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PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby JR8 » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 1:46 am

Sergei82 wrote: Emotional and irrational parts are definitely there. I hope, at last I find one that is both pretty and not dumb at the same time. :mrgreen:


Well, exactly. That is the end point, and self-knowledge you will arrive at, but not until you're out of the thick of it, and only then when you have newly calm time to think and reflect. Not just 'what's wrong with them', but why people like you [and the former me], can it seems at times be the convenient jigsaw piece that thinks it's a suitable slot to join into/against them. As people like them are conscious magnets for 'people such as us'. Figure that out in due course, consciously redefine your values and 'boundaries', and it should never happen again...

I cut and run from mine, 'mediated' (negotiated) a settlement via lawyers pre-court. After just 18 Mos. and her having a decent job too, and us not living 'up to our salaries' if wasn't that complex. It wasn't as if I'd introduced her to a completely different higher lifestyle that she had thus 'become accustomed to' over the course of time.

I proposed $x, she countered with say $3x. I agreed, simple, the 'Divorce Settlement Agreement' was signed, sealed, and done. Just getting it over with and walking away, never to have to contact her ever again for ever, was worth a great deal to me.

But anything I (we!) agreed to presumably increasingly got to her, as not hurting/punishing me sufficiently. Hence some weeks later in court her last minute attack on the divorce hearing judge on that final day. I'm quite sure, especially given the look on his face, that he's seen it 100 times before...
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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby PNGMK » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 8:55 am

The Ref wrote:With such a short marriage it wont cost too much, however the more you fight the more it costs. An ex workmate ended up at the high court and it has been going on for over 3 years.

Sorry to hear about your circumstances - but if I was 32 and single I would be heading to Hong Kong too ;-)


The Syariah court fees and lawyers costs don't vary that much actually; it's a pretty standard process. Where it can go up in a muslim marriage is if there is an issue over children.
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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby Sergei82 » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 1:35 pm

JR8, is your private message Inbox 100% full at the moment?

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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby JR8 » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 2:14 pm

Sergei82 wrote:JR8, is your private message Inbox 100% full at the moment?


Nope, I've just replied. I noticed the e-mail notification when we got in very late last night, but wasn't in a suitable condition then to provide any useful reply to it :wink:
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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby Brah » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 4:40 pm

Sergei - I just came across this thread now, and really sorry to hear what's been happening with you. As we've met I wish I had some advice but I don't, I just hope it all works out. One thing I do know is that after time, it gets better.

I'd agree with what has been written - that 4k might just be the best money you ever spent.
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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby PNGMK » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 6:14 pm

It's times like these that I wish we could sell our PR's to the highest bidder. WD40 doesn't have the wherewithal to win a bid but plenty of his mates do I suspect.
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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 8:56 pm

PNGMK wrote:It's times like these that I wish we could sell our PR's to the highest bidder. WD40 doesn't have the wherewithal to win a bid but plenty of his mates do I suspect.

Reminds me of time years ago when somebody offered to buy my passport for 5,000$ .. no .. I didn't accept the offer ...

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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby Wd40 » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 9:12 pm

PNGMK wrote:It's times like these that I wish we could sell our PR's to the highest bidder. WD40 doesn't have the wherewithal to win a bid but plenty of his mates do I suspect.


I wonder how it would be valued though. At the moment, I would imagine it would be valued at minimum 10% excess ABSD that foreigners pay over PRs, so for a 1 Million condo it is 100k and then education benefits, the safety factor yada yada, another 50K.

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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby JR8 » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 10:10 pm

Wd40 wrote:... so for a 1 Million condo it is 100k and then education benefits, the safety factor yada yada, another 50K.


It intrigues me how words migrate over time.

---
'Full Definition of YADA YADA: boring or empty talk <listening to a lot of yada yada about the economy> —often used interjectionally especially in recounting words regarded as too dull or predictable to be worth repeating.
Examples: 'And here she goes again, yada yada yada'.
Word Origin: 1967; fr Yiddish and Hebrew yadaa 'to know'
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/yada%20yada?s=t
---

Now.... how has a Yiddish expression migrated into use by an Indian national based in Singapore? :???: :)

Edit: confusing typo
Last edited by JR8 on Mon, 16 Feb 2015 12:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby Wd40 » Sun, 15 Feb 2015 10:23 pm

It's funny, somethings we read or hear gets registered in our subconscious mind and then when we are looking for a word it comes out at the right time. I don't remember where or when I heard/read that expression, but I thought its the best, what other choice I have, blah blah :) I am an Indian working in Singapore but I have interacted a lot with Americans, British, Singaporeans and others due to my job, and some things slip into my vocabulary, subconsciously. I am pretty sure, some expressions I have learnt from this very forum ;)

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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby JR8 » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 12:21 am

This is how language migrates and evolves, it's fascinating.

A very similar example (Yiddish); many years back my sister was talking about 'Schlepping around all day'. I knew the expression as I'd worked in NYC, and I was thinking now how on earth has she picked that up back in rural Europe :???:

Then you have archaic English words that have morphed into current day use in Singapore, archaic 'Indian' words that are in current day use in England, and so on.

Terms of derision, of varying degree, from WW2 in Europe still in use today. 'Krauts' meaning cabbages, referring to Germans. Limey, Pommy, and how about 'Brittunculi - ...the pejorative Latin word Brittunculi (= wretched little Britons) is used – presumably by a Roman official – in a commentary on the natives' military tactics. :lol:
We call the French 'frogs', they call us 'Rosbifs' [roast beefs].... and so many more ... :)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternativ ... he_British
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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby PNGMK » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 6:28 am

Wd40 wrote:
PNGMK wrote:It's times like these that I wish we could sell our PR's to the highest bidder. WD40 doesn't have the wherewithal to win a bid but plenty of his mates do I suspect.


I wonder how it would be valued though. At the moment, I would imagine it would be valued at minimum 10% excess ABSD that foreigners pay over PRs, so for a 1 Million condo it is 100k and then education benefits, the safety factor yada yada, another 50K.


Fair valuation excluding those what are trying to hide cash from the taxman (i.e a whole bunch).
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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby nakatago » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 8:38 am

Oi vei...

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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby x9200 » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 9:41 am

JR8 wrote:@X9
Heh? The DSM is not aimed at children, how did that suggestion come about? It is the clinical diagnostic manual for professional reference. I'm suggesting that many adults will at least be able to understand the basics of it, and probably make use of it, as a starting point, without being guided and hand-held through it.
You suggested everybody should be equipped in this kind of knowledge what pretty much narrows down the teaching to the basic, compulsory educational track (people <=18yo) and in this context DSM was also mentioned thus my comments on the subject.

JR8 wrote:If I tell you you have Multiple Sclerosis, then you have some idea what to expect next. You can go away and learn a whole lot more. [And a doctor did do this for me just a few years back.... thankfully it transpired he was incorrect... but that wasn't a fun day [sigh], what a truly terrible way to go that must be...]
Learning about the symptoms of MS is IMHO much much easier than of something as complex as PD. It is also not a good analogy for the reason of lack of interpersonal conflicting interests that is often very strong when a relationship gets to such stages we are talking here about.

JR8 wrote:How does it help? I'll tell you how it helped in my situation. I was faced with something 'really quite similar' [intentionally vague] to what Sergei is going through, in my case with my first wife. It honestly was the most explosive, inexplicable random scary episode of my entire life, at that point. I had no idea what was happening - it had no logical normal reference points at all. How do you deal with that? A friend/neighbour suggested it might be bi-polar disorder (aka manic depression). I had no idea what such things were or why they happened. Such thing 'don't happen' in the close knit community I was brought up in, and certainly not to 'good/decent people' - that's sort of the culture. So they're never discussed, and younger people typically have no idea what they are. I'd heard of it sure but had to go away and read up about what it actually was. I found some similarities, but not particularly compelling. I still had no idea really.

Through a work staff 3rd-party help-line, things were so bad, I plucked up the courage to call them one day, and just try to explain what I was going through. It's not easy if what you're going to try and describe sounds inexplicable, and almost beyond comprehension, i.e. like they might not understand, but instead conclude that it's actually YOU who is the nutter. But no, the counsellor at the other end clearly had some idea of what was going on, as I was right away referred to 2*week appointments with a psych/counsellor (and later this reduced to 1* week). It's lucky as at that point it really was a lifeline.

Ultimately I visited her for maybe three months, on the drive home after work. From the point of having no clue WTH was happening, to having engaged a divorce lawyer, and filed the papers in court. At that point I was leaving the country anyway, though I had to return for compulsory mediation, and then later again for the 20 minute hearing. Settlement agreed? Yes. Any other issues? Apart from my XW losing it and getting hysterical at the judge, and trying to somehow relaunch a whole new parallel case (LOL - good one, so like her)- No? Bang, it's over.

The start of the exit route to the door was (as I might have said) as early as the 1st session with the shrink. Where, after listening to me talking non-stop for 49.5 minutes she concluded 'JR8, I think you should go home tonight and take a look on the net, into 'XYZ' [Int/vague] personality disorder'. Perhaps you think she shouldn't have done that?

I was led to that in one hour, by a very experienced and very highly qualified professional. And like I said, when I got home and did as she suggested, it was like being hit with a shovel on the back of the head... 'Boom!'. Suddenly everything made sense. You've heard of the expression 'Seeing the light'... something that some of us might experience a few times in a lifetime. Well, due to my circumstances and ignorance on such matters, this was like a 'F*** Me! Seeing the light epiphany'. Honestly terrifying. I never expect to repeat anything like that one moment in my entire life. In many ways, I hope I never do. Suddenly I knew I had to get out, and as much as I deeply believed in the vow of 'In sickness and in health', I realised there was no alternative. And suddenly I knew I was in for the fight of my life, since leaving, despite the allegations, was the last thing my accuser was expecting or wishing me to actually do.

Not a fun time that's for sure. But luckily I was leaving the US anyway very soon thereafter, so there was then 5000 miles of clear water between us. Still when I got back home, I was acutely aware when out and about that she might have turned up looking for me (she did know where I likely lived). In any case that was the start of the end. It's still today the reason I post on no public websites under my real name... I have no doubt if she could contact me that she would, even now, as she seems to have an unquenchable drive, a 'pathological need' to dish out yet further revenge. I reckon people like that never get over things, never forgive [even the totally imagined], and never forget. It's not something now, 15 years later, I think about more than very occasionally. Usually when I do it's quietly remembering the horror of it if I hear reports that have striking similarities. Such as this one ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane_Andrews - or indeed poor old Sergei's. His position, reminds me of what mine was, and I really feel for him, as I believe I have probably been to the particular 'crazy-zone' he's in right now. Just now knowing what's just hit you.
You visited a shrink and she told you to look-up a PD she mentioned on the Internet. You did it and this convinced you to quit your marriage. So what would you have done if you knew what was the PD-like before?

Sure it does not sound like a nice experience and I am really symphatetic for you for what you had to gone through but just for the sake of clarity in this discussion I have to be a bit unceremonial. Hope you understand this.

JR8 wrote:So X9 what's your interest in this, it's not clear? Are you a psych who doesn't like people doing their own background research, it clearly animates you quite strongly? Ah well, either way, my psych clearly thought a different approach was better in my circumstances. Thank God she did, it made my exiting from the situation, simpler, faster, and at least in some ways at least partially comprehensible.

Mostly what I mentioned earlier: I just know that such large domain of clinically based knowledge without a proper experience is worth close to nothing. An average person would not be able to comprehend the whole image and such comprehension is necessary to make a diagnosis in the early stages, otherwise it gets to the stage you ended up with anyway or IMHO it may even accelerate the process. IMHO again, for the vast majority cases it will be like telling a hypochondriac what are the detailed symptoms of all the cancers. It will help that much.

Also, getting back to my earlier point and I have no idea how was it in your case, but I believe for the majority of couples that are emotionally engaged (pardonne moi: are in love) you could never find a simple solution before the terminal stage. This is because if you are really engaged the answer to when enough is enough is pretty close to never. You had to encounter something really traumatic to shake it all off you and start rationalize. You may be a shrink by yourself and find yourself in a deep sh*t hole.

You will most likely see some bad signs right from the start, you, with some luck, will be able to guess the right PD, and what you are going to do about it? Quit? Just like this? Maybe, if you are very very good, you would manage to convince your partner (working against her and yours self-denial) to go to see a shrink, but again, IMHO most of people would not manage to do this and they will end up using their “knowledge”, willingly or not to piss the other party off in a chain of arguments achieving just a contrary effect to the intended one - such person will be even more reluctant to see the shrink.

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Re: PR approved, but I don't need it anymore WTF!!!???

Postby Sergei82 » Mon, 16 Feb 2015 10:38 am

X9200, that kind of knowledge does not prevent anything for sure, but it does help tremendously to recover psychologically and realize what was going on after the blow (hopefully, just a blow like mine, not years of wallowing in pain and suffer).


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