they require min £60k of depos/investments which suspecting it’s going to be in some dog of a product is really just a proxy for minimum account fees, whilst they likely can suggest it’s a low-fee account.
(I’d expect a net return, dividend only, ignoring ‘the capital opportunity’ of say 5%/+ from UK stocks, so £60k@5% = a baseline monthly account charge of £250/mo, assuming zero int on that min bal. Add the Opportunity Cost (re: capital value) and it's more.



Benji1975 wrote: We're not renting our place here as we bought it with our inlaws 5 years ago....because at the time we were thinking of relocating and splitting the costs of a house meant they got something bigger and with nice garden and we 1/2'd our liability which meant we could move abroad and still have a property asset in UK (she's an only child so no issue with inheritance). Seems odd that 5 years later after getting settled and having kids, we're now taking the plunge!
Whereabouts are you based by the way? We're starting off with a place secured in Somerset and then we'll be looking for something around faber/holland as she'll be based in fusionopolous which is by one-north MRT.
P.S am reading lots of positive reports about blue skys over SG again!


Ah yes I see :) Sharing with your in-laws, wow that’s brave of you :) Smile
Oh we’ve x-posted out of SG right now, Middle East. Not sure if we’ll go back to SG, I’m pretty done with it in some ways but ‘never say never’ as I learned after unexpectedly/not through choice going back years later after the first time to SG for a 2nd time, and then the same for a 3rd... who knows eh.... hehehe...
Right now the juxtaposition of SG vs our new city is quite striking. Example: We deemed this w/e too dangerous to go out, for various reasons. I winged it this pm up to shop 400m away to get a loaf of bread – phew. Times like this you can’t fail to see how valuable basic stability and security is. // Plus of course SG is an incredible base from which to go and explore the ‘ends of the world’ from... Borneo, Indochina, and points in between... for me that was one of SGs biggest pluses, we got to go places we’d never have got to from Europe. Your mates go for a weekend in Munich, but you can do that later when you’re an OAP it won’t have changed much. Meanwhile you pay/travel the same and go to Saigon, or off to the real wilds etc etc etc....
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: Considering the jump....

Postby JR8 » Fri, 06 Nov 2015 3:19 pm

I mentioned earlier 'paper-trading' as a way to test and practise an investment strategy you are considering moving in to. I mentioned one venue www.digitallook.com

I just came upon another today, it's the dummy/test facility of a top-rated online broker. So you get access to all their trading tools and analytics.

Scroll down to 'Individual accounts/Try out platform' here - https://www.interactivebrokers.com.hk/i ... en-account

This Q has been asked before, and it is asked again in the future this above link might be considered IMO perhaps the best possible 'paper-trading' facility that's out there.
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard


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