FDW called MOM and complaint

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the observer
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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by the observer » Tue, 23 Nov 2021 8:40 am

Here’s a sweeping damning statement, to piss off the other carmakers.

Japanese cars are generally more reliable.

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by tiktok » Tue, 23 Nov 2021 1:51 pm

Just to play devils advocate, it's equally stupid to assume everyone is the same no matter what country they come from. All things being equal, someone from a country with many societal and economic problems is more likely to have "issues" than someone that does not. Humans are confoundingly complex however, so such assumptions don't go far in real life relationships, but nonetheless should not be ignored.
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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by Myasis Dragon » Wed, 24 Nov 2021 3:08 am

the observer wrote:
Tue, 23 Nov 2021 8:15 am
Generalization works to a certain degree is what I said.
No! Generalization does NOT work to a "certain degree". Upon which specific individual are you going to heap your generalizations?

Sounds like you are heaping generalizations on Indo maids with your statement, "Indonesian “fdws” on the other hand are mostly not," with reference to supposed educational levels.

Is the Indo maid that you are speaking to right now fall into your generalizations or outside of them? When looking at a Filipino maid and an Indo maid, do you ignore the Indo maid because of your generalizations... just because she's Indo? And when you know nothing else about her?

That sir, is bigotry.

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by sp786 » Thu, 25 Nov 2021 12:20 am

This is strange. 1 year back I had complained to MoM against my then FDW for moonlighting with some evidence. They took 4-5 months to revert with an email asking her to come to MoM office by when we already told her to go back to home country and even gotten her air ticket. The person who actually utilized her services lives in the same block and i presume no action was taken against her because she now has a FDW in her home while in theory for moonlighting the illegal deployer would be barred from having one. Probably its a case of me who myself is an EP holder complaining against a PR and FDW! lol
.
On the overwork this is a grey area that most FDW misuse. You probably may want to include usual and even ad hoc scope of work in your contract with the FDW so that she doesn't dispute it later.

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by PNGMK » Thu, 25 Nov 2021 9:12 am

sp786 wrote:
Thu, 25 Nov 2021 12:20 am
This is strange. 1 year back I had complained to MoM against my then FDW for moonlighting with some evidence. They took 4-5 months to revert with an email asking her to come to MoM office by when we already told her to go back to home country and even gotten her air ticket. The person who actually utilized her services lives in the same block and i presume no action was taken against her because she now has a FDW in her home while in theory for moonlighting the illegal deployer would be barred from having one. Probably its a case of me who myself is an EP holder complaining against a PR and FDW! lol
.
On the overwork this is a grey area that most FDW misuse. You probably may want to include usual and even ad hoc scope of work in your contract with the FDW so that she doesn't dispute it later.
1. IS the above legal?
2. IF so, that is a good suggestion but I would add that it probably needs a caveat "Ad Hoc tasks may be assigned to you to be completed in a timely manner, no tasks that are illegal should be performed by the FDW".
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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by sp786 » Thu, 25 Nov 2021 9:57 am

PNGMK wrote:
Thu, 25 Nov 2021 9:12 am
sp786 wrote:
Thu, 25 Nov 2021 12:20 am
This is strange. 1 year back I had complained to MoM against my then FDW for moonlighting with some evidence. They took 4-5 months to revert with an email asking her to come to MoM office by when we already told her to go back to home country and even gotten her air ticket. The person who actually utilized her services lives in the same block and i presume no action was taken against her because she now has a FDW in her home while in theory for moonlighting the illegal deployer would be barred from having one. Probably its a case of me who myself is an EP holder complaining against a PR and FDW! lol
.
On the overwork this is a grey area that most FDW misuse. You probably may want to include usual and even ad hoc scope of work in your contract with the FDW so that she doesn't dispute it later.
1. IS the above legal?
2. IF so, that is a good suggestion but I would add that it probably needs a caveat "Ad Hoc tasks may be assigned to you to be completed in a timely manner, no tasks that are illegal should be performed by the FDW".
I mean only legal ad hoc work. For example some FDWs dispute adhoc tasks assigned to them within the household and not something like facilitating a business

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by PNGMK » Thu, 25 Nov 2021 9:59 am

I think it's an excellent idea.
I not lawyer/teacher/CPA.
You've been arrested? Law Society of Singapore can provide referrals.
You want an International School job? School website or http://www.ISS.edu
Your rugrat needs a School? Avoid for profit schools
You need Tax advice? Ask a CPA
You ran away without doing NS? Shame on you!

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by x9200 » Thu, 25 Nov 2021 12:32 pm

the observer wrote:
Tue, 23 Nov 2021 8:40 am
Here’s a sweeping damning statement, to piss off the other carmakers.

Japanese cars are generally more reliable.
What you mean is, there are statistically justifiable claims on "properties/behaviors/attributes" that may help to screen and trim down variety of choices. Yes, there are, but we should avoid doing it towards people. There is rather large fraction in the same human population happy to interpret such generalizations the way they want and discriminate other people based on this.

Besides, a reasonable person will probably deal with a few hired FDW only in her or his lifetime so if you say, for example, Pinays are more rebellious than Indonesians (no idea if this is any true), this would be completely useless in any practical sense and for any attempt to judge on the individual levels - I am very sure, if there is any difference in that respect between any nation, it is not that significant to grant you good probability to stick a label to someone's forehead if you deal with a few FDW only.

Hiring a FDW is also obviously two way process. Maybe the person you hired has certain attributes and they are more common in her nation, but maybe they are not that common, but this is you how tends to pick-up persons with this certain attribute?

Compare, Pinays in general speak much better Tagalog than Indonesians so if you want to hire a FDW speaking Tagalog, better focus on the Pinays. Here, you have at least good chance to have the generalization to work but if this comes to more subtle differences than IMHO there will be more harm than any profits.

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by Lisafuller » Fri, 26 Nov 2021 1:49 am

PNGMK wrote:
Mon, 22 Nov 2021 10:23 am
You will not be permitted to hire a new FDW if this continues. You may face charges in court. You certainly will have MOM keeping an eye on you. I have some sympathy to you however (having had to re-read your posts a few times). I suggest you immediately transfer this current FDW to another employer or repatriate her. You are in a situation that will only get worse. I would then carefully consider if you should hire another FDW. In your case I would only do it if your wife and you work through the MOM approved courses for FDW employers and fully understand your obligations.
Exactly. At this point keeping the same helper hardly seems like an option. Even if there’s no technical obstacle, relative are bound to sour.

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by Lisafuller » Fri, 26 Nov 2021 1:54 am

Northstar82 wrote:
Mon, 22 Nov 2021 3:45 am
Myasis Dragon wrote:
Mon, 22 Nov 2021 2:56 am
You are guilty of maid abuse.
  1. Why didn't you give her a bank account. You are not permitting her to manage her own financial affairs, and MoM specifically requires that maids have control over their own finances.
  2. Why do you cut off internet? She is an adult and can make her own decisions about what she does in the evening.
  3. You have struck your maid. This is physical abuse. There is NO EXCUSE for ever striking your maid.

There are many other examples in your post. Your maid should have called MoM to report your abusive behavior. And you are deserving of whatever punishment you get.
What are your talking about ? With due respect r u reading something else or interpreting some aliens language ???

1 . No one struck her , don’t know where did u read that .
2. Bank account is personal , how can I give ? Branches were closed during circuit breaker just before she joined and online opening was not accepting fdw acc opening , I filled form at that time as well which came back asking address proof ( wp card was not in the list of address proof and that the only doc she have for her address in singapore ), mobile number ownership proof ( she had prepaid no such provision ) , she got salary every month end dot day n time n not a single penny remain with me .. she told this to mom that no finance issue ever happen n she is happy , she manages her financial herself . I Time to time educating her as well on savings , small investment , keeping for rainy day , better remittance rate portal , i even took her and open her SingPass account so she can leverage other singapore gov portals . Don’t confuse managing finances is bank account . Even if that was also assisted , she even got message from bank for additional info which she never read for 7-8 month ( I keep asking if she for any but she was not aware , she was checking whatsapp mesaganer , did nt know sms was the platform )

2. It’s not evening, it 11:30 pm ( mid night of sg ) and giving wifi is not a necessary thing ( u go read rules again ) , I am responsible for giving her rest ,and house rule was discussed with all house member then applied , if she would have told that she want exception for her that also would be considered ,
still being an adult she can use her 4g as required , for all other situation she have access to our house common phone 24/7 even isd calls which she herself taking n using ( I gave her blanket approval to use house phone for isd calls n save her money )

She have access to our house keys for all the room n door , many a time she went out at night till 2 am as well , roaming in condo while calling her frnds , I did nt had any concern ever apart from her well being and rest .

First of all , remove the judgemantal gown and focus on intent of this post , I need advice not a opinion in her n me ( she and me n family are good and gelling together ) .
There must have been a way to get her an account. Saying branches were closed us a cop out.

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by Lisafuller » Fri, 26 Nov 2021 1:56 am

Myasis Dragon wrote:
Wed, 24 Nov 2021 3:08 am
the observer wrote:
Tue, 23 Nov 2021 8:15 am
Generalization works to a certain degree is what I said.
No! Generalization does NOT work to a "certain degree". Upon which specific individual are you going to heap your generalizations?

Sounds like you are heaping generalizations on Indo maids with your statement, "Indonesian “fdws” on the other hand are mostly not," with reference to supposed educational levels.

Is the Indo maid that you are speaking to right now fall into your generalizations or outside of them? When looking at a Filipino maid and an Indo maid, do you ignore the Indo maid because of your generalizations... just because she's Indo? And when you know nothing else about her?

That sir, is bigotry.
Exactly. generalizations are generalizations, there’s no way aid that. I personally think there’s no way to generalize here, obviously it’s reasonable to suggest there may be some cultural differences, but beyond that I doubt there’s anything distinguishable.

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by Lisafuller » Fri, 26 Nov 2021 1:59 am

Northstar82 wrote:
Sun, 21 Nov 2021 2:25 am
Need guidance
My FDW called MOM and complaint for not giving her bank account ( however salary been paid timely and all necessary support if she want remit ) with the call she exaggerated over work( to get her hrd more ) , no wifi access ( exaggerated again as I intentionally paused wife after 11:30 for everyone body including myself n spouse and told her it’s for everyone body betterment to get timely rest ) ,medical problems ( she thought it’s SG gov or Our ownership and insurance covers all , though not told to us before , this also she may told as specifically asked by MOM Perosn ).
This call she did outside our home after a argument and shouting insane also provoking me n spouse to hit her while advancing on us yelling “hit me , u want hit me hit me , dare u ( obviously on her language )”
Then she left home saying want to call home , we let her as talking her at that moment was like whole apartment will hear and she can do any tantrum .

Once she was back we politely ask her to sit besides and 1 by 1 ask all problem ( she did nt told she had complaint ) and explain all problems , medical assurance as she told feeling stomach pain , work optimisation techniques ( though all normal routine of 6-9 then 12-3 and then 5:30 to 10 , in between she took enough read , calling frnds , bank account and all other problems resolution I assured , she calm down ..

Later same week I took off from office and get her account open on branch , her prepaid phone number was not accepted , I gave application to telco on her behalf to get proof of ownership and next week that too submitted to bank ( another time off from office )

Now the twist .. after 3 weeks MOM called me that they want FDW to visit and interview , when I asked to her she revealed that she had called on that day .

Any way my wife took her to MOM for interview , all done m they back home , she told mom that all issue resolved but also told exaggeration of her work , that she is assisting my wife in her office work by dropping posts to post box near to our house ( 3 times week , quite eggagerates since it was 2 times a month ) and passing stuff to people on mrt ( 1 or 2 such case whiel she was going to ntuc or leave) .

All fine at that time , now after 3 month of that incidence , MOM investigation officer called as this is the case of illegal deployment , non domestic work , officer took both me n my wife statement , my wife honestly told it all happen last year during pendamic when we try to be at home and minimal movement of household members n hence either my wife or FDw was going for grocery n when she used to go my wife used to give her errand if any since post box , mrt , ntuc are all adjacent , unintentionally n unknowingly it carried away after circuit breaker but was never forced and most of time she volunteer n asked herself if any post to drop ( she like to go out n trying pretext to ask her )
Later when I realise ( end of 2020 ) I only ask strongly that her help not required for any such office work and no such.

Investigating officer wrote out statements( individually ) in form ( thought they were not discriptive with all details as my wife explains as office said it’s not related with case ) and get our sign .

Now I am worried what will be the implications , is there be any criminal case , prosecution etc ?
Should we go for some legal counselling ?
Lawyer up. Although I must say, you’ve kind of dug yourself into this hole. It is your responsibility as an employer to understand the legal parameters of her duties.

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Re: FDW called MOM and complaint

Post by Lisafuller » Fri, 26 Nov 2021 2:00 am

Myasis Dragon wrote:
Mon, 22 Nov 2021 2:56 am
You are guilty of maid abuse.
  1. Why didn't you give her a bank account. You are not permitting her to manage her own financial affairs, and MoM specifically requires that maids have control over their own finances.
  2. Why do you cut off internet? She is an adult and can make her own decisions about what she does in the evening.
  3. You have struck your maid. This is physical abuse. There is NO EXCUSE for ever striking your maid.

There are many other examples in your post. Your maid should have called MoM to report your abusive behavior. And you are deserving of whatever punishment you get.
I don’t think she was ever hit. Physical abuse is an absolute no, I think OP just mentioned that she was taunting them to hit her.

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