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JR8
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If Singapore is -

Postby JR8 » Sun, 21 Sep 2014 12:47 pm

such a successful country, why do the people here often seem so dissatisfied, even angry?

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Postby Wd40 » Sun, 21 Sep 2014 12:58 pm

Something to do with the people themselves. Their culture, their upbringing etc. As a country it is immensely successful, considering where they started from.

What would you expect from the most materialistic people on the planet:

http://qz.com/158282/china-may-actually ... the-world/

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Postby bgd » Sun, 21 Sep 2014 3:01 pm

It strikes me that the happiest people here are those with very little and they just get on and make the best of it.

Singaporeans have an aspirational lifestyle and I don't think that leads to happiness. Singapore isn't alone here, plenty of unhappy people in other rich countries.

Blame America, didn't they invent advertising? Or at the least perfect it.

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Postby Wd40 » Sun, 21 Sep 2014 3:15 pm

The thing that makes its worst is the fact that on one hand you have uber materialistic people and on the other hand the things of maximum desire are made so expensive beyond people's reach i.e. condos and cars. Obviously that leads to super unhappiness when you don't have enough money to renew the COE of your car or upgrade to a condo, when your neighbour just did that.

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Postby ecureilx » Sun, 21 Sep 2014 3:50 pm

the unhappiness maybe .. due to the fact, that in the last ten years, they have been allowed to 'speak up'

unlike before, when everybody keeps quite, and with a lack of interesting news, what else can the natives do ?

complain and complain ??

:D

A friend recently quipped, when she saw a post in Facebook about train delays .. at the time she was in Sydney and said, in Sydney metro was not operational over the whole weekend, due to some repair work, and she went on to say SGns are too pampered

Like when there was slow traffic and the taxi complained of jam, I asked him if he has sat in a traffic jam for 4 hours or more, as I have done in KL and Manila .

Utter silence, and then 'well, our ministers are paid .. .. ' blah blah ..

Wasn't there a Singapore complaint club ????

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Postby JR8 » Sun, 21 Sep 2014 8:21 pm

Wd40 wrote:What would you expect from the most materialistic people on the planet:
http://qz.com/158282/china-may-actually ... the-world/


Thanks WD:

[color=blue][i]'On the whole, there appears to be a correlation between the stage of a country’s development and its tendency to equate money with success. China, India and Brazil, three of the world’s most noteworthy developing countries, were all among the likeliest to measure success by material belongings. In fact, a deeper dive into the data shows that while Chinese agreed most that success is measured by the things one owns, Brazilians and Indians were actually more likely to “strongly agree”

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Postby ecureilx » Sun, 21 Sep 2014 9:10 pm

JR8 wrote:
Wd40 wrote:What would you expect from the most materialistic people on the planet:
http://qz.com/158282/china-may-actually ... the-world/


Thanks WD:

[color=blue][i]'On the whole, there appears to be a correlation between the stage of a country’s development and its tendency to equate money with success. China, India and Brazil, three of the world’s most noteworthy developing countries, were all among the likeliest to measure success by material belongings. In fact, a deeper dive into the data shows that while Chinese agreed most that success is measured by the things one owns, Brazilians and Indians were actually more likely to “strongly agree”

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Re: If Singapore is -

Postby earthfriendly » Wed, 24 Sep 2014 12:49 am

JR8 wrote:such a successful country, why do the people here often seem so dissatisfied, even angry?


It is because of how they define the term "success". Exerpt from Lee Hsien Loong's response:

Asked why there were those here who were not satisfied despite having much of what many others in the world would want, he said he had accepted this as the human condition: "That wherever you are, (you would) like to be better, and wherever you are not sometimes appears to be better.


I have observed this to be true of many societies. However, it has a lot to do with how we groom our kids. Living in the US suburb, my kids have picked up quite a bit of materialistic views of the world. Materialism is subtle here, unlike the in-the-face type of SG. Nevertheless, it is well and alive. We, as adults, can provide them with alternative views. Offer them options and let them know that they do not have to pick up the mob-bish views of their immediate surroundings. If it is not serving them well. We can teach them to be mindful of their present blessings, what they already have, rather than focusing their attention of what they don't have. Do not entertain FOMO (Fear Of Missing Out). If FOMO tries to drop in at their doorstep, kindly ask it to leave. Tell FOMO, "sorry, but I just don't have room in my home to accomodate you." :mrgreen:

I have a lot of respect and gratitude for what LKY has done for the country. I have never doubted his good intentions. However, some of his methodologies...... He (and Lee Hsien Loong too?????) thinks that the country is sustained by a group of elites who has the ability to create jobs and success to lift up the entire nation. LKY would give out scholarships to the best brains of the country, pinning his hope on these small group of elites. Latter on, he eventually started giving out scholarships to the middle level citizens. Much to the relief of his own wife and daugther.

So you see, this kind of approach trickles down to the general populace and leaves many citizens feeling displaced. It is not inclusionary.

However, Lee Hsien Loong further elaborated:

But you should also have some of the Buddhist acceptance that resources are finite and desires are unlimited.

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Postby earthfriendly » Wed, 24 Sep 2014 3:49 am

And I think you will find quite a percentage of Singaporeans to be quite direct, which enables you to experience more of the raw human emotions. As opposed to a reserved culture.

But he noted that the Chinese were less susceptible to Paris Syndrome than the Japanese, since they were fortified by a directness and an outsized sense of self that was similar to the French.


LOL! Generalization, of course lah. But does offer a bit of explanation on the different types of human behaviors.

http://seattletimes.com/html/travel/202 ... tsxml.html

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Re: If Singapore is -

Postby JR8 » Wed, 24 Sep 2014 9:54 am

earthfriendly wrote:
JR8 wrote:such a successful country, why do the people here often seem so dissatisfied, even angry?


It is because of how they define the term "success". Exerpt from Lee Hsien Loong's response:

Asked why there were those here who were not satisfied despite having much of what many others in the world would want, he said he had accepted this as the human condition: "That wherever you are, (you would) like to be better, and wherever you are not sometimes appears to be better.


Paris syndrome. Fascinating, I'd never heard of that - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_syndrome

So what LHL is referring to is 'The grass is always greener on the other side [neighbours lawn]'.

Or, Status Anxiety
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Status_Anxiety

I disagree with LHL when he says it is 'the human condition', as if it were some form of universal default, as it's not. For example when I was in the midst of my cut-throat career I had friends, or colleagues who had:

- Ferraris
- Gold frequent flyer cards
- 'The gold Rolex'
... and so on.

That was the culture, and it pretty much went in parallel with the mentality required to compete and survive in that industry. By default I aspired to have it all too.

Until I ended that career and entered full-time self-employment. Then there was no one I 'needed to impress' any more :)

By then I saw the $trinkets as rather sad props to try and project status. Incredibly shallow but that's how it works. That is the point where you see the guy:

- who's ego is so tied to what his salary buys him that he can never take a change of direction in his career to something less lucrative but more fulfilling.
- who says his wife would divorce him if he earned less [seriously]
- who rarely gets to see his wife/family as he spends much of his waking hours on an aeroplane, if not on business trips.

It is not a default condition: If you take a moment to step outside of the hothouse that is quite plain to see.

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Postby Wd40 » Wed, 24 Sep 2014 10:00 am

Agree with EarthFriendly's comment of people having this missing out feeling. Not just the scholarships. The education system here is completely screwed. I read somewhere that there is no place here for late bloomers. There is kind of subdivision of students are very early age(PSLE??) That is way too early to judge a child's ability and then "categorize" them as bright or daft. Worst part is those that are categorised as daft then cannot even improve and go to univ they are made to go to ITE.

In India, even though there is a lot of emphasis on academics, we do not subject our kids to such humiliation. In fact from what I heard they have completely done away with Marks until the 8th grade and its only grading A,B,C etc and also no failing students and repeating classes until the 8th grade.
Last edited by Wd40 on Wed, 24 Sep 2014 10:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Max Headroom » Wed, 24 Sep 2014 10:01 am

That French thing is interesting; I get frequent calls from people around the world. It's only the French that start the call with "Hello, I am French..." followed by the rest of the call, which tends to be as per normal. I noticed this several years ago and I'm still getting this now.

I should point out that /nationality/country of residence/birth is wholly irrelevant in the service we offer.

Mind you, it's not that all French callers do this. It's just that if and when anyone does go the I'm-from route, he or she is invariably French.

It could be a symptom of that outsized sense of self. (Talk about French paradox, haha). But it could also be intended to preemptively clarify their generally less-than-stellar English. Or perhaps it's a cultural thing.

Whatever the reason, it's interesting.







Edit: Bunker

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Postby earthfriendly » Wed, 24 Sep 2014 10:13 am

I am not sure if they still do this but streaming starts at P3. It is much too young to try to "categorize" kids at this age. There are many late bloomers amongst us. Too harsh. Once again, it is a fear-driven policy. Catch the bright ones early on in life and separate out those who are less able so we can concentrate the efforts on grooming the goods brains for our economy. Once again, it is about the ECONOMY.

They should offer trade schools and allow those to veer off the academic path if they so inclined, around the secondary school level.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 24 Sep 2014 10:17 am

Max Headroom wrote:That French thing is interesting; I get frequent calls from people around the world. It's only the French that start the call with "Hello, I am French..." followed by the rest of the call, which tends to be as per normal. I noticed this several years ago and I'm still getting this now.

I should point out that /nationality/country of residence/birth is wholly irrelevant in the service we offer.

Mind you, it's not that all French callers do this. It's just that if and when anyone does go the I'm-from route, he or she is invariably French.

It could be a symptom of that outsized sense of self. (Talk about French paradox, haha). But it could also be intended to preemptively clarify their generally less-than-stellar English. Or perhaps it's a cultural thing.

Whatever the reason, it's interesting.







Edit: Bunker
:lol:



Just a subtle way of letting you know, that, if pressed, he has the requisite white flag handy, in order to surrender.
Last edited by sundaymorningstaple on Wed, 24 Sep 2014 10:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: If Singapore is -

Postby Sporkin » Wed, 24 Sep 2014 10:18 am

Rate of change? Lack of identity? Can there be soul without identity? The latent feel of whoring the nation out for economic gains at all cost?

All these are just 'feelings' which may explain why it can get so irrational.

JR8 wrote:such a successful country, why do the people here often seem so dissatisfied, even angry?


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