Filial Piety Revisited

[ksl]

reading some Anne's responses do you really think this is the case and she just tries to be witty/funny?

SMS and I have both noted that we didn't find her original comments antagonistic, but some responses to her were aggressive, at which point she retaliated and it all went downhill. At this point it's all mudslinging. One side needs to stop, and then the other side will as well. It just depends who is the bigger person.

This is very true!

[x9200]

Ok, got it. I think I had one beer too many yesterday and not thinking that clearly now. I understood the ksl post just the other way around. For such configuration I agree, it could be the case but still found it a bit too easy to turn the discussion personal just because somebody was sarcastic.

[Eau2011]

I do not really think this is a case of misperception and communication problems (from one point on at least). It is also hard not to classify it as insults but I rather see it as some kind of act of desperation for someone who do not know how to handle simplest discussion disagreements. Personally I would not get offended but then I also could not take it all too seriously. It disqualifies someone as a partner in such discussions even if the person is a pure sweetness when it comes to face to face interactions.

Ok, got it. I think I had one beer too many yesterday and not thinking that clearly now. I understood the ksl post just the other way around. For such configuration I agree, it could be the case but still found it a bit too easy to turn the discussion personal just because somebody was sarcastic.

No worry, I shall get enough evidences (in other posts) to see how it went like today (OP in an isolated position). OP's own fault to leave many bad taste.

I have 5 PM's from different people in my inbox, all said she is rude, does not know how to handle simplest disagreements , they are fed up of her, they just ignore her now. The OP just does not know how people think about her.

[Eau2011]

KSL, I know perfectly what you mean. I used to have these kind of problems with my wife and she is the same nationality/culture as myself but reading some Anne's responses do you really think this is the case and she just tries to be witty/funny?

No Anne is quite serious and feels insulted, though JR8 and the rest are just being funny, and she's biting back, I mean there is a bigger picture with China and you must see the bigger picture and accept the errors, not live in denial.

I could not say it better myself.

Though subconsciously or consciously there could be a political motive too, more of a socialistic one, as I too quite often dream, of a societies and take on their burdens only to find out that most are two faced, though only field experience will prove this.

In mainland China, even children were reporting their parents, if they mentioned anything negative about the communist party. So over time these people learn to deceive everyone including the tourist.

It is a survival instinct in such an oppressive society, not to talk badly about the regime, unless you are out in the open and away from others.
My dad always said to me: we can discuss at home about negative things, but please do us a favour not to tell it publicly. Our family does not want to get troubles anymore.

Naturally Chinese are Chinese and will defend their heritage, the same as another person, but before you defend your heritage, you must have an idea where you come from to get the bigger picture.

So I see a discussion of one in denial and defensive and the others just getting frustrated.

How I would with my wife, if I couldn't get her to see sense. Some people are just too stubborn for their own good, my wife told me that sometimes she doesn't like herself because she cannot take positive criticism, I know when to leave her alone
I like your wife, at least she knows it. I was like that before. I didn't want people criticise my country, and I didn't take criticism wether negative or positive. But I changed after I met my husband, I learnt to see it objectively, I might be still idealistic, but at least, I know if I'm proved to be wrong, I will admit it, if I did something wrong, I will say sorry sincerely.


Anne like my wife, needs to look more closely inside herself, to discover why she cannot listen to what is being said though the wise cracks did come from the others with Anne retaliating.

ksl, I shall tell you my story.
11 years ago I felt so bad as I listened to my MIL critising CCP about Tiananmen incident. I thought that they were also China-hater. I did not like foreigners to criticise China. But, I had to see the reality, yes it happenend, and I don't need to protect it (China as a country did not do it, it's the party which did it), I should not be ashamed of it, it's not my fault.

After that, I started to think about how I become objective when facing people talking about human rights, dictatorship, violating of IP etc... I was often asked by my colleagues if Chinese eat dogs so on. I had to tell them it's true though I myself never had eaten any.

Yes all these exist, I have to accept how they are. One cannot brand anybody as China-hater because he/she critised something about China. I also critised USA or Iran sometimes, it doesn't mean I'm US-hater or Iran-hater, right?

The only thing we can do is to admit it and try to change it/make it change and make it better.

But sadly I still have friends who live in denial and cannot accept Westeners' critism about China.

[x9200]

No worry, I shall get enough evidences (in other posts) to see how it went like today (OP in an isolated position). OP's own fault to leave many bad taste.

I have 5 PM's from different people in my inbox, all said she is rude, does not know how to handle simplest disagreements , they are fed up of her, they just ignore her now. The OP just does not know how people think about her.

Her responses are often rude and vastly exaggerated but what WIMH, SMS and KSL are saying (if I read it correctly) this is not her who started this. She is overreacting not that this is of any justification IMHO but for this basic fact it is probably not an unprovoked behaviour.

[Wind In My Hair]

I have 5 PM's from different people in my inbox, all said she is rude, does not know how to handle simplest disagreements , they are fed up of her, they just ignore her now. The OP just does not know how people think about her.

If you are counting me as one of the five, I would like to state for the record that when you, not me, initiated the private correspondence and raised the topic of Anne, this was my verbatim reply:

"I just felt sorry for Anne. Yes she is long-winded and difficult to understand, and she was very rude to you and others, and she deserves a lot of the treatment she gets. But I also think she is unfairly treated in some ways.

She became worse and worse when more and more people became rude to her. It's a vicious cycle and very sad to watch."

This is getting very ugly. Anne is no saint, but what she has done is nothing compared to what I see some of you doing. There seems to be a campaign to ostracise Anne, and I don't like it at all. There are enough sensible heads in this forum to put an end to this stampede, and I hope good sense and human compassion will prevail.

[Eau2011]

I have 5 PM's from different people in my inbox, all said she is rude, does not know how to handle simplest disagreements , they are fed up of her, they just ignore her now. The OP just does not know how people think about her.

If you are counting me as one of the five, I would like to state for the record that when you, not me, initiated the private correspondence and raised the topic of Anne, this was my verbatim reply:

"I just felt sorry for Anne. Yes she is long-winded and difficult to understand, and she was very rude to you and others, and she deserves a lot of the treatment she gets. But I also think she is unfairly treated in some ways.

She became worse and worse when more and more people became rude to her. It's a vicious cycle and very sad to watch."

This is getting very ugly. Anne is no saint, but what she has done is nothing compared to what I see some of you doing. There seems to be a campaign to ostracise Anne, and I don't like it at all. There are enough sensible heads in this forum to put an end to this stampede, and I hope good sense and human compassion will prevail.

You are not counted in this 5.

The problem is we ALL should behave. As I said in my post, that I realized what I did it wrong, then she also has to look more closely inside herself why she's got problem with different persons.

The reason why I raised the topic is to say sorry if my posts disturbed you and told you the reasons behind, then I mentioned the OP.

If she still insists her style of debating, I'm afraid it will not become better. There will be still conflicts in future even I don't come here anymore.

[ev-disinfection]

I have not posted on this topic much, and have been reading all from the sidelines, I feel the same way WIMH feels, that there are some people here, that are taking this too personally, with personal attacks on Anne, let us agree to disagree, everyone here have different backgrounds and status, and if we all meet face to face, we will better understand each other. Peace.

Ok, got it. I think I had one beer too many yesterday and not thinking that clearly now.

Were you watching the Liverpool - Man U match last night? I was with 5 of my mates at Wala, watching too. Great to see the REDS win.

[x9200]

We should freeze this thread.

[x9200]

Ok, got it. I think I had one beer too many yesterday and not thinking that clearly now.

Were you watching the Liverpool - Man U match last night? I was with 5 of my mates at Wala, watching too. Great to see the REDS win.

I was watching Katie Melua on tv Our national football team efficiently made me immune to this kind of entertainment so I prefer to watch someone who actually can play

[ev-disinfection]

Ok, got it. I think I had one beer too many yesterday and not thinking that clearly now.

Were you watching the Liverpool - Man U match last night? I was with 5 of my mates at Wala, watching too. Great to see the REDS win.

I was watching Katie Melua on tv Our national football team efficiently made me immune to this kind of entertainment so I prefer to watch someone who actually can play

Whew, thought that you are a Man U fan, and wanted to freeze this topic....

[x9200]

Whew, thought that you are a Man U fan, and wanted to freeze this topic....

Yeah, but the other topic. It gets really ugly. We should let it cool down.

[Eau2011]

What I hope is a friendly atmosphere which I saw the first 3 weeks when I came here. It was fun. It turned to be terrible, I saw just enough ugly words and conflicts, and I was also agressive (which I should not be).

If one doesn't want to know why it became like this and just critized those who pointed it out, then what should I say?

[x9200]

It think it is pretty clear why it become like this: too much emotions, misunderstanding and taking various comments too personally. It happened before it will happen again. Scratching wounds and proving more or less subjective points will not do at this stage any good. This is valid for both sides. The best thing is to let it rests. IMHO of course.

[sundaymorningstaple]

The best thing you can say is nothing. Don't say anything at all. By the way, the moderators have their own forum here as well, just not visible to normal members. Just thought you should be aware of that when sending PM's.