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Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th floor

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taxico
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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby taxico » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 12:01 am

x9200 wrote:
taxico wrote:
x9200 wrote:Following this logic changing flat tire by a private person is illegal or at least not tolerated.


replace the word "singaporeans" with the term "commercial Movers," then.

I don't think it is a practical approach for the Movers:
- it is building dependent - needs to be installed, just think about lifting a washing machine this way. It won't be trivial to install it and secure the area. Would it fit the window? It would be useful for limited weight and size only (50kg?)
- it is limited to lower rise buildings (4-5 floors max) - how many of them are around, 5%? Many of them have lifts. For 1-2 storey building a forklift, cherry picker or just a conveyer belt would be a safer and quicker option
- it provides advantage mostly with limited manpower and the Movers seldom are a 2 people company.


i can't help you there because i'm not sure what your end is. i assumed we were talking about a simple pulley for the purposes of moving non-heavy boxes (as raj mentioned earlier in the thread)... not scissor lifts, cranes or other types of lifting appliances used to move grand pianos into homes.

i concede i do not have the lengthy list of restrictions that are imposed on every resident in singapore through the town council/condo by-laws, nor do i know the exact statute that was meant to deter/penalize killer litter offenders.

but because i was an ex-MOM Designated Workplace Doctor (all hazards), your above-mentioned scope of work is definitely something i know about, and i agree it would not be practical for Movers to install such lifting gears/appliances for most jobs.
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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby x9200 » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 7:35 am

I am just trying to address your points. You shared the concern that if it was legal (using the pulleys), people would use it. From my observation Singaporeans do not get that easy involved in a specialized (DIY) work unless it is their professionally learned skill (changing a puncture tire one of the examples). Then you said, how about the Movers, but this was a different thing - as the professionals for handling heavy/bulky items they would unlikely resort to a basic, simple pulley but for completely different reasons. This all IMO explains why we don't see it around. It is a bit more complicated thing than changing a tire or hanging lights from the ceiling but too limited in capabilities to be attractive for the relocation professionals.

I believe there is a pretty narrow range of "machinery" that needs a certificate/license to be operated. The whole rest is based on general law or for the professional use, the safety framework (SWP, RA etc. as of Workplace Safety & Health Act) I mentioned earlier.

Sure if Raj does it the way that there will be a heavy weight on a weak support swinging over a sidewalk full of pedestrians he will likely get fined or even detained by the first police patrol on the spot, but if he does it properly, not endangering anybody/anything, then why not?

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby ecureilx » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 7:58 am

x9200 wrote:Sure if Raj does it the way that there will be a heavy weight on a weak support swinging over a sidewalk full of pedestrians he will likely get fined or even detained by the first police patrol on the spot, but if he does it properly, not endangering anybody/anything, then why not?


Years ago, in a former life, when I was in Kallang Industrial, we engaged a contractor who used a hoist system anchored to the building itself, to bring up our standby generator

And there are buildings, in Kallang, Tai Seng and Jurong area, designed so that heavy machinery and stuff can be hoisted

If you see most companies around Shipyard area, a lot specialize in Lifting and skidding.

While anywhere that may be a DIY Job, not in Singapore, is my point.

Just because it is not visible doesn't mean you can go ahead, and lift something, and accidentally drop it on somebody's car.

And I have seen in nearby countries where a few strands of rope were used to hoist up a Chiller plant up 4 floors, with nothing but simple human power and I couldn't see any brakes.

And another, a huge Steel safe was being lowered with nothing but rope and simple human power, no levering or whatever ..

If you look around, you may find the piece of legislation that forbids DIY lifting jobs, and jobs that allow automatic entry to Darwin's awards !!

Singapore isn't so strict like Australia (from what I understand from my friends there) where you need a certified electrician to even change a plug point. But Singapore isn't also so lax in safety standards and enforcement

now, I am sure Raj is just testing the waters, but, if he is to do it, I am pretty sure a phone call and he's gonna end up in a 'hotel' room c/o SPF ! or MOM, or somebody who will do the needful

And anyway, as I suggested to Raj, all he needs to do is call the right guys do the lifting/moving and shifting

And because he is on a walk up doesn't mean the Movers will used pulleys and hoists, most likely they will use raw human power, but hey, they are there to do it.

Why get stressed ?

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby nakatago » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 8:14 am

ecureilx wrote:Singapore isn't so strict like Australia (from what I understand from my friends there) where you need a certified electrician to even change a plug point. But Singapore isn't also so lax in safety standards and enforcement


In Queensland. Because pollies there think everyone is a baby.

NSW treats people just a bit more like adults. Just a bit:

WHO IS ALLOWED TO REPLACE A PLUG OR SOCKET?
Plugs and extension cord sockets may be replaced by a non-electrically trained person, provided the
person has been trained and found competent to fit plugs and sockets according to the manufacturer’s
instructions.


http://www.csu.edu.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/135974/electrical_testing_tagging_frequently_asked_questions_4861.pdf

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby Strong Eagle » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 9:01 am

So... I've kinda got to laugh at this thread... and I apologize in advance for laughing...

But... you see, I am probably the world's best handyman, able to fix most anything, from digital cameras to your toilet's plumbing... and I think raja's pulley idea makes good sense.

This is an "in and out hit job"... he'll have people on the ground loading crap into his pulley system and people on the balcony offloading it. Yellow tape is so much nonsense... tell'em to stay the hell out of the way or a box might fall on their heads.

So, raja, without seeing your place, I offer you a generic construction project... which may end up costing you too much anyway.

You want to have something that overhangs your balcony by a couple of feet, ie, a pole, so that you can bring boxes to a balcony level. Let's say 2 feet is your magic number. To ensure that you can safely keep the pipe from falling off the balcony, you'll need 8 feet on the opposite side of the balcony wall so that you only need 1/4 of the lifting weight to keep it in place.

Thus, you need a 10 foot pole... metal... cast iron or steel, with decent wall strength... can find in the Lavender/Kallang area somewhere.

You need a decent size pulley... the one's that are an inch or so in diameter may be OK... but stick with brass and not the cheap pot mettle crap that so many hardware stores carry. Better to get something larger... 2 or more inches in diameter... reduces jams... more lifting capacity... and more expensive.

You are 4 stories up... about 40-50 feet. If you are simply going to pull up from the ground, you need a 100 feet of rope... for 40 lbs or so, I'd recommend a 1/4 or 3/8" rope... nylon or polyester. If you really want to use a dual block pulley to reduce pulling force, then you need at least 200 feet... do buy something better than the crap that is used to pull up bamboo roll blinds.

Then, you need the following to actually carry your cargo.

a) A hook with a safety latch to carry your cargo.
b) A link to connect your hook to the pulley assembly.
c) A stout 2 or 4 handled carry bag to load your cargo into.

I'd guess that you can buy all the stuff you need, in good quality, for about $150... maybe a bit less. You don't need to worry about fastening the pipe on the balcony... with the leverage ratio, someone should be able to hold it... just don't let him/her drink and let go of the damn thing... then again, you can build a safety harness, just in case.

If you were going to go with a dual block pulley, I really can't see any reason you wouldn't haul your washing machine up the same way.

And... how come other people don't do it? No creativity! Do it, brother!

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby x9200 » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 10:30 am

For all the DIY work you generally don't mess with two things only: town gas installation and the load bearing walls. For the whole rest, I really don't think you need anything else than some common sense.

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby ecureilx » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 10:46 am

x9200 wrote:For all the DIY work you generally don't mess with two things only: town gas installation and the load bearing walls. For the whole rest, I really don't think you need anything else than some common sense.


just make sure you are not a danger to yourself, or others, or other's property, even little, is to be taken into consideration !!!!

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby Strong Eagle » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 10:52 am

And just be aware that the force on the rod/pulley at the top will be at least twice the mass of the object you are lifting... ie, lifting 20 kg box, need 40 kg pole and pulley.

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby JR8 » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 11:18 am

.... and be aware your scaffold/base system needs to allow the object to be hoisted high enough so it can readily clear any wall.

You see such systems with two ropes. One a hoisting rope, the other used later, to pull the hoisted object horizontally towards you. You might consider fixing the hoist higher than your own floor, with the hoisting rope up there, and the pulling rope at your own level.

[Better still, and less drama, if you have a hoist that is hinged and so can pivot from hoisting, to guiding the object over any wall].
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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby rajagainstthemachine » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 1:40 pm

I was amused to read some of the comments here, people here with so many different perspectives and varying opinions :lol:

I've come up with a sensible plan B for the washing machine and one that doesn't involve hoisting or carrying it up.
1. load washer on a trolley
2. place one or two planks of plywood/block board on the stairs
3. push trolley up the board to level 1 landing
4. move plank to next set of stairs
5. rinse and repeat

Thanks to Strong Eagle, that post of yours was quite an accurate description of what I was attempting to do,but to carry loads of a much smaller scale, maybe 10kg max.
The other more cost effective way is to use a grappling hook , i believe this could a suitable alternative for groceries and stuff in the future :D
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Plan C

I position humans at three different points, ground floor Level 2 and Level 4
and have them carry stuff from Ground -> 2 - >4
To get there early is on time and showing up on time is late

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby JR8 » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 2:19 pm

Either way... please just post photos 8-)
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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 2:57 pm

JR8 wrote:Either way... please just post photos 8-)


But remember to let go of the ropes so you don't shake the camera! :P

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby x9200 » Wed, 05 Nov 2014 7:23 pm

rajagainstthemachine wrote:The other more cost effective way is to use a grappling hook , i believe this could a suitable alternative for groceries and stuff in the future :D
Image


Hooks are for sissies.

Image

just make sure you are not a danger to yourself, or others, or other's property, even little, is to be taken into consideration

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby ecureilx » Thu, 06 Nov 2014 8:13 am

A Go Pro cam may help, in case you are using both hands ;)

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Re: Looking for a Pulley system to haul stuff to the 4th flo

Postby nakatago » Thu, 06 Nov 2014 8:21 am

x9200 wrote:
rajagainstthemachine wrote:The other more cost effective way is to use a grappling hook , i believe this could a suitable alternative for groceries and stuff in the future :D
Image


Hooks are for sissies.

Image

just make sure you are not a danger to yourself, or others, or other's property, even little, is to be taken into consideration



Bah. Not physics-y enough.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trebuchet


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