"Cleaned" City

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earthfriendly
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"Cleaned" City

Post by earthfriendly » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 2:34 pm

http://www.straitstimes.com/news/singap ... tor=CS1-10" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I have nothing to add!

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by earthfriendly » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 3:01 pm

Come to think of it, I actually have something to add :P . In order to enlarge the $economy$, they wanted more women in the work force. Starting my generation while growing up in Singapore, we were fed the idea that we, the women of Singapore, could be whatever we aspired to be. Be a good student, study, work hard and a $uccessful career would ensue and we would no longer be bounded by household duties. Unlike our poor mothers. Wow, belly nice. You mean no more $tupid household chores when I grow up :love: . Because the lovely govt of $ingapore will start importing foreign workers for cheap to clean up your mess (I am using the term "mess" this time )for you. Hmnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn, sounds like a very good idea..................daydreaming of utopia.

In SG, any Tom, Dick or Harry household can freely hire foreign domestic help. In Taiwan, the household actually need to apply thru their council to get the permission and it is usually only granted for families with elderly medical related care. Not sure about HK though.
Last edited by earthfriendly on Wed, 18 Feb 2015 1:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by bgd » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 6:32 pm

East Coast Park on a Monday morning is a fine example of how clean Sg really is. Looks better by lunch time though. :wink:

Years back there was a pro-fox hunting rally in Hyde Park, London. Basically the country came to the city for a day or so. After the crowds left, Hyde Park was cleaner than when they arrived. Now that is something to aspire to.

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by x9200 » Tue, 17 Feb 2015 8:48 am

earthfriendly wrote:Come to think of it, I actually have something to add :P . In order to enlarge the $economy$, they wanted more women in the work force. Starting my generation while growing up in Singapore, we were fed the idea that we, the women of Singapore, could be whatever we aspired to be. Be a good student, study, work hard and a $uccessful career would ensue and we would no longer be bounded by household duties. Unlike our poor mothers. Wow, belly nice. You mean no more $tupid household chores when I grow up :love: . Because the lovely govt of $ingapore will start importing foreign workers for cheap to clean up your shit for you. Hmnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn, sounds like a very good idea..................daydreaming of utopia.

In SG, any Tom, Dick or Harry household can freely hire foreign domestic help. In Taiwan, the household actually need to apply thru their council to get the permission and it is usually only granted for families with elderly medical related care. Not sure about HK though.
It is not like you litter because there are more cleaners. Yes, there is some dependence (a feedback loop) but generally you have more cleaners because you litter more. The gov just tries to address the issue because Singaporeans generally don't want to do such work.

Looking at the way I was brought up the problem with the litter is double fold. Firstly, if you litter it means you are not socially apt. It is sort of like you missed your toilet training in one point so other people have to take care of you and wipe you *beep*. Secondly, it is also about respect to the job the cleaners do. You just don't add to somebody's job more work if you can do it by yourself in no time and effort. Probably there is also a strong link to the mentioned above reservation to do the physical work and I bet many think they are too uber to do the job the most locally despised class do.

Yet to another thing you touched, with both parents working you don't really need a cleaner so I don't think you can blame your gov on that part neither. Now, in the today's Singapore, admittedly, it is difficult to have children and both parents working without any help, but this is because everybody has a maid. In Europe, both parents working with no maid is a perfectly normal situation. Simply, schools, kindergartens and such work the way to fit the working time of the parents. Definitely not the case of Singapore as the maid will take the children and bring them in or out the school. You, yourself, ordinary people, created this rather sick system by relying on the convenience of having a FDW. At least this is IMHO.

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by Brah » Tue, 17 Feb 2015 9:24 am

x9200 wrote:Singaporeans generally don't want to do such work.

Looking at the way I was brought up the problem with the litter is double fold. Firstly, if you litter it means you are not socially apt. It is sort of like you missed your toilet training.. so other people have to take care of you and wipe youR *beep*.

In Europe, both parents working with no maid is a perfectly normal situation. Simply, schools, kindergartens and such work the way to fit the working time of the parents.

You, yourself, ordinary people, created this rather sick system by relying on the convenience of having a FDW. At least this is IMHO.
+all of the above
Excellent analogy re toilet training, bears repeating uncensored - stop expecting people to wipe your butts for you.

It's not like those people cleaning up after perfectly capable people don't dread that work day in and day out - there is more rewarding work they could be doing.

It all just perpetuates the paradigm of not taking responsibility for oneself.

Stop whinging and get off your asses and clean up after yourselves like the rest of the world.
Ape Shall Not Kill Ape.

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by JR8 » Tue, 17 Feb 2015 3:21 pm

Brah wrote: It all just perpetuates the paradigm of not taking responsibility for oneself.
No wonder so few SGn professionals dare to venture out into the world, self-reliance and self-discipline is required.
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by earthfriendly » Wed, 18 Feb 2015 1:29 am

I hear, I hear. Thank you all for your feedback. So many angles to consider when looking at one issue. I love this forum site :love: . When I showed my sweetie (i.e. my hubby) my post, he noted my use of profanity. I have accordingly replaced the four letter s-word with a more appropriate term. I go thru bouts of hyperactivity and add to that, a caffeine overload that day :oops: .

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by nakatago » Wed, 18 Feb 2015 5:45 am

earthfriendly wrote: I go thru bouts of hyperactivity.
Sounds like SMS in the mornings and JR8 most times of the day.
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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by x9200 » Wed, 18 Feb 2015 8:12 am

earthfriendly wrote:I hear, I hear. Thank you all for your feedback. So many angles to consider when looking at one issue. I love this forum site :love: . When I showed my sweetie (i.e. my hubby) my post, he noted my use of profanity. I have accordingly replaced the four letter s-word with a more appropriate term. I go thru bouts of hyperactivity and add to that, a caffeine overload that day :oops: .
And this is what I like about you.

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by JR8 » Wed, 18 Feb 2015 10:34 am

nakatago wrote:
earthfriendly wrote: I go thru bouts of hyperactivity.
Sounds like SMS in the mornings and JR8 most times of the day.
:lol: - I'd have thought of my case as being passionate and opinionated. As for SMS, yeah he's deffo maxed-up on the latter :wink: :P :lol:
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 18 Feb 2015 12:26 pm

:tongue:
SOME PEOPLE TRY TO TURN BACK THEIR ODOMETERS. NOT ME. I WANT PEOPLE TO KNOW WHY I LOOK THIS WAY. I'VE TRAVELED A LONG WAY, AND SOME OF THE ROADS WEREN'T PAVED. ~ Will Rogers

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by Wd40 » Thu, 19 Feb 2015 3:00 pm

I think the "both parents working" is more of bane than a boon. I think its a privilege to be a stay at home mom and get to spend more time with kids rather than work for an a$$hole and take all the $hit in office. If only one member of the family works in majority of the families then the whole economy adjusts such that salary for 1 person is sufficient to run the family. But now what we have in Singapore with both members working, is salaries have got depressed and now the economy has got adjusted, especially house prices, such that both members have to work to bring in enough income to sustain the increased cost of living.

Larry Summers made this excellent analogy which perfectly fits this scenario:
“It’s like standing up in an audience,” said Summers. “If you do it, you can see better. But if everyone does it at the same time, no one is better off.”
http://fortune.com/2015/01/22/larry-sum ... -qe-davos/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If the woman is career minded then its okay to work, but when I see the expression of faces in day to day life, I dont really see them as too much happy. Poor SG'reans trapped in their false sense of prosperity.

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by Barnsley » Thu, 19 Feb 2015 9:29 pm

Wd40 wrote:I think the "both parents working" is more of bane than a boon. I think its a privilege to be a stay at home mom and get to spend more time with kids rather than work for an a$$hole and take all the $hit in office. If only one member of the family works in majority of the families then the whole economy adjusts such that salary for 1 person is sufficient to run the family. But now what we have in Singapore with both members working, is salaries have got depressed and now the economy has got adjusted, especially house prices, such that both members have to work to bring in enough income to sustain the increased cost of living.

Larry Summers made this excellent analogy which perfectly fits this scenario:
“It’s like standing up in an audience,” said Summers. “If you do it, you can see better. But if everyone does it at the same time, no one is better off.”
http://fortune.com/2015/01/22/larry-sum ... -qe-davos/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If the woman is career minded then its okay to work, but when I see the expression of faces in day to day life, I dont really see them as too much happy. Poor SG'reans trapped in their false sense of prosperity.
Are you saying only men should work?

Whats up with a stay at home dad if the mum is bringing home the bacon?

Are you in the 1950's?
Life is short, paddle harder!!

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by Wd40 » Thu, 19 Feb 2015 9:38 pm

Barnsley wrote:
Wd40 wrote:I think the "both parents working" is more of bane than a boon. I think its a privilege to be a stay at home mom and get to spend more time with kids rather than work for an a$$hole and take all the $hit in office. If only one member of the family works in majority of the families then the whole economy adjusts such that salary for 1 person is sufficient to run the family. But now what we have in Singapore with both members working, is salaries have got depressed and now the economy has got adjusted, especially house prices, such that both members have to work to bring in enough income to sustain the increased cost of living.

Larry Summers made this excellent analogy which perfectly fits this scenario:
“It’s like standing up in an audience,” said Summers. “If you do it, you can see better. But if everyone does it at the same time, no one is better off.”
http://fortune.com/2015/01/22/larry-sum ... -qe-davos/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If the woman is career minded then its okay to work, but when I see the expression of faces in day to day life, I dont really see them as too much happy. Poor SG'reans trapped in their false sense of prosperity.
Are you saying only men should work?

Whats up with a stay at home dad if the mum is bringing home the bacon?

Are you in the 1950's?


I would be more than happy to be a stay at home dad. I would say women have the privilege to be a stay at home mom and take of their child. Children too are much more attached to their mom, especially at very young age. My daughter will not miss me so much if I am not at home but if my wife isn't at home, all hell breaks loose.

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Re: "Cleaned" City

Post by JR8 » Thu, 19 Feb 2015 10:13 pm

bgd wrote:East Coast Park on a Monday morning is a fine example of how clean Sg really is. Looks better by lunch time though. :wink:
Years back there was a pro-fox hunting rally in Hyde Park, London. Basically the country came to the city for a day or so. After the crowds left, Hyde Park was cleaner than when they arrived. Now that is something to aspire to.
I missed this one at the time.

- I could comment but will refrain, for a change :wink:

- Indeed there was, and as a proud country-boy ('Rus in urbe') I was there. The behaviour of the police was pretty shocking I have to say. Peaceful protesters treated like rioters :cry:
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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