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Owing money to bank as guarantor - implications?

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nouveaulife
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Owing money to bank as guarantor - implications?

Postby nouveaulife » Wed, 15 Aug 2012 12:15 am

Hi,

I chanced upon a thread here about a lady from Malaysia who was banned from entering Singapore on account of $50 dollars. This got me worried a bit. My situation involves something like more than $4000, though it is not a criminal case.

I was studying in SG on Student Pass for 3 years during which time I acted as a guarantor for a PhD student from Africa who applied for a tuition fee loan from DBS.

He received financial assistance after the 1 year. So the loan turned out to be for the 1st year only.

He graduated in 09 and returned to Africa. And he apparently decided to default on the loan! I have received numerous letters now, first from the bank and then the collection agency, asking him to pay the loan.

I emailed him twice to ask him to please pay his loan but he just ignored me. And there is nothing I can do.

The loan now stands at more than $4000, with penalties and interests.

So the bank is now after me. Technically, I am also a debtor for the purposes of this loan, according to its terms and conditions. To remove any doubt, I do not otherwise owe any money to DBS myself.

I have tentatively received a job offer from Singapore. I don't know which Pass they will apply for me. But do you think that DBS might report loan defaulters to ICA, and if so, would they reject pass applications on the ground of student loan default?

Thank you!

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Postby Mad Scientist » Wed, 15 Aug 2012 2:34 am

I do not think so.
You acted as a guarantor in good faith and your buddy scoot back to Africa. That is some friend you've got.
First and foremost there are two part on your issues

1. Debt
You acted as guarantor hence you are liable to the bank. Yes, it will incur penalties and even that collected by the debt collector.
If you are overseas they may engage overseas debt collector but it is highly unlike for this amount
However your name will be blacklisted into the credit rating agency. If you do get a job here you may not be able to apply for CC nor open a bank account.

2. Your EP apply application has ho relation to your Debt. ICA will not report this. You are considered as third party liabilities. The police and the bank will have your name as blacklist. It is up to their own discretion on the severity but by the going rate that is about it
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Postby nouveaulife » Wed, 15 Aug 2012 2:03 pm

Thank you for the reply. I wanted to ask further about the two issues that you raised.

1.Debt

At this point I do not know if I have been blacklisted in any way. The earliest letter that I have in relation to his failure of payment is dated March 2011.

But if I were blacklisted, and if that means I won't be able to open an account in Singapore, that sounds VERY serious considering that I will very likely go back there to work, soon. And to do everything in cash is absolutely unthinkable and unfeasible!

So in relation to this debt issue, may I ask two further questions:

1.1. The scope of the "blacklisting"

Would owing debt to DBS prohibit me from being able to open an account in ANY bank in Singapore? What if I try to open an account with OCBC, for example?

1.2. Removal from the "blacklist"

Would I be removed from the "blacklist" (if were I already on it) by paying the loan to DBS either now or later, thereby expunging any negative reporting/record associated with my name, hence making it possible for me to open an account in Singapore (either with DBS or any other bank)?

Or is it too late at this point to remedy the situation such that I will not be able to make use of any banking facility (opening an account, etc) in Singapore on a permanent basis?

I have not been able to settle this debt (his debt that is!!!) at this point because I have been studying full-time all my life till this May. So I have not worked full-time yet.

But what is your suggestion? No doubt, if I do end up going to Singapore to work, not having a bank account there is NOT an option!

2. EP/ICA

So thanks for clarifying that personal debt will not affect EP application. But you mentioned that I may also be blacklisted with the police - that sounds very alarming. If it were true, what are the actual consequences when I am physically in Singapore? At any rate, this would not in any way be on the same footing as a criminal record with the police, right?

Secondly, to remove any doubt, I assume ICA will NOT know ANYTHING about this debt, and therefore the immigration officers in Changi will not refuse me entry into Singapore on this account, right?

(My plan right now is to resolve this debt after I arrive in Singapore and work for some time. Why, I have little savings at this point! But I want to make sure that my entry into Singapore and my authorization to work there will not be affected precisely because of this unresolved debt.)

Thank you!

Apologies if my concerns sound silly. But Singapore being the strict country it is, I can't help being a little paranoid.



Mad Scientist wrote:I do not think so.
You acted as a guarantor in good faith and your buddy scoot back to Africa. That is some friend you've got.
First and foremost there are two part on your issues

1. Debt
You acted as guarantor hence you are liable to the bank. Yes, it will incur penalties and even that collected by the debt collector.
If you are overseas they may engage overseas debt collector but it is highly unlike for this amount
However your name will be blacklisted into the credit rating agency. If you do get a job here you may not be able to apply for CC nor open a bank account.

2. Your EP apply application has ho relation to your Debt. ICA will not report this. You are considered as third party liabilities. The police and the bank will have your name as blacklist. It is up to their own discretion on the severity but by the going rate that is about it

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Postby nutnut » Wed, 15 Aug 2012 2:43 pm

You never know, if you arrive in Singapore and open an account with DBS they may be quite happy as they will be able to see the money coming in and available for payment of debt!

Maybe call DBS and explain (I am sure you've done this already) the longer you ignore it the worse it will get!
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Postby Mad Scientist » Wed, 15 Aug 2012 3:52 pm

[quote="nouveaulife"]
So in relation to this debt issue, may I ask two further questions:

1.1. The scope of the "blacklisting"

Would owing debt to DBS prohibit me from being able to open an account in ANY bank in Singapore? What if I try to open an account with OCBC, for example?

You have to remember only when the bank submit an injunction to the court then you will be blacklisted and the Credit Rating Agency takes over. Till then you are not. Yes banks do share infos

1.2. Removal from the "blacklist"

Would I be removed from the "blacklist" (if were I already on it) by paying the loan to DBS either now or later, thereby expunging any negative reporting/record associated with my name, hence making it possible for me to open an account in Singapore (either with DBS or any other bank)?

As per my above reply. However once you are under chap 11 then your name will always be there. You can open an account but you cannot hold any CC or any debt related instrument

Or is it too late at this point to remedy the situation such that I will not be able to make use of any banking facility (opening an account, etc) in Singapore on a permanent basis?

Get the B*stard to pay up or you pay for him. No it is not too late. From the onset I have told you that you are guarantor hence a third party liabilities


I have not been able to settle this debt (his debt that is!!!) at this point because I have been studying full-time all my life till this May. So I have not worked full-time yet.

But what is your suggestion? No doubt, if I do end up going to Singapore to work, not having a bank account there is NOT an option!

2. EP/ICA

So thanks for clarifying that personal debt will not affect EP application. But you mentioned that I may also be blacklisted with the police - that sounds very alarming. If it were true, what are the actual consequences when I am physically in Singapore? At any rate, this would not in any way be on the same footing as a criminal record with the police, right?

It only kicks in if you are summoned to be under chap 11

Secondly, to remove any doubt, I assume ICA will NOT know ANYTHING about this debt, and therefore the immigration officers in Changi will not refuse me entry into Singapore on this account, right?

yes


(My plan right now is to resolve this debt after I arrive in Singapore and work for some time. Why, I have little savings at this point! But I want to make sure that my entry into Singapore and my authorization to work there will not be affected precisely because of this unresolved debt.)

Thank you!

Apologies if my concerns sound silly. But Singapore being the strict country it is, I can't help being a little paranoid.
The positive thinker sees the invisible, feels the intangible, and achieves the impossible.Yahoo !!!

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Postby nouveaulife » Fri, 17 Aug 2012 4:39 pm

Thank you! I will try to resolve this as soon as is possible. It is a pity that the Borrower has turned out to be such a dishonorable person! He is just ignoring my emails.

(PS: I was initially confused about which authority is responsible for employment and s pass applications. I thought it was ICA, as evident from my reference to it when I was expressing my apprehensions over possible future pass applications. But now I have realized that it is MOM that is responsible for it.).

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Postby vishalgupta2 » Fri, 17 Aug 2012 10:34 pm

I feel really bad about what happened to you.

I hope you don't mind, but, I can't stop myself from saying that you may want to set some blame on yourself for failing to analyze the person well before becoming a co-signor for wrong person. I am sure you are already more diligent about things like this.

One bad person makes it difficult for 100s of good people to gain trust.

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Postby JayCee » Sat, 18 Aug 2012 11:10 am

It's bad what happened, but it's got to be the height of naivety (or dumbness, depending on how you look at it) to lend money to someone from Africa, and then think they'll pay you back after they've left. Do you reply to emails from sons of recently deceased West African presidents too? :roll:
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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 18 Aug 2012 11:43 am

JayCee, I'm glad you said that! I've deleted similar at least 6 times since this thread started and always deleted it. Sounds like 419er territory to me as well.

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Re: Owing money to bank as guarantor - implications?

Postby Adzthedemaon » Sun, 26 Mar 2017 2:13 pm

Hello,

I am in a similar situation and my so called friend fled to his country without informing me. And now I cannot reach him. Bank has sent me a notice to repay a huge amount. Please help. Any advice would be helpful to get out of this mess.

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Re: Owing money to bank as guarantor - implications?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 26 Mar 2017 7:06 pm

Hopefully you wrote this post after passing through immigration at Changi and are now out of the country.

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Re: Owing money to bank as guarantor - implications?

Postby PNGMK » Mon, 27 Mar 2017 8:32 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Hopefully you wrote this post after passing through immigration at Changi and are now out of the country.

Oh come on SMS.... the only concern he would have is if his friend was a bankrupt and/or OP was as well. His friend will find life very miserable (and he will too) - the banks will not let up trying to find them and the debt will be sold on to debt collectors eventually who will not let up. My ex tenant eventually settled all his debts after a few years because of the relentless pressure.
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Re: Owing money to bank as guarantor - implications?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 27 Mar 2017 8:58 am

I've had HBP for quite a few years. You are having some problems with it now. We don't know about the OP, but I guarantee their tactics here will certainly NOT help one's BP!

While my post was certainly
Image

Depending on the size of the loan, it could be iffy. 8-[

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Re: Owing money to bank as guarantor - implications?

Postby PNGMK » Mon, 27 Mar 2017 9:34 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:I've had HBP for quite a few years. You are having some problems with it now. We don't know about the OP, but I guarantee their tactics here will certainly NOT help one's BP!

While my post was certainly
Image

Depending on the size of the loan, it could be iffy. 8-[



Oh it's not fun I agree. The lesson here is do not be a guarantor except perhaps to your spouse or kids.
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Re: Owing money to bank as guarantor - implications?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 27 Mar 2017 9:55 am

AND definitely NOT extended family!


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