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Democracy or Economic Growth?

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ecureilx
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Re: RE: Re: Democracy or Economic Growth?

Postby ecureilx » Mon, 20 Jul 2015 2:32 pm

sgstrait wrote:Many American military inventions have found their way into civilian use subsequently eg. drones, nuclear, and lots of other stuff. Problem is, Russia is a one trick pony with tunnel vision.


Yep ... :D :D

How US made us of Nuclear bombs for Civilian purposes, and how Drones have saved lives ;) :D

Then again, back to Russia, a lot of their Inventions do have Civilian purposes, though in the propaganda part, they failed repeatedly

Take for example the number of AN 124s flying Civilian cargo, and important civilian cargo.

And the Mils, which are doing excellent service where others dare not fly, and costing a fraction of their western equivalent, provide much needed air lift for countries who can't afford Western equipment. Even the UN has been leasing Russian Gear a lot, for their dependability and ruggedness.

And on the other end, how the Kalashnikov has saved lives as the inventor believes .. (the last one was really tongue in cheek... )

To Quote Kalashnikov: "I created a weapon to defend the borders of my motherland. It's not my fault that it's being used where it shouldn't be. The politicians are more to blame for this."

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Re: RE: Re: Democracy or Economic Growth?

Postby Barnsley » Mon, 20 Jul 2015 4:05 pm

ecureilx wrote:
How US made us of Nuclear bombs for Civilian purposes, and how Drones have saved lives ;) :D

"


Nuclear Power to generate electricty came from the same folk who developed the nuclear weapons.

Drones are very useful for traffic surveillance, and delivering parcels apparently.
Life is short, paddle harder!!

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Re: Democracy or Economic Growth?

Postby calugaruvaxile » Tue, 21 Jul 2015 11:36 pm

Barnsley wrote:
If you put all your eggs in one basket then one would hope you would end up good at something.

:D

Just think what they could have achieved if they hadn't had all their great minds working on Military and vanity projects.


they aren't doing it ... just that they always had a lower consideration for the quality of life and higher price on the "esoteric" "national" achievements.

take theoretical physics and maths (my primary field); the works of landau, lifshitz, akhiezer, berestetskii, batygin etcetc. even the term "robot" comes from russian language: "rabota" is "work".

i have seen both russia and us; my own take is that the people of us and russia are more likely than any other two in this world. if you take one midwestern village and place it near one volgan village (and provided they could understand each other's language) you would see the villages merge after a couple of years.

the difference is the way the government works (and it always worked): top-down vs bottom-up. and the all-powerful orthodox church, versus the us religious fragmentation

as a joke (it's not exactly a joke, it was reality), the discovery of He superfluidity involves the gulag: simply, the scientists were accused of stealing/misusing "the people's helium". for theose of you who don't know, He has the property of "escaping" from normal recipients; so the lab found the He was gone, and no one could explain why. the discovery of the superfluidity saved one poor chap from siberia

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Re: RE: Re: Democracy or Economic Growth?

Postby calugaruvaxile » Tue, 21 Jul 2015 11:55 pm

Barnsley wrote:
Nuclear Power to generate electricty came from the same folk who developed the nuclear weapons.

Drones are very useful for traffic surveillance, and delivering parcels apparently.


one story from hans queisser himself (this is the guy who invented silicon solar cells): the bell labs developed the silicon solar arrays for the us army (who at that time - fifties - were looking for an alternate power source). the panel rejected the solar panels, as the output was very small, compared to the nuclear reactors. they decided for making the nuke reactors smaller. so the russians took the silicon arrays and placed them on ... satellites :).

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Re: Democracy or Economic Growth?

Postby x9200 » Wed, 22 Jul 2015 4:03 am

calugaruvaxile wrote:they aren't doing it ... just that they always had a lower consideration for the quality of life and higher price on the "esoteric" "national" achievements.

take theoretical physics and maths (my primary field); the works of landau, lifshitz, akhiezer, berestetskii, batygin etcetc. even the term "robot" comes from russian language: "rabota" is "work".

Ehem.

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=robot
robot (n.)
1923, from English translation of 1920 play "R.U.R." ("Rossum's Universal Robots"), by Karel Capek (1890-1938), from Czech robotnik [..]

If this was from Russian it would be pronounced differently sort of \ˈrə-ˌbät instead of \ˈrō-ˌbät.
I sense some influence of Russian propaganda.

Prior to this (the great guys of sciences you mentioned), did you consider per national capita factor? For example:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... per_capita

It's a sheer number IMHO, not any specific quality of the Russian nation.

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Re: Democracy or Economic Growth?

Postby calugaruvaxile » Thu, 23 Jul 2015 1:18 am

x9200 wrote:
It's a sheer number IMHO, not any specific quality of the Russian nation.


hihi, history and statistics tell a story. and truth really depends of your own perspective. for example, werner von braun ... there are people who would have seen von braun as a hero, others would have killed him on sight.

at the end of the day, these numbers (likewise how many olympic medals, etcetc) don't mean much - they fuel nationalistic fire, more than anything else.

coming back to hk, what i believe is that people like to see positive gradients in their life (entropy always grows) . when you start from kampugs, the hdbs are such a great thing (and you can't understand why some other people will frown at them). if you start with more freedom, you get upset when it's restricted. when you never had any, it's not that much of a miss.

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Re: Democracy or Economic Growth?

Postby x9200 » Thu, 23 Jul 2015 7:05 am

calugaruvaxile wrote:coming back to hk, what i believe is that people like to see positive gradients in their life (entropy always grows) . when you start from kampugs, the hdbs are such a great thing (and you can't understand why some other people will frown at them). if you start with more freedom, you get upset when it's restricted. when you never had any, it's not that much of a miss.

This entropy bothers me more on a (self-)consciousness level which is basically about widely understood freedom of choice.
Sometimes seeing people on the street hypnotised by a tv screen I have thoughts that perhaps this was a better way but then again, this sort of dilemmas (ways) determinants are often not really a personal choice.

BTW, it's actually not entropy because you can always introduce a goat to a crowded room.

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Re: Democracy or Economic Growth?

Postby calugaruvaxile » Thu, 23 Jul 2015 10:18 pm

x9200 wrote:
calugaruvaxile wrote:coming back to hk, what i believe is that people like to see positive gradients in their life (entropy always grows) . when you start from kampugs, the hdbs are such a great thing (and you can't understand why some other people will frown at them). if you start with more freedom, you get upset when it's restricted. when you never had any, it's not that much of a miss.

This entropy bothers me more on a (self-)consciousness level which is basically about widely understood freedom of choice.
Sometimes seeing people on the street hypnotised by a tv screen I have thoughts that perhaps this was a better way but then again, this sort of dilemmas (ways) determinants are often not really a personal choice.

BTW, it's actually not entropy because you can always introduce a goat to a crowded room.


yes, but for a short while. and a) you won't allow people to leave - this is called police state or b) some of the people in the room will leave (those who can find a different room) and c) the stink will stay in the room for a very long while :mrgreen:


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