Who knows. I would not be that surprised.martincymru wrote:It's all about energy. Minimise input to maximise output = good value.
JR8 wrote: Only one walked square-on right into me... and promptly became hysterical with rage!?
Welcome to Singapore, a place where drivers always appear to be in a rush and not give way to cyclist. On the other hand, you also have many cyclist making it a habit to ignore traffic rules to ride against traffic direction, ride 2 to 3 abreast, oblivious to the color of traffic lights. Due to lack of proper policing, both parties are not brought to task unless something serious happen. Why bother to fine the cyclist a miserable $20, and go through all the paperworks?x9200 wrote:I don't think it is about being welcomed or not. You are smaller with limited ability to make your points so you tend to be ignored.
Also, you may feel unsafe because you expect the drivers to follow traffic regulations what is obviously not the case. But even if they do not follow the rules they still follow some patterns and after a while it becomes pretty obvious you should not trust the local drivers in many situations in other countries you would tend to trust. If you adjust your expectations and learn these patterns it can still be (I believe) a pleasurable experience.
I knew people who commuted to work by a bike, excess of 10km one way, every day and funny enough they claimed it was actually safer in Singapore than in many Western countries.
I think the key to surviving on the roads here, in a bike or car, is to always drive or ride under the assumption that somebody is going to do something stupid at any moment. Defensive driving doesn't really seem to be a skill set so you need to assume the other guy will hit you, cut you off, etc., and not feel any need to take personal responsibility for their lack of driving skill.x9200 wrote:Hard to say. I used to think they were oblivious. Some surely are, but for the majority it is IMHO a mixture of fixed expectations and opportunistic behaviour.nakatago wrote:In Singapore, drivers are just oblivious, have poor spatial awareness and would eventually run over people. In other countries, they aim for you.x9200 wrote:I knew people who commuted to work by a bike, excess of 10km one way, every day and funny enough they claimed it was actually safer in Singapore than in many Western countries.
For example, they will never change the lane just parallel to the car occupying that lane. They will always go in front of that car and try to squeeze in. The other driver is expected to slow down and let them in (without showing any disapproval) and this is what happens in like 95% of the cases. It's one of those patterns.
movingtospore wrote:
I think the key to surviving on the roads here, in a bike or car, is to always drive or ride under the assumption that somebody is going to do something stupid at any moment. Defensive driving doesn't really seem to be a skill set so you need to assume the other guy will hit you, cut you off, etc., and not feel any need to take personal responsibility for their lack of driving skill.
I don't think the driving is particularly aggressive here, it's just clueless. Between that and the constantly blocked lanes, chaos often ensues. It's the really stupid moves that drive me round the bend, particularly the refusing to let people merge. It causes a lot of accidents and problems on the road.
There's plenty worse around the region I suppose. Though I found it easier to drive in Bangkok, to my surprise. They were more aggressive but seemed more sensible and predictable.
I think that sums things up pretty well. I find I'm pretty good at predicting that "clueless" behaviour. That said, I wear a camera when I ride. If something does happen I want the evidence on my side.movingtospore wrote:
I don't think the driving is particularly aggressive here, it's just clueless.
Yes, exactly like this. Unfortunately there will be still things not possible to control or even monitor sufficiently, e.g. the traffic coming from behind.movingtospore wrote:I think the key to surviving on the roads here, in a bike or car, is to always drive or ride under the assumption that somebody is going to do something stupid at any moment.
I rode motorcycle for 8 years in Singapore... it is possible to control and monitor sufficiently... you just need to be a proficient motorcycle rider... to identify dangers that most people never even think about.x9200 wrote:Yes, exactly like this. Unfortunately there will be still things not possible to control or even monitor sufficiently, e.g. the traffic coming from behind.movingtospore wrote:I think the key to surviving on the roads here, in a bike or car, is to always drive or ride under the assumption that somebody is going to do something stupid at any moment.
SE, we had this discussion before. I gave you some very specific examples of the situations where it was just beyond the control (assuming making riding practical). You have never responded to these examples. And if this matters I am riding in SG for 11y with similar mileage plus much much more driving cars in a number of countries. Single accident only in my whole life. In Singapore.Strong Eagle wrote:I rode motorcycle for 8 years in Singapore... it is possible to control and monitor sufficiently... you just need to be a proficient motorcycle rider... to identify dangers that most people never even think about.x9200 wrote:Yes, exactly like this. Unfortunately there will be still things not possible to control or even monitor sufficiently, e.g. the traffic coming from behind.movingtospore wrote:I think the key to surviving on the roads here, in a bike or car, is to always drive or ride under the assumption that somebody is going to do something stupid at any moment.
I've put well over 100,000 miles on motorcycles in many countries in the world... my only injury was in an extremely difficult section of an off road adventure. At 17, and a brand new biking dumbass, I tore all the skin off my right shoulder for not paying attention to mud in the street. Since then I've never put a bike down in street riding, nor had an accident. It can be done.
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