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HDB dwelling : Heaven or Hell when come to noise pollution?

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jasonlaick
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HDB dwelling : Heaven or Hell when come to noise pollution?

Postby jasonlaick » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 1:53 pm

Hi folks,

Care to share about your HDB dwelling experience with reference to extreme difficult neighbors? Or perhaps solutions as well?

I tried to talk to my neighbor next door, police, HDB, AVA, Town council, CMC unfortunately as most of you know, none really works much.

There are few things I haven't try though such as going through the MP, RC, installing sound proof windows.

I know we should try to be tolerant to one another and talk things out in cordial manner but when you have a neighbor who created more than 5 to 10 nuisances how do you deal with it?

Anyway, my parents are very old, 79 and 84. We been living here for 37 years. They aren't affected as they have serious earing problem (good for them) while my neighbor's birds has been driving me frustrated. Would you mind if I keep 2 whole day making noise (not chirping) right till 11pm? I manage to resolve other issues with him via CMC aka mediation center, if he does not live in peace with me, I will force for peace via my lawyer. I am very lucky he realize I am very serious and all other nuisances stop.

I was too soft hearten. I agreed to let he birds make noise till 9pm (previously his birds could kept shouting for 1 and a half hours from 7 to 930pm and then intermittently till 1115pm. This bird is kinda strange it just won't stop except for few seconds.). My biggest mistake is not to mention that his bird should not kept shouting prior 9pm.

I hope you guys will share your HDB experiences so that it can create a soothing feeling for others who are having difficult experience too.

As for myself, I called HDB and AVA i was surprised that there is no guideline on how many birds a HDB house can keep. I thought it was one. There is no guideline too on when the bird should stop creating noise, i heard from some HDB officers they felt should be 7pm. Anyway I am planning to clear my room (next door to his), so that I could rent it out. If possible I might rent out the utility room too. We still have one masterbed room for my parents. I plan to find a small room perhaps either in Malaysia (and later HK) where I can focus on my investment. I just need wifi and a quite place. I have a malaysian gf and we plan to buy our own (landed) house.

I am sorry if you felt I am too "ultra noise sensitive" but so far among the rest of 20 odds neighbors nearby, he is the only one who is extremely difficult to live with. Even his mum has become so much considerate over the past 4 years and his younger brother is very easy to get along. I have used more than 50% of my energy dealing with him each day.

P/s : if anyone of you have neighbor who played mahjong like I do, from late 2008 to 2013. I would suggest that you write to the police facebook, list out the case. For mine they played daily till wee 5am. They only stop or reduce the noise when I kept calling police. So far I made more than 40 calls over the years. I live directly opposite them and I was thus in a position to see their hand motion. The outcome? One Assistant superintendent of my area called me, and said he will talk to them (nicely), if they do it again he will use a different tone. He is the only police officer I treated with respect and never need to raise my voice. So far over a year plus, he only visited them 4 times. The last time is around this year chinese new year period, to me it's a relapse case. For past 4 months there are 5 instances of mahjong washing but I confirmed 4 or such instances are from the funeral wake at our void deck. Thus, you might wish to facebook police and get an ASP to talk to you.

As far as I am concern, if you can get the problem solved by just 1 police\HDB visit, there is already is a miracle but so far it takes more than that. Noise nuisances could easily last for minimum few months till over years. Don't blame the authorities they have rules to follow and they cannot force the noisy neighbors to stop. If you are a foreigner at least you have the option to move. For me I am very lucky gf wanted me very much to relocate.

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rajagainstthemachine
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Postby rajagainstthemachine » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 2:09 pm

a few things

1. noise isnt good

2. shoot the birds

3. you need to chill

4. you need to use less than 50% of your energy on your neighbour, maybe 1%

5. facebook police only book serial like offenders, you might want to consult with the twitterati

6. try talking to the birds in a calm voice, maybe they will listen to you

P.S do you smoke? thats some really good shit you got there man, pass it around
To get there early is on time and showing up on time is late

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Postby ecureilx » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 2:53 pm

rajagainstthemachine wrote:a few things

1. noise isnt good

2. shoot the birds

3. you need to chill

4. you need to use less than 50% of your energy on your neighbour, maybe 1%

5. facebook police only book serial like offenders, you might want to consult with the twitterati

6. try talking to the birds in a calm voice, maybe they will listen to you

P.S do you smoke? thats some really good shit you got there man, pass it around


love it

btw to OP, do birds listen to noise curfew standards?

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 3:08 pm

jasonlaick wrote:Hi folks,

Care to share about your HDB dwelling experience with reference to extreme difficult neighbors? Or perhaps solutions as well?

I tried to talk to my neighbor next door, police, HDB, AVA, Town council, CMC unfortunately as most of you know, none really works much.

There are few things I haven't try though such as going through the MP, RC, installing sound proof windows.

I know we should try to be tolerant to one another and talk things out in cordial manner but when you have a neighbor who created more than 5 to 10 nuisances how do you deal with it?

Anyway, my parents are very old, 79 and 84. We been living here for 37 years. They aren't affected as they have serious earing problem (good for them) while my neighbor's birds has been driving me frustrated. Would you mind if I keep 2 whole day making noise (not chirping) right till 11pm? I manage to resolve other issues with him via CMC aka mediation center, if he does not live in peace with me, I will force for peace via my lawyer. I am very lucky he realize I am very serious and all other nuisances stop.

I was too soft hearten. I agreed to let he birds make noise till 9pm (previously his birds could kept shouting for 1 and a half hours from 7 to 930pm and then intermittently till 1115pm. This bird is kinda strange it just won't stop except for few seconds.). My biggest mistake is not to mention that his bird should not kept shouting prior 9pm.

I hope you guys will share your HDB experiences so that it can create a soothing feeling for others who are having difficult experience too.

As for myself, I called HDB and AVA i was surprised that there is no guideline on how many birds a HDB house can keep. I thought it was one. There is no guideline too on when the bird should stop creating noise, i heard from some HDB officers they felt should be 7pm. Anyway I am planning to clear my room (next door to his), so that I could rent it out. If possible I might rent out the utility room too. We still have one masterbed room for my parents. I plan to find a small room perhaps either in Malaysia (and later HK) where I can focus on my investment. I just need wifi and a quite place. I have a malaysian gf and we plan to buy our own (landed) house.

I am sorry if you felt I am too "ultra noise sensitive" but so far among the rest of 20 odds neighbors nearby, he is the only one who is extremely difficult to live with. Even his mum has become so much considerate over the past 4 years and his younger brother is very easy to get along. I have used more than 50% of my energy dealing with him each day.

P/s : if anyone of you have neighbor who played mahjong like I do, from late 2008 to 2013. I would suggest that you write to the police facebook, list out the case. For mine they played daily till wee 5am. They only stop or reduce the noise when I kept calling police. So far I made more than 40 calls over the years. I live directly opposite them and I was thus in a position to see their hand motion. The outcome? One Assistant superintendent of my area called me, and said he will talk to them (nicely), if they do it again he will use a different tone. He is the only police officer I treated with respect and never need to raise my voice. So far over a year plus, he only visited them 4 times. The last time is around this year chinese new year period, to me it's a relapse case. For past 4 months there are 5 instances of mahjong washing but I confirmed 4 or such instances are from the funeral wake at our void deck. Thus, you might wish to facebook police and get an ASP to talk to you.

As far as I am concern, if you can get the problem solved by just 1 police\HDB visit, there is already is a miracle but so far it takes more than that. Noise nuisances could easily last for minimum few months till over years. Don't blame the authorities they have rules to follow and they cannot force the noisy neighbors to stop. If you are a foreigner at least you have the option to move. For me I am very lucky gf wanted me very much to relocate.


Jasonlaick,

You sound like YOU are the neighbour from hell, not them. According to the NEA the over 90 db sound must cease & desist after 10 pm, not 7. Therefore had I been the police or NEA I'd would have just ignored you after your 1st visit where you obviously sounded like a whacko with a chip on his shoulder.

With your rant here, I can only imagine how you talked to your neighbours. The police just consider you a Whack Job. They will not do anything except talk to the "so-called" noise makers as the police will not get involved in Civil Disputes. If you want them to take action you must physically hurt one of them or have one of them knock some of your teeth out or knock some sense in. The they will arrest for bodily hurt. This I can vouch for as it's my reason for being a member of the RC in my own HDB estate for over 5 years now. I joined to shut down the Karoke Lounge below me. I couldn't do it via the police for the reason noted, so I eventually got into a fight with a bunch of them (they started it with plenty of outside witnesses) and the police asked me if I wanted to press charges (which I didn't - but told them that it had come to this because of the police who wouldn't do anything even though they were inundated with calls over the noise from the Karaoke Lounge (operated by the RC at that time). So, to get it closed down, I joined the RC and did it from within, closing it for almost 4 years. Now we've started it up again, but the db level is monitored by myself and our RC Secretary who has the adjoining unit to me and we are both on the 2nd floor directly above the RC.

So, what I'm saying is I think you are part and parcel to the problem. You don't seem to follow directions or advice too well either as you surely could see the admonition about advertising when you were typing your rant but yet you were soliciting in your Signature (which I have removed). I've owned my HDB flat for the past 16 years so, yes, I've well aware of the noise levels (we have a neighbour with a Jack Russel and our Chairman has birds as well and lives in the same block (in fact his birdshop is famous all over Singapore). The birds only have to be covered after 10. Of course you have another alternative, buy landed property. Preferably in JB or Batam. Your neighbours will love you for it.
Last edited by sundaymorningstaple on Fri, 13 Jun 2014 8:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby rajagainstthemachine » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 3:18 pm

Image
To get there early is on time and showing up on time is late

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 3:29 pm

Nice and concise, just the way I like it. :wink:

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Postby nakatago » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 3:42 pm

@rajagainstthemachine: you have been on a roll for the past so-and-so months now!

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Re: HDB dwelling : Heaven or Hell when come to noise polluti

Postby ecureilx » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 6:57 pm

jasonlaick wrote:. If possible I might rent out the utility room too.


will this be done with proper HDB approval?

:evil:

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Re: HDB dwelling : Heaven or Hell when come to noise polluti

Postby taxico » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 9:03 pm

jasonlaick wrote:Hi folks,

Care to share about your HDB dwelling experience with reference to extreme difficult neighbors? Or perhaps solutions as well?

I tried to talk to my neighbor next door, police, HDB, AVA, Town council, CMC unfortunately as most of you know, none really works much.

There are few things I haven't try though such as going through the MP, RC, installing sound proof windows.

I know we should try to be tolerant to one another and talk things out in cordial manner but when you have a neighbor who created more than 5 to 10 nuisances how do you deal with it?

Anyway, my parents are very old, 79 and 84. We been living here for 37 years. They aren't affected as they have serious earing problem (good for them) while my neighbor's birds has been driving me frustrated. Would you mind if I keep 2 whole day making noise (not chirping) right till 11pm? I manage to resolve other issues with him via CMC aka mediation center, if he does not live in peace with me, I will force for peace via my lawyer. I am very lucky he realize I am very serious and all other nuisances stop.

I was too soft hearten. I agreed to let he birds make noise till 9pm (previously his birds could kept shouting for 1 and a half hours from 7 to 930pm and then intermittently till 1115pm. This bird is kinda strange it just won't stop except for few seconds.). My biggest mistake is not to mention that his bird should not kept shouting prior 9pm.

I hope you guys will share your HDB experiences so that it can create a soothing feeling for others who are having difficult experience too.

As for myself, I called HDB and AVA i was surprised that there is no guideline on how many birds a HDB house can keep. I thought it was one. There is no guideline too on when the bird should stop creating noise, i heard from some HDB officers they felt should be 7pm. Anyway I am planning to clear my room (next door to his), so that I could rent it out. If possible I might rent out the utility room too. We still have one masterbed room for my parents. I plan to find a small room perhaps either in Malaysia (and later HK) where I can focus on my investment. I just need wifi and a quite place. I have a malaysian gf and we plan to buy our own (landed) house.

I am sorry if you felt I am too "ultra noise sensitive" but so far among the rest of 20 odds neighbors nearby, he is the only one who is extremely difficult to live with. Even his mum has become so much considerate over the past 4 years and his younger brother is very easy to get along. I have used more than 50% of my energy dealing with him each day.

P/s : if anyone of you have neighbor who played mahjong like I do, from late 2008 to 2013. I would suggest that you write to the police facebook, list out the case. For mine they played daily till wee 5am. They only stop or reduce the noise when I kept calling police. So far I made more than 40 calls over the years. I live directly opposite them and I was thus in a position to see their hand motion. The outcome? One Assistant superintendent of my area called me, and said he will talk to them (nicely), if they do it again he will use a different tone. He is the only police officer I treated with respect and never need to raise my voice. So far over a year plus, he only visited them 4 times. The last time is around this year chinese new year period, to me it's a relapse case. For past 4 months there are 5 instances of mahjong washing but I confirmed 4 or such instances are from the funeral wake at our void deck. Thus, you might wish to facebook police and get an ASP to talk to you.

As far as I am concern, if you can get the problem solved by just 1 police\HDB visit, there is already is a miracle but so far it takes more than that. Noise nuisances could easily last for minimum few months till over years. Don't blame the authorities they have rules to follow and they cannot force the noisy neighbors to stop. If you are a foreigner at least you have the option to move. For me I am very lucky gf wanted me very much to relocate.


i'm going to quote this for posterity.
Aut viam ad caelum inveniam aut faciam

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Re: HDB dwelling : Heaven or Hell when come to noise polluti

Postby taxico » Thu, 12 Jun 2014 9:09 pm

jasonlaick wrote:Hi folks,

Care to share about your HDB dwelling experience with reference to extreme difficult neighbors? Or perhaps solutions as well?

I tried to talk to my neighbor next door, police, HDB, AVA, Town council, CMC unfortunately as most of you know, none really works much.

There are few things I haven't try though such as going through the MP, RC...

...If you are a foreigner at least you have the option to move. For me I am very lucky gf wanted me very much to relocate.


so are you a foreigner or singaporean? can't you just move?

if your neighbor isn't flouting any rule or law, then there isn't anything you can do. that's the truth and the short of it.

no one/no organisation can evict him/her nor enforce the relevant housing rules/regulations at the time you wish.

that's the truth. you can move... or pray for divine intervention.

good luck. let us know how your new windows work out. hopefully your neighbors upstairs don't like dragging furniture on the ground at weird hours, because i understand that there is no way to keep that sound out in HDB flats.
Aut viam ad caelum inveniam aut faciam

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Postby zzm9980 » Fri, 13 Jun 2014 1:54 am

I'm curious how one makes birds "be quiet" at arbitrary times. Does the neighbor even have it in his power to quiet them with non-lethal means?

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Postby earthfriendly » Fri, 13 Jun 2014 5:05 am

Reminds me of the complaint by a citizen to have a deer crossing sign be moved to an area with lighter traffic. As the deer crossing are causing the traffic to have to stop for them :mrgreen: .

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 13 Jun 2014 6:51 am

zzm9980 wrote:I'm curious how one makes birds "be quiet" at arbitrary times. Does the neighbor even have it in his power to quiet them with non-lethal means?


Put a cloth cover over the cage, thus creating "twilight" for them. The birds will calm down and be quiet.

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Postby x9200 » Fri, 13 Jun 2014 7:02 am

zzm9980 wrote:I'm curious how one makes birds "be quiet" at arbitrary times. Does the neighbor even have it in his power to quiet them with non-lethal means?

Put them into dark place (i.e. cover the cage with a light tight fabric).

I think you should give a little bit credit to the OP. Just imagine having a few cages with birds as noisy as Mynas close to you windows/door. I think the OP developed this ultra-sensitivity in the process so he is now simply frustrated and overreacting.

I once had very noisy neighbors living upstairs and it was hell. Soon I reacted almost to any noise. It took me like 3 years to recover.

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Postby zzm9980 » Fri, 13 Jun 2014 7:03 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:
zzm9980 wrote:I'm curious how one makes birds "be quiet" at arbitrary times. Does the neighbor even have it in his power to quiet them with non-lethal means?


Put a cloth cover over the cage, thus creating "twilight" for them. The birds will calm down and be quiet.


Ok, never knew this. I guess it is semi-reasonable then expect neighbors to shut a bird up at some point. I assumed they just slept when they felt like it.


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